AH "really hurt the game" - Wilson

[Coronius]

I would reinstall the game if AH was turned off. That is all.

[Arlon]

Every single problem with the game has been pointed out on the forums during beta. Im not really sure on who are the morons pulling the strings on this game. Wilson is unprofessional and has some deep issues, judging by his facebook tantrums(I can´t imagine how someone like him got to his position, it´s ridiculous). But... A one man cant really ruin the whole direction of the game, theres bound to be people who would object to retardet design decisions.

I honestly can´t believe this game got the sales that it did, it´s such a mess.

[Deleted]

If they remove the AH, atleast RMAH, then I will come back to D3. It was one of the only things I held against it, but if that's gone then I can't wait.

[traen]

Shrug, you're basically argueing because you desperately want to disagree, so I'm going to end this here.

I'm sorry, but I'm not arguing just to argue. I believe in what I say and if you don't understand my arguments you probably need to reread my posts and spend some time thinking about it and doing some calculations.[/QUOTE]

- You defend your position based on falsified info (You literally can't finish the game with only items you find. It might be possible in SC, although it will take time, but it will be nearly impossible on HC. But than again, both our arguments lack proof of this.)

You are talking to a person who started a self-funded character and finished the game without using AH.
We started playing immediately after blizzard implemented crafted gear to the game. There were 3 of us initially - monk(me), sorceress and witch doctor. Witch doctor got bored half way, but two of us managed to beat the diablo just after 50 hours of playtime. Pretty much nothing.

My self-funded hardcore warrior is currently at paragon lvl 14 farming act1 (I'm still a little bit afraid of the butcher). Doing pretty good actually, but my friends are not much into hardcore and playing solo is boring and dangerous.

Playing without AH is a MASSIVE fun. You see upgrades in the loot, you learn to VALUE the items that drop. If there is INT+STR on gear you say "whoot, I have 10 more +allres for free!"
There was no day when we did not find an upgrade for at least one of us.
Gold is a massive issue because you need damn a lot of gold for crafts and you can't just take one of the items and sell it for 10kk on AH. So we were more than happy to see +gold% on items.

My own oppinion - if you never played self-funded character you will never understand this game the way it was designed.
Go for it, it's totally different game, It's a challenge and I guarantee that you'll enjoy it. Just don't forget to take a friend or two.

And besides that, you really are completely wrong about Diablo II. I even wonder if you actually played it. Top of the line gear was not *just* acquired by just playing. Some basic uniques could be easily farmed, but the rare and really good ones came at the expense of hundreds of hours farming Baal and more often than not the citdel around it. After 6 years, I had about 6 completed runewords, all found by me. There was no way to get those easily without trading.

Are you trying to say that d2 itemization was better because there was no item farming, just rune farming?
I'm just trying to understand your position.

[DakonBlackblade]

I'm sorry, but I'm not arguing just to argue. I believe in what I say and if you don't understand my arguments you probably need to reread my posts and spend some time thinking about it and doing some calculations.

You are talking to a person who started a self-funded character and finished the game without using AH.
We started playing immediately after blizzard implemented crafted gear to the game. There were 3 of us initially - monk(me), sorceress and witch doctor. Witch doctor got bored half way, but two of us managed to beat the diablo just after 50 hours of playtime. Pretty much nothing.

My self-funded hardcore warrior is currently at paragon lvl 14 farming act1 (I'm still a little bit afraid of the butcher). Doing pretty good actually, but my friends are not much into hardcore and playing solo is boring and dangerous.

Playing without AH is a MASSIVE fun. You see upgrades in the loot, you learn to VALUE the items that drop. If there is INT+STR on gear you say "whoot, I have 10 more +allres for free!"
There was no day when we did not find an upgrade for at least one of us.
Gold is a massive issue because you need damn a lot of gold for crafts and you can't just take one of the items and sell it for 10kk on AH. So we were more than happy to see +gold% on items.

