Horridon 10/25 N Strategy (<500 ilvl)

[Libertarian]

I'm sorry but if you can't handle Horridon you will fail entirely on the next few bosses, too.

Council requires even more dps OR a group that is on top of their game in the gear they have. And even then, you will probably have trouble.

Tortos requires tanks geared enough to take on the bats, your group coordinated enough to swap to certain turtles to get them down quickly, two people (one back up) ready on the turtles, and enough dps to beat the soft enrage.

Don't even think about Magaera if you're having trouble on Horridon.

My assumption is that bosses are tuned for these item levels:

Breaker - 480-490 area

Horridon - 496+

Council - 496+

Tortos - 502+

Magaera - 502+

etc...

with Lei shen being around 517

[Mad_Murdock]

Yet another person who didn't actually read the thread. Your main has killed heroic sha 8 times and has an item level of 515. If the dps check was remotely difficult for your group then it would be stupidly overtuned. You probably should be ashamed that it took you 2 pulls.
.

I think it's pretty obvious that the heroic guilds are just here to agitate the none heroic radiers. Why else would someone 16/16 Heroic talk about how easy a normal boss is.

[zerocoolhack]

I think it's pretty obvious that the heroic guilds are just here to agitate the none heroic radiers. Why else would someone 16/16 Heroic talk about how easy a normal boss is.

Or people can stop complaining about not being able to kill a boss the second day of a new tier.

[Drilnos]

I'm sorry but if you can't handle Horridon you will fail entirely on the next few bosses, too.

Council requires even more dps OR a group that is on top of their game in the gear they have. And even then, you will probably have trouble.

Tortos requires tanks geared enough to take on the bats, your group coordinated enough to swap to certain turtles to get them down quickly, two people (one back up) ready on the turtles, and enough dps to beat the soft enrage.

Don't even think about Magaera if you're having trouble on Horridon.

My assumption is that bosses are tuned for these item levels:

Breaker - 480-490 area

Horridon - 496+

Council - 496+

Tortos - 502+

Magaera - 502+

etc...

with Lei shen being around 517

In what universe, exactly, would anyone have thought about Megaera if they couldn't get Horridon down anyway? My own guild spun its tires on Horridon all night last night, and I can assure you the absolute last thing on any of our minds was Megaera. Anyway, unless the following bosses are all dispel/interrupt-a-paloozas, they test different competencies and can't really be compared.

[artem123]

One shotted it, not overtuned.

You have 507ilvl and full heroics, your raid probably also has 505+ ilvl if not higher.
So lets see, boss based say near 502, and you can do it with less gear.
You overgear it, means it CAN BE OVERTUNED IF YOU DO NOT HAVE THAT LESSER GEAR LEVEL.
Its like doing heroc binder, that lower ilvl due to limitation of dps, if you have more gear you have more dps and that enrage will slowly die off.

[Belloc]

Or people can stop complaining about not being able to kill a boss the second day of a new tier.

To be fair, we're talking about the second boss of an instance. Second bosses usually aren't very difficult.

[Mad_Murdock]

Or people can stop complaining about not being able to kill a boss the second day of a new tier.

I'll go out on a limb and predict, the number of Horridon kills, at least by 10 man, will have hardly any growth after this week, once all the heroic raiders have cleared it on their normal schedule and zip off to Heroics. There will be some bubble guilds that get it down, but barring nerfs, I don't see more than 100-200 normal mode guilds killing it. Would that be working as intended ?

[Spotnick]

I think it's pretty obvious that the heroic guilds are just here to agitate the none heroic radiers. Why else would someone 16/16 Heroic talk about how easy a normal boss is.

I'm 16/16H in previous tier and I can tell you this is one of the easiest in there so far... fights are not easy simply because there are no guides for them yet and you have to use your brain to figure it out.

Saying normal mode is easy would be a lie, I wiped more on boss #5 than Heroic Garalon and Mel'jarak combined.

[Deja Thoris]

ps: if you've been doing only T14 normal mode and uprgadingr you gear, you should have 500ilvl, which is more than enough to kill the boss.

I'm at 497 after getting the 522 neck and we've had a handful of heroics on farm for ages.

Its entirely probable that people don't have ilevel 500 yet, especially people who only did normals.

Not sure why I'm posting, guess I just felt like telling you that you are completely wrong.

[Aquamonkey]

Non-heroic 10m raiding guild here. Average raid ilvl of about 490.

Once we got the coordination down, we managed to 3 shot Horridon. Two tanks swapped after each gate, 3 healers (2x pally, 1x priest).

P1 should be pretty easy. Just don't stand in the sand.
P2 was a bit of a challenge. All of our dps that had interrupts focused a priest and did their best to kick casts. Burned down adds as fast as possible. Had to single-target cleanse poisons. Each pally took a group and dispelled them.
P3 isn't too bad. All dps stacked on top of add-tank. Popped Heroism + CDs and we all moved towards the last gate while nuking down adds. Having a fixed movement helped us avoid frost orbs and kept the raid organized. Add-tank should use defensive CDs if needed.
P4 wasn't too difficult either. Just avoid totems and kill adds.

Thank you for this, going to be starting ToT tonight and your post has been insightful for how a guild that doesn't overgear the encounter did it.

A million thanks Paul. And to anyone else who can reply with winning strats / experience for a <500ilvl 10m. Kind of pointless for 25m ilvl510 raiders to be posting 'omg lol dis boss is ez mode delete yur toons rite nao baddies" on here. One good look at the logs and you can see that the disparity between 10 & 25 is huge.

