shadowcleave as frost

[valliant13]

I'm going to post this here, if it's not suited for this I would like to request a mod to move it to the pvp section. I just wanted to ask fellow DKs about this comp.

So as the title sais is shadowcleave decent with the DK being frost or should I force myself unholy(I have tried and for some reason i just suck at unholy pvp).

I would rather stay frost as it's what I feel most comfortable with. Hoping to hear from people who are doing this comp this season with an FDK over an UhDK.

Thanks.

[Ebonheart]

I'm going to post this here, if it's not suited for this I would like to request a mod to move it to the pvp section. I just wanted to ask fellow DKs about this comp.

So as the title sais is shadowcleave decent with the DK being frost or should I force myself unholy(I have tried and for some reason i just suck at unholy pvp).

I would rather stay frost as it's what I feel most comfortable with. Hoping to hear from people who are doing this comp this season with an FDK over an UhDK.

Thanks.

Its not impossible, but if the fight goes on for too long you have it totally against you. Frost Death Knights have low survivability compared to Unholy Death Knights. I've seen some Frost Death Knights that sit in Blood Presence and use conversion, but then they are forfeiting Frost Strike which is your pressure damage. It just wouldn't make much sense really. You would probably be dragging your team down cause the opposing team will surely target you first and you will fall.

Shadowcleave has a lot going for it cause of the damage of the DoTs and the pressure that comes from the classes. Unholy Death Knights get a passive buff to both their diseases.

[Hand Banana]

First off, you say shadowcleave but do you mean with an spriest or with a lock? If your running with a lock like you suggest then you are going to be focused and killed with not much chance if your frost. Any thugcleave or rogue team in general will have you on your heels and most likely kill you in no time flat as frost. Unholy is more survivable and can rely on dot and pet damage even when defensive.

Now, if you have an spriest, you are alot more tanky because of the rediculous offheals and utility an spriest brings. In that case frost is more viable but still worse than unholy imo purely because of the spread damage unholy brings. Shadowcleave isnt going to nuke 1 target compared to like thugcleave its more reliant on wearing down teams and forcing pressure on healers. Unholy is way better off for this role.

[valliant13]

First off, you say shadowcleave but do you mean with an spriest or with a lock? If your running with a lock like you suggest then you are going to be focused and killed with not much chance if your frost. Any thugcleave or rogue team in general will have you on your heels and most likely kill you in no time flat as frost. Unholy is more survivable and can rely on dot and pet damage even when defensive.

Now, if you have an spriest, you are alot more tanky because of the rediculous offheals and utility an spriest brings. In that case frost is more viable but still worse than unholy imo purely because of the spread damage unholy brings. Shadowcleave isnt going to nuke 1 target compared to like thugcleave its more reliant on wearing down teams and forcing pressure on healers. Unholy is way better off for this role.

unholy dk spriest healer is unholyplay. Scleave is usually a lock :P.

Anyways, my issue is not knowing how to efficiently play unholy in pvp..I try doing it in 2s and get stomped because im that bad at it. When im frost I win a lot more frequently/have less user error/user gameplay problems

[Deleted]

Shadowcleave, which is with Lock would probably not work with Frost because it is about pressure, and they are just going to sit on you as frost, and you will be forced to be in Blood stance, not doing enough pressure. While Unholyplay with spriest could be possible with Frost, but both comps are probably just better of with Unholy currently. Although good Frost might make unholyplay work.

[danightryder]

Honestly unholy beats frost in "most" situations when it comes to the 3v3 bracket. Better survivability and overall more pressue due to your pets and dots doing damage while you are rooted or slowed, also you get a controled stun and an additional interrupt thanks to your pet charge while transformed. Unholy also puts up better necrotics and soul reaper if you manage to put it on during your burst and manage for it to tick as soon as the target is less than 35%. I've seen crits on 10k resil players getting killed from 30% ish hp.

Don't get me wrong, unholy isn't end all. You can still pull off some really good instagibs with frost. I'm just saying overall, unholy is just better for arena. I'd go frost for rbgs.

[valliant13]

so far thanks for the info everyone. Now I am not questioning any of you when I ask questions I simply just want to get a better understanding of unholy in a pvp sense. I can play it fine in pve...but so far its basically comparing apples to oranges for the spec when it comes to pve v pvp.

Most of you have replied that the survival is better, how so? From my basic understanding as unholy I have the same defensives a frost does, The only benefit it seems is I get the bonus pressure of a pet and my dots doing constant damage. I really want to just learn to play unholy but honestly I dont know why every time I try twos with is I look like a complete scrub. There was a team we lost to three teams in 2s so i said fuck it im going frost and then we dominated them. I just want to play the better spec for arena, I have no problem being frost for RBGs. Also if there are any good comps with a frosty I would love to know them so I can possibly recruit someone into the team of that class. Lastly, if someone could point me in the right direction of a really high quality guide to playing unholy as well as important macros. Google has given me dated sites and skill-capped costs money that I don't really have.

[Deleted]

Honestly, it would work as frost, however the play style will be completely different to what you would expect of shadowcleave. The comp will feel a lot more like WLS as a frost dk. This being said, try it out and just try to hit anything you can while your lock puts out AoE dot pressure (as you will be the one being focused, your lock will be able to get some massive dot pressure out). If your lock isn't afli though, dont even try.

[valliant13]

Honestly, it would work as frost, however the play style will be completely different to what you would expect of shadowcleave. The comp will feel a lot more like WLS as a frost dk. This being said, try it out and just try to hit anything you can while your lock puts out AoE dot pressure (as you will be the one being focused, your lock will be able to get some massive dot pressure out). If your lock isn't afli though, dont even try.

Right now the lock in my group went demo. We were winning pretty soundly too and he's pretty undergeared(i think five pieces of dreadful from last season). We hit 1600(not amazing i know) first day together so once we all get geared and on the same page im feeling this awkward version of scleave may do decent. The lock already wants to go affliction though so im trying to figure out keybinds and the like for unholy although UH is getting nerfed it seems for arena.

Either way my point of responding in general was to thank people for their input.

[marv333]

theres no point in playing SHADOWcleave as frost , it would work up to 1600 like you just said because any comps could work up to 1800 if the players have great communication and aren't complitely bad
However dont expect to beat the top tier teams ( thug cleave, RMP, godcomp/shatter play etc... )

also according to top players , there is no point in playing affliction lock over shadow priest this patch but this might change in 5.3