My own oppinion - if you never played self-funded character you will never understand this game the way it was designed.
Go for it, it's totally different game, It's a challenge and I guarantee that you'll enjoy it. Just don't forget to take a friend or two.




Are you trying to say that d2 itemization was better because there was no item farming, just rune farming?
I'm just trying to understand your position.

Sorry man but you either full of crap or the luckiest person on the planet. I played the game for over 100 hours with my monk, farmed to no end and never got 1 iten that would be considered half decent for my own class/spec. I found good stuf just never anything remotedly usefull for myself. This was pre paragon levels and monster power patch tough, I never played after they introduced that so maybe its changed now but I realy doubt it.

[Vespian]

edit: misread.

Shrug. He's not lucky, he's playing a 3-man funded char. That's 3 times the loot. Not selfsustained. Not solo, 3.

And I too played about 80 hours on HC (lost my 59 Witchdoctor due to server lag, *shit hurt*)

D2 uniques were also itemized properly. Read everything if you bother to read it. Runewords are just one example.

Anyways, main point is; Don't talk about selfsustained when you never played solo!? Because you didn't. And I think about 8milion people would like to have a word with you about how great the loot is you get aaaaall the time.

[Galluccio]

Would you care to expand on this? Calling it a bad game but not backing that up by any facts at all is really silly and gives you no credibility.

It's a bad game. I called it quits at level 21. And, my friends called it quits around that time as well. I tried it again this week and didn't last long. I'm not going to list any facts other than it's a bad game. No other facts are necessary.

ultima forever which just got released for the ipad is probably 1/2 as good as Diablo. An ipad game... lol.

[traen]

Sorry man but you either full of crap or the luckiest person on the planet. I played the game for over 100 hours with my monk, farmed to no end and never got 1 iten that would be considered half decent for my own class/spec. I found good stuf just never anything remotedly usefull for myself. This was pre paragon levels and monster power patch tough, I never played after they introduced that so maybe its changed now but I realy doubt it.

Stop whining.
You don't really care about anything, all you do is whining about how grass was greener before.

I tried and I made it. You sit there whining and bashing other people so you did not achieve anything.

edit: misread.

Shrug. He's not lucky, he's playing a 3-man funded char. That's 3 times the loot. Not selfsustained. Not solo, 3.

Well, sorry for having friends and not playing multiplayer game solo.

And it was 2-man. Third player left around late 50-th. So 2 times more loot.
Double the time spent - 100 hours to beat the game. I spent more time to beat Skyrim.
Thousands of players currently playing have 1000+ hours played and even significantly more than that.

Anyways, main point is; Don't talk about selfsustained when you never played solo!? Because you didn't. And I think about 8milion people would like to have a word with you about how great the loot is you get aaaaall the time.

No. I did not play solo. I just did not use AH.
But if you don't see my point we have nothing to talk about.

- - - Updated - - -

ultima forever which just got released for the ipad is probably 1/2 as good as Diablo. An ipad game... lol.

Your ipad got 50 times more cpu power, 60 times more memory and higher display resolution than computers we used to play Ultima Online back in 98-+. And it's thousands times more powerful than computers that were used to play other games of the series.
So why "an ipad game" would be bad?

Ultima Online can probably be still played on P2-266 cpu with 16M of memory. And it's still better than half of the mmorpgs on the market.
It' not about platform resources, it's about how lazy developers are.

So how good is this ipad Ultima? Worth playing?

[Deleted]

Diablo3 - the only game you win by being at work.

[Filipse]

AH or not, it sadly doesnt change the fact that the game just isnt anywhere near it's precursors, it just lacks the repeatability value that the earlier games had for reasons i cannot truly explain into words.

PS - I'll never buy that the "Lord of Terror" would stop inmid fighting just to pull off a pointless dialog that
serves no purpose whatsoever.

