Brutal Talisman vs Lei Shen trinket?

[Brakthir]

They seemed to have buffed the uptime for warriors as well. Had an average of 28-30% uptime on it tonight.

[meteo]

Sorry to break your bubble but you should be able to read your own logs...

Just looking at the kills you have 18-21.9% uptime. Not even close to your numbers.

[Recke]

Yea it would be better for dks I guess. I did my research on warriors and it was terrible.

Well, what I'm suggesting is it's not as bad as it seems (and it seemed really bad with that garbage proc chance).

[Brakthir]

Sorry to break your bubble but you should be able to read your own logs...

Just looking at the kills you have 18-21.9% uptime. Not even close to your numbers.

Wasn't in for a bunch of attempts/kills. On our Twin Consort attempts, it was 24% overall. I was looking at buff uptimes per attempt on Iron Qon (before I offered to sit), and it ranged from 26-28% on Skada.

[Famine]

Small sample base, but raid dummy testing is putting Spark of Zandalar at essentially a ~90 second ICD (86.57, to be exact but I figure over time that would creep up to a nice even 90 seconds per blizzards design).

That puts it at a 22.2repeating uptime. Over my mere 30 mins of tests, the shortest time between procs was 40 seconds; the longest was 123 seconds. When you reach 10 stacks, you lose them and gain a 20 seconds buff. You can begin to accumulate your next set of stacks while this buff is active.


For anyone super interested, here is the actual data from my short test:

Start 0 0 0 Time Between
2 0 120 120
3 10 190 70
4 40 280 90
5 51 351 71
7 9 429 78
8 26 506 77
10 4 604 98
Start 0 0 0
0 40 40 40
2 6 126 86
3 33 213 87
5 29 329 116
Start 0 0 0
0 57 57 57
2 48 168 111
4 7 247 79
5 28 328 81
7 13 433 105
9 16 556 123
10 48 648 92
12 16 736 88
13 23 803 67
14 51 891 88
16 27 987 96
17 38 1058 71


86.57

[Recke]

Small sample base, but raid dummy testing is putting Spark of Zandalar at essentially a ~90 second ICD (86.57, to be exact but I figure over time that would creep up to a nice even 90 seconds per blizzards design).

That puts it at a 22.2repeating uptime. Over my mere 30 mins of tests, the shortest time between procs was 40 seconds; the longest was 123 seconds. When you reach 10 stacks, you lose them and gain a 20 seconds buff. You can begin to accumulate your next set of stacks while this buff is active.


For anyone super interested, here is the actual data from my short test:

Start 0 0 0 Time Between
2 0 120 120
3 10 190 70
4 40 280 90
5 51 351 71
7 9 429 78
8 26 506 77
10 4 604 98
Start 0 0 0
0 40 40 40
2 6 126 86
3 33 213 87
5 29 329 116
Start 0 0 0
0 57 57 57
2 48 168 111
4 7 247 79
5 28 328 81
7 13 433 105
9 16 556 123
10 48 648 92
12 16 736 88
13 23 803 67
14 51 891 88
16 27 987 96
17 38 1058 71


86.57

Although I can't fully understand what your graph is representing, could be an error in how it was displayed on my browser. HOWEVER, there is no ICD. The whole point of the RPPM trinkets were to provide an average uptime similar to that of a trinket with an icd with the exception it's more random as well as is affected by other stats to provide increase value of them (ie haste).
Also, the average uptime of Spark of Zandalari isn't what you need to be concerned with. Having a 99% uptime of it just because it procs immediately after it falls of DOES NOT provide a dps gain. It's only when you reach 10 stacks. Now, it might be an error on your part, but you stated the shortest time between procs was 40 seconds? Does that means you never achieved greater than 2 stacks?

[Famine]

Although I can't fully understand what your graph is representing, could be an error in how it was displayed on my browser. HOWEVER, there is no ICD. The whole point of the RPPM trinkets were to provide an average uptime similar to that of a trinket with an icd with the exception it's more random as well as is affected by other stats to provide increase value of them (ie haste).
Also, the average uptime of Spark of Zandalari isn't what you need to be concerned with. Having a 99% uptime of it just because it procs immediately after it falls of DOES NOT provide a dps gain. It's only when you reach 10 stacks. Now, it might be an error on your part, but you stated the shortest time between procs was 40 seconds? Does that means you never achieved greater than 2 stacks?

Indeed the quick excel copy/paste formatted horribly. Sorry.

But yeah, my data was showing the time between receiving the 20 seconds troll transformation (10 stack). I didn't think anyone gave a hoot about how often I had 0-9 stacks :P Mainly I shared because my observed 'real life' data was exceptionally better than the piss-poor 'simulated value' i found on Askmrrobot/simcraft; and this was the night before they buffed it another 10%.

[Softbottom]

Is LFR Fabled feather of Ji Kun that bad?

[Darkfriend]

ew BIS Trinkets:
1: H Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun (0.9k above #2)
2: H Gaze of the Twins
3: N Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun
4: H Primordius's rage
5: N Gaze of the Twins
6: N Primordius's Rage
7: H Spark of Zandalar
8: H Lei Shen's Final Orders 2/2
9: Brutal Talisman of the Shado-pan - Only if you can handle the expertise.
10: LFR Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun
11: N Spark of Zandalar
12: H Lei Shen's Final Orders 0/2 (And 1/2)

Updated BiS trinket list, all credit goes to Collision.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...422422?page=76

[Recke]

ew BIS Trinkets:
1: H Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun (0.9k above #2)
2: H Gaze of the Twins
3: N Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun
4: H Primordius's rage
5: N Gaze of the Twins
6: N Primordius's Rage
7: H Spark of Zandalar
8: H Lei Shen's Final Orders 2/2
9: Brutal Talisman of the Shado-pan - Only if you can handle the expertise.
10: LFR Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun
11: N Spark of Zandalar
12: H Lei Shen's Final Orders 0/2 (And 1/2)

Updated BiS trinket list, all credit goes to Collision.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...422422?page=76

Don't suppose you can talk him into an Arms BiS trinket list. My only assumption is Gaze drops and Spark rises, but probably not by much.

