MM rotation 5.2

[Deleted]

Since MM is getting some sweet buffs i've decided to try it out though i would like to hear Rotational opinions in order
to make the best possible rotation.

[eschatological]

I was thinking of an opener, under CA, might look something like this:

SrS, (Stampede), RF+ChS, SSx2, AMoC, Fervor+Readiness+ChS, into AiS dump and paired SS. Redo AMoC when it drops.

I think Fervor is definitely the go to talent in the level 60 tier for the on demand burst focus, which is vital in MM, IMO.

I haven't really theorycrafted this, so if anyone has tweaks, please go ahead. Dump with AiS under RF/BL, otherwise AS. I'm thinking a typical 9s Chimera Shot cycle will look something like this:

0s: ChS
1s: SSx2
3.5-4s depending on haste: 3-4 instants as a combination of AS/AMoC/GT. Probably combine a fervor in here every 3rdish cycle to keep focus positive
7.5s: SS, some dead time based on haste. If you can get SS to be 1.25s under Steady Focus (old ISS), you get 4 instants and a nice, even cycle with no dead time.
9s: ChS

The 9s cycle used to be a huge bitch back in the day of 8s Imp Steady Shot (which is why the theorycrafting favored the unglyphed, 10s ChS), but with 20s on that buff now, having that single SS won't make or break the cycle, and this is rather neat.

Under haste effects and assuming a 1s SS and roughly a 1.5s AiS:

0s: ChS
1s: SSx2
3s: AiS
4.5s: SSx2
6.5s: AiS
8s: 1 instant (GT/AMoC/AS/instant AiS)
9s: ChS

[Deleted]

It all depends on what haste plateu you have, everything you need to know can be found here

[Saoron]

Well whitefyst hasn't fully updated it for 5.2 yet. I wonder if the aimed shot buff changed the CA rotation. In my gear atleast, disabling GT during CA is a dps loss. For some it's a gain. I guess it's haste dependent ? If for instance lust is popped in the beginning.. with RF, would you still use GT ? or just straight AiS + SS spam ? Also he hasn't updated it based on the t15 tier bonus. There was a mention of a SS spam rotation as well. A looot of work needs to be done to fine tune MM.

[Puerto]

Yeah, I think we should get some good discussion on here about the MM rotation now. I haven't played MM in AGES lol. Questions...

Careful Aim Phase

What should our rotation look like in the CA phase? I'm guessing we ignore casting ChS, but do we manually reapply SrS? I'm guessing yes since it was buffed this expansion.

Normal Rotation

Do we continue to hard cast AiS, or go to AS? Should ChS being cast on cool down be a priority now?

Haste

Should we be reforging for haste, or should we be ok with our Crit > Mastery > Haste build?

[refire]

Yeah, I think we should get some good discussion on here about the MM rotation now. I haven't played MM in AGES lol. Questions...

Careful Aim Phase

What should our rotation look like in the CA phase? I'm guessing we ignore casting ChS, but do we manually reapply SrS? I'm guessing yes since it was buffed this expansion.

Normal Rotation

Do we continue to hard cast AiS, or go to AS? Should ChS being cast on cool down be a priority now?

Haste

Should we be reforging for haste, or should we be ok with our Crit > Mastery > Haste build?

The EJ guide has some good information if you look at the last and second to last pages. However during careful aim phase you should be using chimera shot normally. It hits hard, serpent sting hits hard, and you don't want to lose damage from either. Besides that dump with Aimed Shot. Your normal rotation outside of careful aim should be Chimera shot on CD, using MMM procs as close to instantly as possible, no focus capping, and dumping with arcane. Under both Rapid Fire and/or lust (so either of them up, not necessarily together) it will most likely be more beneficial with 505+ (made up number, some heroic gear basically/normal ToT loot, possibly worse gear) to hard cast Aimed Shots as a focus dump. Otherwise you shouldn't be hard casting. I don't know the answer pertaining to reforging so I'm going to skip it for someone else.

[Puerto]

The EJ guide has some good information if you look at the last and second to last pages. However during careful aim phase you should be using chimera shot normally. It hits hard, serpent sting hits hard, and you don't want to lose damage from either. Besides that dump with Aimed Shot. Your normal rotation outside of careful aim should be Chimera shot on CD, using MMM procs as close to instantly as possible, no focus capping, and dumping with arcane. Under both Rapid Fire and/or lust (so either of them up, not necessarily together) it will most likely be more beneficial with 505+ (made up number, some heroic gear basically/normal ToT loot, possibly worse gear) to hard cast Aimed Shots as a focus dump. Otherwise you shouldn't be hard casting. I don't know the answer pertaining to reforging so I'm going to skip it for someone else.

Well my guess is, if you aren't hard casting AiS out of CA and increased haste phases, Crit > Mastery > Haste would be preferred to get more Wild Quiver procs.

[Deleted]

The EJ guide has some good information if you look at the last and second to last pages. However during careful aim phase you should be using chimera shot normally. It hits hard, serpent sting hits hard, and you don't want to lose damage from either. Besides that dump with Aimed Shot. Your normal rotation outside of careful aim should be Chimera shot on CD, using MMM procs as close to instantly as possible, no focus capping, and dumping with arcane. Under both Rapid Fire and/or lust (so either of them up, not necessarily together) it will most likely be more beneficial with 505+ (made up number, some heroic gear basically/normal ToT loot, possibly worse gear) to hard cast Aimed Shots as a focus dump. Otherwise you shouldn't be hard casting. I don't know the answer pertaining to reforging so I'm going to skip it for someone else.