[Grummgug]

For those who haven't seen it yet, AlKaiser and Kripparian did a pseudo review of D3 in this video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A996VTAWqyU

They summed up the problems pretty well:

1. PvP is terrible
2. The most efficient way to play D3 is to play the auction house. You try to find steal deals on the AH, buy them, then relist them at higher prices. You make gold and gear up that way. It is too inefficient to actually grind for gold or gear. You will gear up faster by playing the AH.
3. When you finish gearing up via the AH, there is no point in playing your character because you are too overpowered. Nothing will be a challenge for you.

This is not an ARPG. Its an auction house simulator.

[Waynhim]

No, AH didn't ruin the game. The fact that you had to spend hours upon hours on the AH to progress in Inferno (on HC) at release did. At least for me it's what me made me quit the first time.

After I sort of returned, (in lack of better games to play), I played through SC, and it took me like 2 mill gold to get kitted for Inferno clear. The chanses of getting something worthwhile either for your own character or something to sell/(trade) for an upgrade, (to the stuff I bought cheapy on AH), is so slim that I went back to HC.

In D2 I made characters around items I found, etheral/self repairing pikes, cruel 260'ish% IAS socketed fast bow for strafeazon etc., it seems to me that this is an aspect that D3 miss.

[Vespian]

No, AH didn't ruin the game. The fact that you had to spend hours upon hours on the AH to progress in Inferno (on HC) at release did. At least for me it's what me made me quit the first time.

So no it didn't and yes it did in one sentence gj.

[Deleted]

The AH has to go, plain and simple, but if the loot system isn't completely reworked this would only make things worse.
The playstyle is good (even if D2 ability system was better), but the game hasn't replayabilty value. I don't play these days because I feel like I'm not doing any progress apart from Paragon leveling, which I find extremely boring. At least, if those PL were made account-wide, I would have more fun playing different classes.

[Orangetai420]

D3 needs a ladder mode with no AH.

[Vook]

The problem isn't the AH itself, it's that the AH is far too convenient. Only difference between AH and manually trading is time.

AH, you just log on, search what you want, and buy it. Trading, you sit in a chat channel/forum and spam "WTB" for hours, then buy it.

AH is just too convenient/efficient for its own good.

[traen]

No, AH didn't ruin the game. The fact that you had to spend hours upon hours on the AH to progress in Inferno (on HC) at release did. At least for me it's what me made me quit the first time.

So you quit because of the AH, did not you?

The best thing about inferno in d3 at release was that it was designed to be hard. You was supposed to spend months going through it, and even more than that on hardcore.
d2 had 3 difficulties and people(me as well) used to say "We want even harder difficulty, give us something to do after beating hell". And I guess not too many people would argue that it was an awesome idea.

And blizzard did it! They added 4-th, inferno difficulty. And it was awesomely hard.
3 weeks passed. Baddies who are used to get everything without doing anything nowadays whined, and whined and whined. And blizzard nerfed the difficulty to the ground. Difficulty#4 became easier than difficulty #3 from the previous game. What was the point of adding 4 difficulties instead of 3? It still beats me.

The game lost it's major goal - to beat the inferno, to kill the final boss. Gearing became pointless, now it's all about increasing numbers on your stats page.

The question is if you left the game because AH ruined the game, or did you left the game because you was one of those baddies who were so afraid of the difficulties that they forced blizzard to ruin the game by nerfing it?

In D2 I made characters around items I found, etheral/self repairing pikes, cruel 260'ish% IAS socketed fast bow for strafeazon etc., it seems to me that this is an aspect that D3 miss.

[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but you probably played d2 solo, without trading.
Because getting ethereal/self repairing items was not even remotely a problem in d2. Trade forums allowed you to get any item you wanted fast and cheap.

I found an awesome legendary item in d3 recently. About 50m worth probably. If I played solo, I would've leveled a character for it. But am not playing solo. I'll sell it and buy an upgrade for my current character.
Just like I traded ethereal javelins and whatever else items I did not need in d2 to get upgrades for my current character.

