Rogues are absurd

[Boricha]

If they open on you with Shadow dance and Shadow blades, trinket it. If they don't, sit it. Yeah rogues have the burst to kill you in a stun, most classes do. If you can't see his cds are popped because of subterfuge, shadow blades makes a very distinct noise and your health will be dropping in chunks. He also may have been gemming full PvP power to get big crits, which is pretty common in battle grounds as opposed to resil gemming in a rated setting.

[rnbwtrout]

well...they said they wanted to give rogues more burst. guess they musta got it right.

patch 5.2 - the comeback of RMP in arenas.

[arden714]

You shouldn't die if you have that much resil. I have less and I survive the opening stun lock without trinketing every time. Yes I'll die soon after because he is way ahead by that point. But that's the nature of 1v1 vs a rogue, if they get the jump and know how to play, you're dead.

[Deleted]

Rogues are still bad(aren't as good as before).

Seriously and honestly GO F**K YOUR SELF, rogues were almost fine before (maybe 1 or 2 surv buffs) but now are a fucking joke, on my crap geared rogue i can destroy ppl, not to mention that as a caster you cant do almost anything against them (much like monks) especially with that retarded suriken toss/deadly throw combo (are you kidding me? 2 interrupts from which one ranged and up every 3 globals????? fucking idiot on blizz that thought that).
So yeah



Image Removed

Please try to be more civil, I know it's a sensitive topic.

[junn]

Watched Snutz stream last night where a random RMP farmed Snutz, Venruki (on his WW monk) and Sodah. Sodah's comment was something along the lines of "I just dont think we can win this".

While I do think rogues were slighthly overbuffed, I think RMP will be retarded this season due to how well the 3 synergize. Not necessarily like KFC was strong just because warriors were retarded and hunters happened to compliment them.

[Valedus]

Rogues have become absurd.

I play a WW monk (aka Lolwalker or Windlol this patch due to GC's buffs in order to increase the representiveness in pvp, that turned out to be nerfs or tweaks/sidegrades at best, but then you can't really accuse Blizzard of making sense). My gear is an asortment of dreadful and malev, with pvp weapons, and my resilience is slightly above 66%.

I was in AV guarding a tower when this rogue passed by on a battlemaster mount (so I guess he had at least some clue about pvp and good gear too). I opened with ranged paralysis to stop him (my gap closer as I prefer to keep the actual gap closers as anti-kiting tools). When I got near him he instantly vanished and cheap shotted me (he also had subterfuge as he didn't come out of stealth for 3 seconds) and...then I died. I actually got raped in 3 fucking seconds before the stun even wore off. I didn't think such a thing was possible.

No, I don't care how many cds he popped, no class in the game should be able to drop another in 3 seconds. Not even warriors in 5.0 were capable of this, and warriors got nerfed because they put out too burst much damage. How exactly does it serve balance when you exchange one class' absurd performance for another ?!

I don't expect to be able to win against a better geared and more experienced player, like he obviously was, but to die in 3 seconds while even being unable to respond ?! That's not what pvp should be about. Already, pvp in this game seems to be about denying the opponent control over his character for as long as possible, which is a stupid way to balance pvp around, last thing the game needs is classes that can do that while nuking an opponent from 100% to 0% though a good amount of resilience.

PS: In before
L2p
Lol 1v1
Rogues are fine
But I can't kill warriors, boo-hoo

You play a class weak against stuns. Use nimble brew. Warriors in 5.0 were very capable of this. Also... I doubt he even killed you in 3 seconds. That's not even enough time to use a finisher.

Use your new tool to deal with being stunlocked, and Ring of Peace/Leg Sweep. Or Touch of Karma. Or Grapple Weapon. Or build chi and use Fists of Fury. Monk v Rogue 1v1 is actually an interesting duel.

Edit: I'm not saying Rogues are fine, but you didn't die in 3 seconds. The only REAL nerf I can tell so far that Rogues need is a 10 second CD on Deadly Throw.

[Gnu]

I think people are whining so much about rogues just because we were so pathetic in the last season.

I'm still getting depoped by warlocks, warriors, mages etc.. if I'm caught without trinket. It's the state of the game at the moment. Ferals and hunters are also pulling huge numbers.

As for ccs yeah rogues have cheap shot and kidney that have diminishing returns unlike fears/howl of terror and mortal coil that last actually longer, so that's definitely not the worst.

Anyway, all this complaining was to be expected I guess.

edit: to be a bit more accurate

[Valedus]

and how can we know that the rogue used all he's CDs, if we can't even see him due to the 3 second stealth he has after starting combat?

