This is the crisis facing china

[Grizzly Willy]

Fresh air in a can is real? I haven't seen anything about it outside of the parody clip from Spaceballs.

There can be only one solution, 100 mile high fans that blow the smog to be someone else's problem.

Seriously though, wow. How has this been affecting their weather?

We need....Megamaid!

[starlord]

yes but when? people need to stop pretending that this earth is infinite in it's ability to take damage, and this is especially a big problem for the people who will no doubt suffer the consequences first.
They need to immediately fund new research and bring in top minds from around the world to help find ways to recycle and prevent the smoke from factories from just beign dumped into the atmosphere.

If they don't see it as a problem...just watch till they destroy their land and peoples health BEFORE they realize "ow hey this could be a prob".I just feel that alot of the people in their govenrment are more worried about keeping jobs and money flowing than the enviroment and peoples health.

The big question is.....how much is enough and when will it be time to get really serious with the issue?

probably as soon as the lung cancer and the birth defects start becoming a problem.

[mvaliz]

We need....Megamaid!

It's at this point in the thread where I learned that everything China needs, both short-term and long-term, can be found via watching Spaceballs the Movie.

So long as they don't try using Spaceballs the flame-thrower. The kids might set the atmosphere on fire...

[shadowmouse]

They need to immediately fund new research and bring in top minds from around the world to help find ways to recycle and prevent the smoke from factories from just beign dumped into the atmosphere.

Go back and read what I wrote about why this is a winter problem. People in the Beijing area are burning truckloads of compressed coal dust for cheap heat. I live here, I can smell the coal smoke right now. I can go visit my gf and she'll be burning the blasted stuff.

"They" -- the national and local governments -- actually are trying to improve air quality. In the end, 1.4+ billion people are like herding cats, they go ahead and do what they want, knowing that the police can't be everywhere. If the government tries to reduce pollution from automobiles, some joker is going to use tape to alter the number on his plate, just use counterfeit plates or steal another set of plates.

As for the factories? Some of the factories that are particularly bad aren't legal now, they're an illegal, back yard operation, quite possibly churning out counterfeit or substandard stuff and they're the industrial equivalent of a meth lab run by cockroaches.

Real life isn't quite so simple.

[walexia]

Go back and read what I wrote about why this is a winter problem. People in the Beijing area are burning truckloads of compressed coal dust for cheap heat. I live here, I can smell the coal smoke right now. I can go visit my gf and she'll be burning the blasted stuff.

"They" -- the national and local governments -- actually are trying to improve air quality. In the end, 1.4+ billion people are like herding cats, they go ahead and do what they want, knowing that the police can't be everywhere. If the government tries to reduce pollution from automobiles, some joker is going to use tape to alter the number on his plate, just use counterfeit plates or steal another set of plates.

As for the factories? Some of the factories that are particularly bad aren't legal now, they're an illegal, back yard operation, quite possibly churning out counterfeit or substandard stuff and they're the industrial equivalent of a meth lab run by cockroaches.

Real life isn't quite so simple.

I have and ive noticed you have only given us causes , but not government solutions and trials to help alleviate the issue.That to me indicates that the govenernment has not done much to make peopel aware of their efforts to alleviate the situation.Your tone especially in this part

In the end, 1.4+ billion people are like herding cats, they go ahead and do what they want, knowing that the police can't be everywhere.

hints that the government has given up.

Yes people are gonna do whatever they can at given situations , but this cannot be to say they are completely unreasonable? i mean some are wearing gas mask and white masks as they get through the city.

which is why i ended my post with the question(not directed at you ) that when will it be time for them to take drastic measures and when will hear about this ?? all we hear is Beijing in china is just suffering with smog yet we do not hear about anything truly drastic or radical being done about it.Where they going to wait for people to actually start falling over dead to actually do something about the situation??

I personally like to leave stuff till the last minute,i get an adrenaline rush when i get things done under tight deadlines.Some say you make your most creative decisions at such times.when your truly desperate your answers become crystal clear(moment of clarity) and your mode of implementation becomes extremely efficient.Though sometimes it doesn't work out.

I feel they are waiting for such a time to really act.until then, the people of china can i guess"take it" till they can't no more.In the meantime please go ahead and let us know what the government has been doing to seriously fight this problem.The media is saturated by stories about how bad it is.Personally if things became that bad where i lived , i would consider moving.BUT if things were always that way , or i was born in a place like that i probably would think it's normal.It would still not change the fact that the situation there is not as it should be.