So you are not describing the difference between d2 and d3. You are describing the difference between solo game and multiplayer game.
If you miss this aspect from d2, you can get it right away in d3 without pretty much doing anything - just stop using AH.

[Tzalix]

- You defend your position based on falsified info (You literally can't finish the game with only items you find. It might be possible in SC, although it will take time, but it will be nearly impossible on HC. But than again, both our arguments lack proof of this.)

This is an argument I do not understand.

Yes, it is very possible to finish the game with only items you find. I've done it. Obviously the first people who finished the game did it. You have two options in Diablo 3:

1. Use the AH. It will very much speed up the game and take a lot of the challenge out of it.
2. Don't use the AH. The game will take longer to complete, and will be quite challenging. But not impossible.

So you just have to ask yourself, do you want to complete the game, is having the awesome gear all that matters to you, then great, go with option 1. If you want a challenge, option 2 is right there for you.

[Vespian]

This is an argument I do not understand.

Yes, it is very possible to finish the game with only items you find. I've done it. Obviously the first people who finished the game did it. You have two options in Diablo 3:

1. Use the AH. It will very much speed up the game and take a lot of the challenge out of it.
2. Don't use the AH. The game will take longer to complete, and will be quite challenging. But not impossible.

So you just have to ask yourself, do you want to complete the game, is having the awesome gear all that matters to you, then great, go with option 1. If you want a challenge, option 2 is right there for you.

My only response to this is look at one of the posters above you. "AH is too convenient". All I personally have to add is, the AH is too convenient ^100.

There's a point where market convenience starts outcompeting solo farming. When (and I still can't fathom how some of you apparently find one after the other awesome rare, according to those accounts up above) I'm currently on my third character, which is now level 39 or 40 and I have a barb that's lvl 52 or 3 or 4 and my previous, but dead, Witch Doctor, which was lvl 59 pre-nerf (screw you lag) and mostly 3-man-sustained (with 3 people playing mind you), that haven't been able to find anything useful for a sum of about 150 levels (I forgot my Wizard, lvl 48).

So there comes the term unlucky again. But we all know, even the fiercest fanboi of Diablo III knows this, that it's the main argument against the game in its current form. Everyone I talk to, that's not wearing blinds, quickly got tired of never getting anything useful from drops.

Noone is saying that everything should just automatically drop.

Granted, some might have finished it, but I could go out and collect all those forum posts back then, about how they had to run back to town and reroll the host to get better mob packs. If the game would have one single instance of content, without variety, no one would have been able to get past an elite pack of mindflayers.

[traen]

I'm currently on my third character, which is now level 39 or 40 and I have a barb that's lvl 52 or 3 or 4 and my previous, but dead, Witch Doctor, which was lvl 59 pre-nerf (screw you lag) and mostly 3-man-sustained (with 3 people playing mind you), that haven't been able to find anything useful for a sum of about 150 levels (I forgot my Wizard, lvl 48).

Rubbish. How did you managed to level up to 59 if you did not find anything useful? You would've died around 30-th tops.

Everyone I talk to, that's not wearing blinds, quickly got tired of never getting anything useful from drops.

You talked to me. And I never said that. Good items drop for me all the time.

Granted, some might have finished it, but I could go out and collect all those forum posts back then, about how they had to run back to town and reroll the host to get better mob packs.

Good games must be hard. D3 was hard at start and it was good.
Not any more though. Monster damage was nerfed by 100-200%, monster HP was nerfed by 200-300%. Elite packs were nerfed to the ground - bad suffixes were removed, annoying suffix combinations were removed, elite packs don't reset their HP when you run away from them, elite packs don't enrage any more when you fight them too long.

If they managed to beat the game almost naked after just few days of farming and you can't do this after all these nerfs, with 20-50x increased item drop AND with the implementation of absolutely insane crafted items, there is something wrong with you, not with the game.