MoP: are we fighting for the wrong team?

[Aquamonkey]

The trolls could still have lived on the planet before the Titans started terraforming it, it was most likely a very hostile world, but it would explain the trollish regeneration capabilities, those might have been necessary to survive in such a hostile environment.

Perhaps, but the Trolls can't live in a vacuum. They need an ecosystem to support them or they'd starve. And they had to evolve from something.

[Combatbutler]

Perhaps, but the Trolls can't live in a vacuum. They need an ecosystem to support them or they'd starve.

Who is to say it was a vacuum, the titans changed the landscape and the atmosphere, they made the planet more hospital, but since blizzard said Trolls predate Titan arrival it means survival was possible, though it was most likely a very harsh environment.

[maxxz1]

I think so

[Aquamonkey]

Who is to say it was a vacuum, the titans changed the landscape and the atmosphere, they made the planet more hospital, but since blizzard said Trolls predate Titan arrival it means survival was possibly, though it was most likely a very harsh environment.

I know they said it, but it doesn't make sense and it's inconsistent. They clearly didn't plan out the prehistory of Azeroth very thoroughly. They're just scrambling to work the Old Gods in.

[maxxz1]

wrathion definitely still has his fathers lingering evil.

[Combatbutler]

I know they said it, but it doesn't make sense and it's inconsistent.

What isn't? Their timeline is a bloody mess and they do it on purpose^^

They said Trolls predate the Titans so they do, the titans changed azeroth that much we know, but blizzard will change established lore in a heartbeat if it suits their needs, just look at the Draenei.

wrathion definitely still has his fathers lingering evil.

Nope wrathion is entirely uncorrupted, he wants what is best for the world and that is not´necessarily good for the horde or alliance.

[Lumineus]

So, the thing is: Pandaren are a Mogu creation as well. Just like they flesh-shaped lizards to create Saurok, they did this to some pandas and we all see the resoults. Pandaren were not enslaved - it was a race that was created to be slaves. A bit like machines, created to serve, but somehow managing to regain free will and breaking their chains. Similiar to the Terminator series? A bit, I guess.

If that's so, where are the pandas? Grummles were made from Troggs. Saurok from basilisks and raptors. Jinyu from Murlocs. Hozen from apes. So, where are the pandas? The giant, bear-like ones? Don't tell me Pandaren were made from raccoon critter battle pets.

[Florena]

If that's so, where are the pandas? Grummles were made from Troggs. Saurok from basilisks and raptors. Jinyu from Murlocs. Hozen from apes. So, where are the pandas? The giant, bear-like ones? Don't tell me Pandaren were made from raccoon critter battle pets.

Blizzard hasn't given us information on what pandaren culture was like before they were enslaved, and so some people speculate that the Pandaren were created by the Mogu. Speculation is fair, but it's annoying when people assert it as fact when really there's no evidence of it.

[Kralljin]

Blizzard hasn't given us information on what pandaren culture was like before they were enslaved, and so some people speculate that the Pandaren were created by the Mogu.

Pandaren were not created by the Mogu, as Lei Shen enslaved the Pandaren and before Lei Shen the Mogu lacked to power to create anything as Ra-den had very much power over his own blood and the Engine of Nalak'sha.

[Deleted]

I've always thought Pandaren to be furbolgs that evolved in a different direction then the normal ones.

Haven't Blizzard said that Pandaren participated in the war of the Ancients? Were they liberated from the mogu then or were they enslaved after the big sundering?

[Deleted]

The Mogu no longer serve their current function, their current state makes them our enemy. Deathwing was created as a guardian and protector as well, look how that turned out.

[Florena]

They didn't participate in the war of the ancients. But the pandaren emperor foresaw what was coming and sealed off Pandaria to protect it from the Sundering.

[TheDangerZone]

The current evidence shows that Pandaren are most likely one of the native races of Azeroth instead of being engineered by another intelligent life-form.