My gear is 507 did first boss with AS as focus dump and after taht ( we wiped cause I was too busy looking at my numbers ) then with AI hardcasting as long ass you have your 4p bonus still AI hardcasts are the way to go for me fully buffed and ImpSS up I get 1.67 casts on AI considering it crits for close to 250k it is better than casting 2 AS and worse than 3 but I manage to fit 1 CS > 2 SS > 1 AI one phase then second I get 2 AIs and and instant also compared to BM MM is only 700 dps behind according to femaledwarf and trust me it is defo more fun to play the that whack-a-mole spec BM

[Skygoneblue]

Well my guess is, if you aren't hard casting AiS out of CA and increased haste phases, Crit > Mastery > Haste would be preferred to get more Wild Quiver procs.

Purely as a hypothetical question... Do you think there's a feasible way to prioritize Haste > Crit > Mastery and leave out Arcane Shot all together? Now that we can cast Aimed Shot on the move, Arcane and Aimed basically do the same thing. Using Aimed 100% of the time would completely remove the complexity of the Careful Aim phase as you'd just be doing what you always do anyway.

[Puerto]

Purely as a hypothetical question... Do you think there's a feasible way to prioritize Haste > Crit > Mastery and leave out Arcane Shot all together? Now that we can cast Aimed Shot on the move, Arcane and Aimed basically do the same thing. Using Aimed 100% of the time would completely remove the complexity of the Careful Aim phase as you'd just be doing what you always do anyway.

Crit will always been number 1 for us. Right now, the 4 piece tier 14 bonus looks to be enough to hard cast aimed shots. I will reforge next time to check this out and see if its viable.

[Skygoneblue]

Crit will always been number 1 for us.

Just because of Piercing Shots? Or something else?

I'm not up on theorycrafting numbers much - I've always been curious why Crit is so important. It doesn't appear to synergize with much other than Piercing Shots, and Bombardment if you're spamming Multi-Shot. Just upon reading the MM skills, it "appears" that Haste would be much more important.

[Puerto]

Just because of Piercing Shots? Or something else?

I'm not up on theorycrafting numbers much - I've always been curious why Crit is so important. It doesn't appear to synergize with much other than Piercing Shots, and Bombardment if you're spamming Multi-Shot. Just upon reading the MM skills, it "appears" that Haste would be much more important.

Reason being... Crit effects our shots, auto attacks, and our pet way more than haste will.

[Xemik]

Just because of Piercing Shots? Or something else?

I'm not up on theorycrafting numbers much - I've always been curious why Crit is so important. It doesn't appear to synergize with much other than Piercing Shots, and Bombardment if you're spamming Multi-Shot. Just upon reading the MM skills, it "appears" that Haste would be much more important.

Piercing Shots and the chance for your attacks to do double damage seem like really good reasons crit is amazing

[Deleted]

1% haste is a theoretical 1% damage increase (taking CDs and other mathematical stuff its a bit less, but for all intents and purposes, call it 1%)
1% crit is theoretical 1% damage increase PLUS Piercing shots.

There's no reason to even delve deeper into that (we all know there more in it), it will only make haste look worse (haste has negatives that doesn't effect crit.)

[Glurp]

I'm wondering what other people are using as their opener as MM. I was trying out a few different things last night but this seems to work the best:

- Prepot + Precast Aimed Shot
- Dire Beast
- Stampede + Rapid Fire + Synapse Springs
- AMoC
- Steady Shot x2
- Serpent Sting
- Chimera Shot
- Glaive Toss
- Readiness + Dire Beast
- Steady Shot
- Chimera Shot
- Glaive Toss

[eschatological]

I'd push RF to right before the SS, you really don't need it earlier, and it might earn you another AiS.

I still think DB is meh for MM, I like Fervor a lot more.

[Deleted]

DB is almost pointless atm yes it does dps and focus gain BUT with fervor you can squeeze in an AI which does more dps also fervor helps a much more sturdy rotation cycle since it is not on GCD

Also during CA phase aka start of the fight drop GT completely it is a dps loss
for now highest net gain dps for me and my current haste plateau is

prepot + stampede
SrS
Chim
MofC
RF
2 AI

Readiness repeat and chuck in as many AIs as possible delaying chim till 2-3 seconds on SrS

[Saoron]

DB is almost pointless atm yes it does dps and focus gain BUT with fervor you can squeeze in an AI which does more dps also fervor helps a much more sturdy rotation cycle since it is not on GCD

Also during CA phase aka start of the fight drop GT completely it is a dps loss
for now highest net gain dps for me and my current haste plateau is

prepot + stampede
SrS
Chim
MofC
RF
2 AI

Readiness repeat and chuck in as many AIs as possible delaying chim till 2-3 seconds on SrS

Do you have any solid evidence supporting your claim ? If you're just going by FD then dropping GT is not a dps gain for everyone. For some it's a loss. I myself lose about ~500 dps if I drop GT.

And again, what base do you have for claiming DB is 'pointless' ? Just a 'feeling' ? It sims higher than fervor, granted that it gets full uptime.. i.e. pure single target. Logically speaking, yes fervor would give you more AiS during CA. But a fight is a lot more than just CA phase.. Overall DB seems to do more dmg, theoretically speaking.. So unless someone has the numbers to say otherwise, i'll stick to it.. Unless ofcourse like I said, there are parts of the fight where the DB won't get full uptime.. then fervor would be the best choice..

[Tehstool]

I'd push RF to right before the SS, you really don't need it earlier, and it might earn you another AiS.

I still think DB is meh for MM, I like Fervor a lot more.

Do RF after your SrS otherwise you will waste a GCD of your rapid fire and ultimately another AiS.

[eschatological]

I meant Steady Shot, which is why I said SS. Not Serpent Sting, for which I also use the acronym SrS.

IE, I'm telling him to push his RF one GCD later, not earlier.