[Sanguinerd]

Don't suppose you can talk him into an Arms BiS trinket list. My only assumption is Gaze drops and Spark rises, but probably not by much.

That be sweet wouldnt it

[Sinnermighty]

ew BIS Trinkets:
1: H Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun (0.9k above #2)
2: H Gaze of the Twins
3: N Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun
4: H Primordius's rage
5: N Gaze of the Twins
6: N Primordius's Rage
7: H Spark of Zandalar
8: H Lei Shen's Final Orders 2/2
9: Brutal Talisman of the Shado-pan - Only if you can handle the expertise.
10: LFR Fabled Feathers of Ji-kun
11: N Spark of Zandalar
12: H Lei Shen's Final Orders 0/2 (And 1/2)

Updated BiS trinket list, all credit goes to Collision.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...422422?page=76

I disagreed with Ji-kun trinket being better than Primordius initially with the patch, but after getting Heroic Ji-kun trinket /drool I'm liking it alot paired with Gaze.

[Darkfriend]

I disagreed with Ji-kun trinket being better than Primordius initially with the patch, but after getting Heroic Ji-kun trinket /drool I'm liking it alot paired with Gaze.

And I hate you now :P

[Brakthir]

That's okay, I still have a higher ilvl than sinner!

[Recke]

I disagreed with Ji-kun trinket being better than Primordius initially with the patch, but after getting Heroic Ji-kun trinket /drool I'm liking it alot paired with Gaze.

Sinner, shouldn't you be lending me your gear and going to that live concert in Florida or where ever it is/was?
I am jealous though. Only thing I've ever coined is Boots from Stone Guards:H first week I started raiding in MoP. No coined loot since, although Oondasta is blessing me with random 522 crit gear.

[Sinnermighty]

Sinner, shouldn't you be lending me your gear and going to that live concert in Florida or where ever it is/was?
I am jealous though. Only thing I've ever coined is Boots from Stone Guards:H first week I started raiding in MoP. No coined loot since, although Oondasta is blessing me with random 522 crit gear.

Ultra Music Festival! Weekend 2 starts on friday ;(

I do hope someone can eventually pick up H Primordius & H Ji-kun and compare the two trinkets when paired with H Gaze. (Replace H with all N or TF or HTF obv). I won't be picking it up though unless I coin it which won't be likely as I can save my coins for other bosses.

[Pippo89]

0/2 Relic still better than LFR Lei Shen?

[Sarosnar]

I completely disagree with Jikun being better that primordius.

First of all primordius is giving better stats considering base stats + average str of the proc.
Secondly JiKun won't beas effective on a pull when you generally use all your opening burst ...

0/2 Relic still better than LFR Lei Shen?

Yes.

[Recke]

I completely disagree with Jikun being better that primordius.

First of all primordius is giving better stats considering base stats + average str of the proc.
Secondly JiKun won't beas effective on a pull when you generally use all your opening burst ...

(don't feel like deleting this since it' pertinent to the actual topic at hand but I wasn't paying attention to the trinket mentioned.)
I kind of agree with the first part, however we are talking ~33% uptime of 1333x10/2(6665strength) vs ~20% uptime of 8800 strength.
6665/3= ~2222 strength average.
8800/5= ~1760 strength average.
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-xh...?s=1757&e=2169 (feathers on a fury warrior ((first one I found)))
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ws...?s=2339&e=2819 (valor trinket on a fury warrior ((first one I found)))

Secondly, I ran some sims (have subpar uptime of feathers compared to live logs) and Feather+Gaze was a minute, but definitive dps gain over Feather+Talisman and Talisman+Gaze was 2k dps drop from either.

In terms of Primordius' Talisman of Rage, simmed and via logs it has a 45% uptime with a wide margin gap (sometimes below 40%, sometimes in the high 50%s). This is for at least 1 stack, so 1538 strength. It CAN stack multiple times and obviously improve the benefit of the trinket. However, I'll take the average of 2 stacks since the logs I'm using seem to average out to that (it has a period of 5 stack, a couple of 3 stacks, but mostly 1 stacks). So, ~45% uptime of 3076 strength.
3076/~2= ~1538 strength average.
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-d4...?s=1291&e=1628 (rampage on a fury warrior ((first one I found)))

Using logs, Talisman is seemingly weak. Yes, it has flat 1467 crit instead of 1467 hit/exp which is really 586 crit and 881 hit/exp, so only 881 primary stat smaller, which if the stat is utilized, ie not overly excess in reaching the cap, then you gain more than you lose.

[Xanthan]

1333*10/2 is a slight underapproximation for feather's value. The average is: (first term + last term)/2. The normal version of the trinket was also stealth buffed to 1600 str/stack instead of 1333. I would think the TF and HC options received the same 20% buff, but I don't know for sure. So the average benefit for the trinket per proc is 1600*11/2 = 8800 str, or ~2933 str on average given its uptime.