[Mage] 5.2 PTR Discussion (based on Feb 19 notes)

[zomgDPS]

What to theorycraft?

Do 100 Mio on the Targetdummy before and after the Patch today, and u will see there is not such a big nerf.
if you are able to play the Mage by your self, not only by Math.

Get to it then. Go do your tests. And when you are done, post your results in this thread.

Except. Instead of just doing 100mil, follow the instructions in that thread.

You want to make your 21st post on these forums a constructive one? Do what I'm suggesting right now.

[Deleted]

Not sure I'm gonna pick Flameglow for PVE though. Absorbing damage is a lot better. Ice Flows (WAT?)?!?

[Sw1tch]

we arent getting Water Jet, I'm done. Frost is now literally fire with blue pixels.

[Soulstrike]

nooooooo they freaking changed the mana cost back to whooping 150% per charge T.T

i like managing my mana at 4stacks on ptr when it was 100% mana cost...... 150% per charge felt like "whoops used 1 extra AB now my dps is screwed" :C:C hopefully they change it to 100 or 120 :/ but not 150

[mrgreenthump]

nooooooo they freaking changed the mana cost back to whooping 150% per charge T.T

i like managing my mana at 4stacks on ptr when it was 100% mana cost...... 150% per charge felt like "whoops used 1 extra AB now my dps is screwed" :C:C hopefully they change it to 100 or 120 :/ but not 150

Oh thats just the thing I hate in games, like you realise it right after you have done it, and cant do a single thing to correct it. But then again am a perfectionist when it comes to dps and rotations xD

[Polarthief]

I can't see much use for flameglow for PVE..
more of a PVP talent.. (or another talent nobody uses, like icy flows)

The problem is FG is only usable against DoT classes. It's pretty useless elsewhere, making the talent overall way too shitty.

A better (though boring, but still way better) talent would have been "X% Damage reduction". Plain, simple, and one that Mages need, badly.

---------- Post added 2013-02-20 at 01:31 AM ----------

nooooooo they freaking changed the mana cost back to whooping 150% per charge T.T

i like managing my mana at 4stacks on ptr when it was 100% mana cost...... 150% per charge felt like "whoops used 1 extra AB now my dps is screwed" :C:C hopefully they change it to 100 or 120 :/ but not 150

Don't forget the nerf that is Arcane 4P T15.

I would love someone to test that and to confirm if the 4P is actually a buff or a nerf. It sure discourages using Mastery, that's for sure.

[mrgreenthump]

The problem is FG is only usable against DoT classes. It's pretty useless elsewhere, making the talent overall way too shitty.

A better (though boring, but still way better) talent would have been "X% Damage reduction". Plain, simple, and one that Mages need, badly.

---------- Post added 2013-02-20 at 01:31 AM ----------



Don't forget the nerf that is Arcane 4P T15.

I would love someone to test that and to confirm if the 4P is actually a buff or a nerf. It sure discourages using Mastery, that's for sure.

You need to be hit 17 times in 25 seconds for the max absorb for it to beat Ice barrier. Thats the core problems of the talent. Most of PvE damage nowdays is constant in heroic fights, but the problem comes on sudden bursts, which allmost every aoe damage fight has, so if you get hit for 75-90% of your hp with a sudden burst damage ability in PvE, using ice barrier will fully soak the next few AoE ticks, while flameglow will continue to just absorb at max 30% at the most per tick. So from healing PoV(if mana aint a problem), I would rather have mages using Ice Barrier or Temporal shield on that fight.

[Soulstrike]

Don't forget the nerf that is Arcane 4P T15.

I would love someone to test that and to confirm if the 4P is actually a buff or a nerf. It sure discourages using Mastery, that's for sure.

there was a discussion about the 4set and someone proved(??) its actually 4-5% buff for arcane iirc......

[Summer]

I assume flameglow would work on something like Ultraxion where there is steady AoE damage + a tight berserk so that wasting GCD's on Ice Barrier would be tough. But yeah, the talent will probably be used on 1-2 fights if that...

[mrgreenthump]

I assume flameglow would work on something like Ultraxion where there is steady AoE damage + a tight berserk so that wasting GCD's on Ice Barrier would be tough. But yeah, the talent will probably be used on 1-2 fights if that...

But werent the damage really bursty in the end of Ultra? so TS would be better?