Still, even of the Pandaren were a Mogu creation that rebelled, it doesn't make the Mogu the "good guys"; for one, Even if they are creations of the titans, they seem to have gone REALLY our of script after they were abandoned. I mean, it's kinda sad that the mogu become so purposeless and lost, but they seriously took the wrong turn by becoming warring tyrannical slavers. They can say all they want that they are merely following the titans instructions, but their "prime directive" is nothing but a perversion of their original programming; once they gained free will, things went to the crapper.

[Skytotem]

Mogu's blatant dismissal of the rights of anyone else makes them very much 'the bad guys' here.

[Kaleredar]

I know they said it, but it doesn't make sense and it's inconsistent. They clearly didn't plan out the prehistory of Azeroth very thoroughly. They're just scrambling to work the Old Gods in.

"Primordial landscape" doesn't mean Azeroth was a vacuum or completely uninhabitable, it's just Blizzard being fancy with their words. Seeing as the only (known) sentient inhabitants were the Trolls, Aqir, faceless, and old gods, the place was probably very rough around the edges. Hence "primordial."

In the same way that "age" doesn't definitively denote any specific amount of time, it's just another way of saying "a really long time."


-At some long-gone time, the Old gods were tearing up Azeroth

-titans show up at a slightly less long-gone time and beat down the old gods

-The titans terraformed Azeroth at some unknown point in the past after that.

-The curse of flesh happens. The ONLY estimate we have as to when the curse of flesh happened comes from Thoralius the wise, who says that the visions Alliance players have of the Vrykul with their human child dates back 15,000 years.

[Hitei]

The Mogu no longer serve their current function, their current state makes them our enemy. Deathwing was created as a guardian and protector as well, look how that turned out.

Honestly even if they were still serving the Titan's will, that wouldn't change anything.
It's not like the Titans and the mortal races of Azeroth are on good terms or are allies.

[oplawlz]

Ever since wotlk I've been sad about not being able to choose sides

[Durenek]

pigs aren't sentient. That's where i, personally, draw the line. If pigs someday gain sentience then i'd be against using them as food too.

but they're so tasty

[Aquamonkey]

"Primordial landscape" doesn't mean Azeroth was a vacuum or completely uninhabitable, it's just Blizzard being fancy with their words. Seeing as the only (known) sentient inhabitants were the Trolls, Aqir, faceless, and old gods, the place was probably very rough around the edges. Hence "primordial."

In the same way that "age" doesn't definitively denote any specific amount of time, it's just another way of saying "a really long time."


-At some long-gone time, the Old gods were tearing up Azeroth

-titans show up at a slightly less long-gone time and beat down the old gods

-The titans terraformed Azeroth at some unknown point in the past after that.

-The curse of flesh happens. The ONLY estimate we have as to when the curse of flesh happened comes from Thoralius the wise, who says that the visions Alliance players have of the Vrykul with their human child dates back 15,000 years.

They describe the Titans as "raising mighty mountains and dredging out vast seas. They breathed skies and raging atmospheres into being."

What about protodrakes? Blizzard says they didn't exist on Azeroth pre-Titans. So then where did they come from for the Titans to make them into dragons? Some of these species came about during/after the terraforming.

The Aqir built their empire on Kalimdor (which didn't exist until after the Titan terraforming). This was several thousand years before they were defeated by the Trolls 16,000 years ago.

As proof that Blizzard doesn't think this shit through. One source in game says the Qiraji came from the Aqir (whom were created by the Old Gods). Another source in game says the Qiraji came from Silithid (whom were created by the Well of Eternity and modified by C'thun).

Trying to make sense of this is putting more effort into it than Blizzard did when they wrote the lore or made those comments.

[Flaks]

Honestly everything seems to point to the Pantheon in fact being a bigger threat to Azeroth than even Sargeras.

Too bad creativity at Blizzard's Warcraft and Diablo teams seems to be at an all time low and they'll probably end up bringing the Titans out of nowhere to reward the players for their heroism and adventures.