[Bakis]

That is China's real major issue. Millions and millions of angry young men with no chance of finding a wife - wouldn't surprise me to see some major internal strife in the next few decades.

Can't wait untill the homophobes start to use the above as an explanation why people 'turn' gay.

[shadowmouse]

but not government solutions and trials to help alleviate the issue

Well, I had hoped that since the story is running currently in the New York Times, you would already be familiar with some of the steps. They range from planting increased green space, offering benefits to home owners for installing energy efficient appliances, and increased use of nuclear power to restrictions on motor vehicle use.

You don't seem to get the point about the problem posed by both the total population of China and the way that population is distributed. I'm sure that there is room to debate the reliability of figures, but China has roughly 102 law enforcement officers per 100,000 people. In comparison Canada has 202, Denmark 245, the US 256 and the UK 307. The government hasn't given up and there are rather regular awareness campaigns, but the police can't be everywhere -- and if they were, the foreign media would be having a field day with that instead.

As I said of one of the examples that I did mention there are already laws about when you can drive your car. They're based on your license plate number. They've probably been better than nothing, but far too many folks simply do the things I mentioned -- alter their plates with a bit of tape (I've seen them do it), jam a CD into the plate holder to obscure their plate number (not even subtle, but I see it a lot), use counterfeit plates or use stolen plates. Many vehicle owners don't even mount their plates, some leave them inside the front window and others tuck them under the seat and it is because license plates are a tempting target for thieves.

The same way, those illegal factories are like the meme about "good luck, I'm behind seven proxies" -- whoever is actually the money and planner is behind multiple cut outs and will have a new operation set up within days. Like many illegal activities around the world, the police end up busting a minor player. If it were so easy to address illegal activities, the US should have "won" the War on Drugs years ago. We haven't.

i mean some are wearing gas mask and white masks as they get through the city.

Right now, some are even wearing masks because the air is bad. On the other hand, one often sees pictures of people wearing masks without an explanation. Surgical masks are common to fight the spread of colds and flu, while cloth masks are popular to protect people from dust and wind while keeping their face warm. My gf stocked me up with both kinds at the beginning of winter, before the pollution started really stacking up, with the admonition that I should be careful not to catch a cold.

yet we do not hear about anything truly drastic or radical being done about it.

Nor will you, it doesn't make as good a story. On the other hand, talking about an airpocalypse feeds a particular image that caters to what people want to read. As for truly drastic approaches, that's a no win situation. In situations where the government has employed such measures -- the One Child Policy springs to mind -- look at how that plays in the media. Mind you, I long ago stopped being surprised when I discover the person I'm talking to has one or more actual siblings (my gf has three), but that seems to stay out of the news.

What do you really expect that the government can do? Go through Beijing in the middle of winter and confiscate coal burning stoves from the elderly and those on the lower end of the income scale?

[shise]

China is the big Red Capitalist Monster when they call themselves Communists.

Imo that's the real crisis. Pollution is the result of industry organizational incompetence where money goes ahead of health. To be honest, we should simply seize or stop the economy of those who emit more than X pollution. Why? because it's insane.

[Purlina]

China is the big Red Capitalist Monster when they call themselves Communists.

Imo that's the real crisis. Pollution is the result of industry organizational incompetence where money goes ahead of health. To be honest, we should simply seize or stop the economy of those who emit more than X pollution. Why? because it's insane.

Then none of the "super powers" would ever have made it past the industrial era!

[Waaldo]

What's the crisis? the fact that these people think surgical masks filter the air?
Either these people are idiots, or the news is reporting on people who are trying to avoid getting the flu and the media are spinning it towards what ever the fuck they think will get them the most views.

Also, that canned air is a pretty brilliant idea. It is probably just a completely empty can that was sealed without anything going in it. All they needed was a factory with clean air.

[Reeve]

Another issue they have in the dwindling female population, there are so many useless teenage Chinese boys running around it's causing lots of crime related issues.

According to Wikipedia's Demographics of China, the current rate is 1.13 males per female under the age of 15. While that's not a good number, I don't think it's cataclysmic either. That's 53% of the population being male under the age of 15, 47% female. The ratio is much closer for the 16-64 crowd, where it's 1.06:1 male:female ratio, or 51.5% male, 48.5% female.