[Summer]

Might be, yeah :P

[Polarthief]

there was a discussion about the 4set and someone proved(??) its actually 4-5% buff for arcane iirc......

I'd say it still depends on your stats. If you're using a Mastery build, I wouldn't see it being better.

I assume flameglow would work on something like Ultraxion where there is steady AoE damage + a tight berserk so that wasting GCD's on Ice Barrier would be tough. But yeah, the talent will probably be used on 1-2 fights if that...

Eh, TS if you can't use the global for IB (which I think is now a huge problem with IB; it needs to be off the GCD)

[Soulstrike]

I'd say it still depends on your stats. If you're using a Mastery build, I wouldn't see it being better.



Eh, TS if you can't use the global for IB (which I think is now a huge problem with IB; it needs to be off the GCD)

IB is fine with having gcd :/ it has a 60s duration and just use it when you are moving or away from something

[Kanariya]

Eh, TS if you can't use the global for IB (which I think is now a huge problem with IB; it needs to be off the GCD)

Highly unnecessary. It's a strong defensive option, and the best out of all three in the tier. It being on the GCD is the tradeoff.

[Polarthief]

IB is fine with having gcd :/ it has a 60s duration and just use it when you are moving or away from something

What about when you actually need it? Popping it blindly isn't necessarily the smartest choice unless you're just diminishing some AoE damage.

Highly unnecessary. It's a strong defensive option, and the best out of all three in the tier. It being on the GCD is the tradeoff.

"Best" is highly debatable. I wouldn't give up TS for almost anything after realizing how amazing it is.

"Oh hey, Kor'thik Strike..." *TS* *Goes to 10% HP* *Back to full*

I feel like that 25% nerf to it in 5.1 is what killed it for me. It doesn't feel worth the global without some trinket proccs, and I don't want to sacrifice a global DURING trinket proccs.

It either should be buffed back to original or taken off the GCD. It only blocks ~70-90k (without proccs) every 25s atm. TS can heal back up to H-1 (where H is your health pool) every 25s, and FG will block low-damage attacks by 30% and higher damage attacks by 4-6k (which isn't that strong, but it also doesn't waste a global and scales with your SP).

[vaccine]

They're both good in situations. Korthik strike you can make a really strong case for IB being better for the HP buffer it provides, large hits tend to favour IB due to the extra death protection like Korthik Strike and Unseen Strike, though if you run Cauterize it's less of an issue. TS is great though for a lot of stuff later on in this tier of heroics and I'm generally running that now (especailly as it's amazing for Huddle on Sha).

Flameglow I really can't see ever taking. I can't think of a single raid situation it would come in useful for.

[Methusula]

What about when you actually need it? Popping it blindly isn't necessarily the smartest choice unless you're just diminishing some AoE damage.



"Best" is highly debatable. I wouldn't give up TS for almost anything after realizing how amazing it is.

"Oh hey, Kor'thik Strike..." *TS* *Goes to 10% HP* *Back to full*

I feel like that 25% nerf to it in 5.1 is what killed it for me. It doesn't feel worth the global without some trinket proccs, and I don't want to sacrifice a global DURING trinket proccs.

It either should be buffed back to original or taken off the GCD. It only blocks ~70-90k (without proccs) every 25s atm. TS can heal back up to H-1 (where H is your health pool) every 25s, and FG will block low-damage attacks by 30% and higher damage attacks by 4-6k (which isn't that strong, but it also doesn't waste a global and scales with your SP).

My IB absorbs just over 100k without procs. You have better gear than I do so I would assume your spell power is higher. Something doesn't jive with me on this one.

[Polarthief]

My IB absorbs just over 100k without procs. You have better gear than I do so I would assume your spell power is higher. Something doesn't jive with me on this one.

*Checks*

... That's really weird. Last I checked it did around 85k.

I've got 27,899 SP atm (and this is with raid buffs/500 Int flask [Crystal of Insanity]). It absorbs 96,646. (If I was Frost, it'd absorb more because of gemming)

[Shangalar]

Ice Barrier was nerfed when it was absorbing 100k when we had an item level of cca 470. You skipped the part where you got a ton of gear in between

[Polarthief]

Ice Barrier was nerfed when it was absorbing 100k when we had an item level of cca 470. You skipped the part where you got a ton of gear in between

Nyeh. Still not worth my global when I have TS

IB is definitely better for Normals. TS is so live-saving with all the one-shot attacks of Heroic.