its not "magic". http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trigger_point
much like old herbal remedies its a grain of truth shrouded by legend.
In a June 2000 review, Chang-Zern Hong correlates the MTrP "tender points" to acupunctural "ah shi" ("Oh Yes!") points, and the "local twitch response" to acupuncture's "de qi" ("needle sensation"),[13] based on a 1977 paper by Melzack et al.[14] Peter Dorsher comments on a strong correlation between the locations of trigger points and classical acupuncture points, finding that 92% of the 255 trigger points correspond to acupuncture points, including 79.5% with similar pain indications.[15][16]
Last edited by starlord; 2013-01-28 at 12:35 AM.
It shows promise. It shows that a practice in which the positive anecdotal evidence overwhelmingly favors pain relief rather than the other claims of things like appetite, libido etc etc might very well have a base in science.
There is no alternative medicine. There is medicine that works and shit that doesn't work. Even then i would hesitate to call acupuncture a form of medicine should the consensus be reached that it does indeed work that way as there is no administering of medicine - merely the manipulation of the body's own mechanisms.
Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
When you say randomly. Do you mean sticking someone in the foot to relieve back pain - or do you mean sticking someone in the back but not the supposed "magic spot"? And still - acupuncture still means "needle puncture". So regardless of intent - sticking someone with a needle can be defined as acupuncture.
I don't think you'd get most practitioners of acupuncture to admit that what they're doing is nothing more than jamming people with needles and gaining marginal reduction in pain perception as a result of triggering endorphins. That is, of course, the only plausible use for it though.
not quite. "dry needling", which is very similar to acupuncture, has proven to be effective at reducing pain by stimulating knots of muscles and nerves that form in certain areas of the body and cause pain. (they happen to coincide with certain acupuncture points as well).
http://www.jabfm.org/content/23/5/640.full
so, the principle is sound. however other stimulation works as well or better.
Last edited by starlord; 2013-01-28 at 02:42 AM.
I don't understand your desire to separate them. The foundations of chiropractic and acupuncture are just as untenable as homeopathy. They're based entirely upon principles that are simply wrong. I can understand how, historically, the underlying ideas might have seemed plausible in the past before our scientific and medical understanding evolved and improved, much like the search for phlogiston or any number of similar wild goose chases. But centuries of scientific investigation have helped us hone and employ modern, empirical processes by which we should abide. We're long overdue for abandoning primitive superstitions.
But in the case of acupuncture, we have... and no conclusive benefit has been established beyond a placebo effect. Where does this end, anyway? Should we conduct clinical trials to investigate bloodletting or trepanning just because they were widely practiced for a certain amount of time? I think unduly giving credence to archaic practices is wishful thinking.
Perhaps -- if you could provide both a mechanism as well as a course of treatment which provides unequivocally positive results. This is where pseudoscience in general, including acupuncture, fails (let me emphasize the second section there). Besides, you're talking about a hypothetical regimen to treat a specific set of illnesses, whereas acupuncture is conjured up to "treat" everything from arthritis to sexual dysfunction; it's the equivalent of throwing shit at a wall hoping some of it will stick.
---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 08:53 PM ----------
I used the term "magic" in that post following Cattaclysmic's reference to it. Pick any term you like, but this is what it boils down to (and please note the distinction between this and what you posted):
It's hard to resist the strong temptation to include a screenie of a certain Insane Clown Posse video.Acupuncture is based upon the Eastern philosophy of chi (also spelled qi), which is their name for the supposed life force or vital energy that animates living things. In Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) chi flows through pathways in the body known as meridians. Illness results from the flow of chi through the meridians being blocked, or by the two types of chi (yin and yang) being out of balance. Acupuncture is the practice of placing thin needles at acupuncture points, which are said to coincide with points at which meridians cross, to improve the flow and restore the balance of chi.
---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 09:03 PM ----------
Yet again, a closer examination reveals problems despite the Nature pedigree.
I'd be curious to know your response to theirs.
Last edited by Sayl; 2013-01-28 at 04:01 AM. Reason: Typo
Since people seem to be wanting to go back to ancient medical philosophies, in the West we might start promoting the old fluid equilibrium theory. Anyone up for a good bloodletting or a purge?
*sharpens scalpel*
I've stepped on enough lego bricks to see where this is going.
i understand that, im just saying that it seems to be based on real phenomena. ancient peoples simply had another explanation for it.I used the term "magic" in that post following Cattaclysmic's reference to it. Pick any term you like, but this is what it boils down to (and please note the distinction between this and what you posted):
I don't believe in energy or anything mystical, but everyone I've talked to who's done acupuncture says it was really great for pain relief. These people (who are close to me) do not believe in energy or anything mystical and had it performed on them by people with similar beliefs. I'm not sure how it works, but when people tell me that it does significant things for their pain level I believe them. I'd like to give my own experience with it, but I'm too afraid of needles to give it a try.
I've been on acupuncture, because it "suppose" get rid of my fucking tinnitus. Did nothing, if anything i think, my tinnitus became louder for a hour or two right after the therapy...but i must admit it feels like something is moving through the body. Like energy is shifting or something, but could also be just placebo.
If you want a tool to help you relax or to deal with your emotions or feelings in ANY way, use EFT! It's a lifesaver!