Not to take away from your kill, but this just illustrates how much composition is important. You have 3 healers who can dispel disease (more if you have any monks or spriests). 10Ms without the ability to dispel disease will get wrecked on P3 if they stack up like that.

[trollingisokayhere]

We will kill him tonight, it will have took us around 20 pulls. My guild was 16/16 norm with 2 heroics down. Enough advice has been giving out here so I'm just going to say I dont think the stupid bridge trash that takes way to long and the super easy first boss really help anyone to prepare for this guy. Nothing needs to be adjusted, people need to stop acting like a boss should die after 5 pulls.

[Deleted]

I'm 16/16H in previous tier and I can tell you this is one of the easiest in there so far... fights are not easy simply because there are no guides for them yet and you have to use your brain to figure it out.

Saying normal mode is easy would be a lie, I wiped more on boss #5 than Heroic Garalon and Mel'jarak combined.

They felt horribly easy, but that is probably because of PTR XP and overgear, cant even say there is any difficulty in it, but then its nonheroic, so it should be okay. Even without experience they arent overtuned, they are forgiving and the strategies for them are pretty easy to get (kill adds, interrupt, dont stand in cleave), maybe just too much effects for nonheroic (usually its 1-2 on nonheroic, 3-4 on heroic, so it may be something unexpected for the average player).

Horridon is just coordination, kick shit, dont stand in shit, dont eat cleave, dont collect orbs, pull lust, kill big add, collect loot.

[Aquamonkey]

Nothing needs to be adjusted, people need to stop acting like a boss should die after 5 pulls.

Except it does for 25M. Only 10M seem to have trouble with it.

[Kiry]

For 10 man, this should be adjusted down some. It's a bit of a road block for 10 mans for a normal mode # 2 boss. Our group is about 500 ilvl and we are struggling mostly due to our comp. It is what it is, that said, I would like to see some minor adjustments to the adds. Not a lot, just a smidge to make it more align with a # 2 boss.

and as a previous poster said, our group doesn't care that much about what is beyond this boss. Just this boss for now. The next boss is another challenge for another time.

[Mad_Murdock]

I'm 16/16H in previous tier and I can tell you this is one of the easiest in there so far... fights are not easy simply because there are no guides for them yet and you have to use your brain to figure it out.

Saying normal mode is easy would be a lie, I wiped more on boss #5 than Heroic Garalon and Mel'jarak combined.

But you understand what some of us are saying. I'm 99% sure if my 16/16N guild had your 16/16H gear, we would have a much easier time on Horridon. Right now, I think we're averaging around ilvl 493ish. Surely we can agree that sometimes, Understanding the mechanics alone and even solid (not perfect) execution just won't be enough.

Again, I don't have a problem with a fight being challenging or "hard" I actually like doing hard modes. For the 2nd boss to spike up that much, compared to Sha of Fear (in which we downed in our first 8 tries) Just feels out of whack.

Also, Guilds that are 16/16 heroic or even 8/16H tend to have pretty solid execution and pretty solid players overall. Normal mode guilds are like high school basketball teams, they tend to have 1 or 2 stand out players and 7-8 average joes. Telling Normal mode guilds, they just need to execute better and play like a heroic guild is just silly. We're not a heroic mode raiding guild for a reason.

[Algearond]

Or people can stop complaining about not being able to kill a boss the second day of a new tier.

We have a winner!

[Bookofblade]

We had our first raid in ToT last night and got to Horridon 10m and got a few pulls in on him. With a 2% wipe (Lost a tank at the start of the Final phase and just couldn't kite the last 2% ) I dont feel many of the mechanics are over tuned we only had 1 psn and 1 disease dispels and managed everything ok.

My major question is with the third door, why does 10 and 25 man have the same number of adds with the same hp? I have to assume its a bug but I haven't been able to find anything definitive about this anywhere, would make things way easier if we could burst that wave down a lil faster and not have our priest so behind on diseases.

[Aquamonkey]

My major question is with the third door, why does 10 and 25 man have the same number of adds with the same hp? I have to assume its a bug but I haven't been able to find anything definitive about this anywhere, would make things way easier if we could burst that wave down a lil faster and now have our priest so behind on diseases.

They don't have the same HP, 10M adds have 1/3 the HP on all doors.

[calanos]

Again, I don't have a problem with a fight being challenging or "hard" I actually like doing hard modes. For the 2nd boss to spike up that much, compared to Sha of Fear (in which we downed in our first 8 tries) Just feels out of whack.

This is the crux of the issue. For the 2nd boss to be tuned where you need BiS 496 + lots of Valor upgrades or to have farmed at least 3-6 heroic modes for more than a month unless you have stone cold perfect execution for the 2nd boss of a normal tier. Even a guild that has been clearing 16/16 normal for a while (with a few heroics) is not up to par gear-wise after the first joke of a boss.

This means that next week, from raiding, we will have a total of 4-5 raid-dropped 522 items to help our next nights of Horridon attempts. If it was the 4th boss, we would at least be gaining some gear to help before the wall.

I love hard content, but that's what heroic mode is for. I have raided casually, I have raided US top-100, and love a good challenge. Horridon feels like its tuned perfectly for the 4th or 5th boss of the instance on normal. There is just no reason for early bosses in the next tier to have that hard of a dps check.

---------- Post added 2013-03-07 at 02:51 PM ----------

They don't have the same HP, 10M adds have 1/3 the HP on all doors.

This did get hot-fixed.

[satanicway]

This did get hot-fixed.

Have this really happened?
=X

When it was hot fixed?
Have not seem anything about this change.