[Kurioxan]

According to Wikipedia's Demographics of China, the current rate is 1.13 males per female under the age of 15. While that's not a good number, I don't think it's cataclysmic either. That's 53% of the population being male under the age of 15, 47% female. The ratio is much closer for the 16-64 crowd, where it's 1.06:1 male:female ratio, or 51.5% male, 48.5% female.

indeed people overblow things out of proportion, also lol at the idea that guys without females become violent criminals
So females are leashes to keep guy in order?
There are many other reasons why they become criminals and lack of females aint it.

[iggie]

THE air is so bad, you can see barely 200m down the road. People are hiding behind masks. And one man is selling fresh air in a can. This is the crisis facing China.

Anyone want to buy fresh air in a can???
I'm selling them $50 for a can




http://www.news.com.au/world/toxic-s...-1226565630662

The guy selling fresh air is doing it to raise concern, not as a real business (the guys already a billionaire). It's really a crisis for the whole world, as the Chinese mindset is to wait for winds to blow the pollution away, instead of fixing it. In a country where the govt is corrupt and people fuck the environment to get rich and emigrate elsewhere. Essentially, China takes shits in it's own swimming pool.

[wow2011]

Is the pollution coming from all the factories there? if not where is it coming from?

Some of it is coming from coal burning by individuals for warming up houses. Some of it is from cars.

China definitely have the ability to solve these issues if they put their minds on it. Afterall, they can and have demolished entire villages for highways or bridges. Being an authoritarian governemnt, China has the ability to move very quickly to fix problems.

[iggie]

According to Wikipedia's Demographics of China, the current rate is 1.13 males per female under the age of 15. While that's not a good number, I don't think it's cataclysmic either. That's 53% of the population being male under the age of 15, 47% female. The ratio is much closer for the 16-64 crowd, where it's 1.06:1 male:female ratio, or 51.5% male, 48.5% female.

People who's first son is a boy are far less likely to break the one child policy/bribe people/sneak into another country to give birth. Girls aren't worth it for many of them. This and late abortion once gender is confirmed is continually skewing the pop %'s.

[Elenion]

Is the pollution coming from all the factories there? if not where is it coming from?

Worst place is one of their biggest coal mining city. It's a combination of burning massive amount of coals + corrupted government/lack of administration for environment pollution + lack of awareness + mindset with maximizing profit.

Air pollution isn't only environmental problem they are facing. Water pollution is also staggering and its effect is much more apparent because it affects marine lives and reaches neighbor countries faster than air pollution.

[iggie]

Some of it is coming from coal burning by individuals for warming up houses. Some of it is from cars.

China definitely have the ability to solve these issues if they put their minds on it. Afterall, they can and have demolished entire villages for highways or bridges. Being an authoritarian governemnt, China has the ability to move very quickly to fix problems.

It's factories, millions of cars, and dirty energy.

Worst place is one of their biggest coal mining city. It's a combination of burning massive amount of coals + corrupted government/lack of administration for environment pollution + lack of awareness + mindset with maximizing profit.

Air pollution isn't only environmental problem they are facing. Water pollution is also staggering and its affect is much more apparent because it affects marine lives and its affect reaches neighbor countries faster than air pollution.

I can't even boil my tap water. I use bottled water for everything minus washing my floor/body.

[Reeve]

People who's first son is a boy are far less likely to break the one child policy/bribe people/sneak into another country to give birth. Girls aren't worth it for many of them. This and late abortion once gender is confirmed is continually skewing the pop %'s.

Yes, but not in such heavy numbers that it's going to cause the collapse of China, like some people seem to believe.

[wow2011]

Yes, but not in such heavy numbers that it's going to cause the collapse of China, like some people seem to believe.

Prob not the collapse of entire China, just various villages in the country side. There are villages in China that have died off because of this. Then again, no one really cares about those villages. People is simply an asset, not something to be treasured in China. So useless people have no value and is therefore expendable.

[Kurioxan]

People who's first son is a boy are far less likely to break the one child policy/bribe people/sneak into another country to give birth. Girls aren't worth it for many of them. This and late abortion once gender is confirmed is continually skewing the pop %'s.

That is true, and yet the ratio is quite similar, more balanced than horde-alliance ratio in most wow servers :P

---------- Post added 2013-01-31 at 04:35 PM ----------

Prob not the collapse of entire China, just various villages in the country side. There are villages in China that have died off because of this. Then again, no one really cares about those villages. People is simply an asset, not something to be treasured in China. So useless people have no value and is therefore expendable.

Lots of villages and towns die in europe and in the US every year, that is not something restricted to china, rural exodos and aging populations and lack of opportunities in such lands are the cause of it, not lack of females, and yes, it doesnt really matter that those villages die off, the villagers didnt, they moved away.