---------- Post added 2013-03-08 at 09:46 PM ----------

Also, this is a perfect example of how Blizzard doesn't have any clue how to actually fix PvP. I mean, wth, they started the PTR patch notes for this new patch with frost mage nerfs, but it ended up with a buff to them instead. More dmg on frostbolt, 1 sec longer deep freeze, or a deep freeze off the GCD with the same duration as before, I mean wtf? other classes would have to choose to either have the same "long" duration, OR get it off the GCD, but not mages, they shouldn't be nerfed in anyway.
Same with rogues, they where NOT bad, they just suffered from to many FOTM rerollers from the end of Cata where they were OP, to a balanced class that took skills to master. Unfortunatly, Blizz don't want mages and rogues to be anything BUT OP, and certainly not to take any skill to play.

Rogues were pretty fn terrible last season. If you died to a S12 rogue, I don't know what to say. There are plenty of good rogues out there. They had negligible Gladiator representation, and hit like wet noodles and were easier to kite than a kite itself.

---------- Post added 2013-03-08 at 06:26 PM ----------

What's so absurd about a 5s cheapshot into a 2.5s cheapshot? It's not like it's so OP that it needs to be nerfed like 3s warbringer into 4s shockwave was. Obviously 7.5s of stun from stealth is so avoidable it makes it fair compared to 7s of stun from a charging warrior...

and clearly having your entire team cheapshotted by 1 rogue is fair because they had to talent for it. Talents are hard.


If GC was being fair, like that will ever happen, cheapshot would have a 45s CD. Garrote would have a 1min CD. Vanish wouldnt be an immunity. CloS would have a 2min CD. And Feint would have a 2min CD.

And rogues would be the worst pvp class in the game. Also, if you are going to make Cheapshot have a 45 second CD... then take off all resource requirements... oh wait, you just made it EASIER for them to kill you.

[Djaye]

I think people are whining so much about rogues just because we were so pathetic in the last season.

I'm still getting depoped by warlocks, warriors, mages etc.. if I'm caught without trinket. It's the state of the game at the moment. Ferals and hunters are also pulling huge numbers.

As for ccs yeah rogues have cheap shot and kidney that have diminishing returns unlike fears that last actually longer, so that's definitely not the worst.

Anyway, all this complaining was to be expected I guess.

fears have dr's

[Crunkosaurus]

I think the only thing that needs changing is shuriken toss, there is no point of roots and snares against rogues if they can do almost as much damage ranged then they can upclose. Might as well just give them lay on hands and let them kidney from 30 yds away....

[Deleted]

Rogues are still bad(aren't as good as before).

lol what? you only played rogue in 4.3 or ?

[Flaks]

I think people are whining so much about rogues just because we were so pathetic in the last season.

I remember reading these exact words from warrior in 5.0. They weren't valid then for warriors. And they aren't valid now for rogues. Warriors were fucking broken in 5.0 even worse than rogues are now. But rogues right now are still at a more op state then they were with legendary daggers in 4.3. The only worse two consecutive seasons we've had before were s5 and s6 with dks.

[pkm]

Did you check the combat log?

[Deleted]

rogues are fine, get some resil

Wrong they over tuned them massively, they went from having low survivability to being annoying to kill and went from mediocre damage to high damage, guarentee one of the highest glad representations this season WILL be rogues.

[Ghul]

rogues are player killers, deal with it?

"hey i wanna kill other players as good as possible, hmm wich class to choose?! the holy paladin who spends more time reading books than anything? the calm monks? the brittle mages? or MAYBE the born assassin, aka the rogue?!"

[jonoy8]

Wrong they over tuned them massively, they went from having low survivability to being annoying to kill and went from mediocre damage to high damage, guarentee one of the highest glad representations this season WILL be rogues.

so rogues not sucking ass is "over tuned"

[Hedleyazg]

Rogues aren't free kills anymore and now the not so good PvPers complain about it. Not surprised at all.

[Myci]

Wow isnt balanced for 1v1. Wait and see how it is in 3s. I can see rogue being insanely good in some comps( rmp, dancing with the stars) buuut i think that might be more from how mages are and how op beam ina vortex bomb will be. Calling something op when your not even fully geared yourself based on a 1v1 is silly.

[Darkrulerxxx]

Rogue pvp in 5.2 is a highly complicated issue. i feel like their damage output is right where it should be because their weakness is that they are still squishy as hell and can be bursted down quite quickly

One thing that definitely needs to be fixed is there ranged shuriken throw.... it does way too much damage and honestly i feel that rogues already have sprint/shadowstep/prep to definitely close in on their enemies, they need to reduce the damage on that ranged attack. otherwise they are fine.

[Tripz]

Rogues aren't free kills anymore and now the not so good PvPers complain about it. Not surprised at all.

Thank you!!!

OP just try harder... grapple weapon, Touch of karma (This is a Huuuuge one) fly away if you must, as a rogue, I would recommend trinketing the Cheap Shot, between cheap shot and the 5 point whatever is a little space of time in which you should take advantage of, dont Ever EVER blame a class for your lack of knowledge, especially about rogues, people will put it off as more QQ for the fire