Please help find weak spots in my raid team.

[SephirothStrife]

Hello, I run the guild called the Chocobo Bandits on Thaurissan, and after a few heated attempts last night during our raid I thought I would come here for advice and suggestions. I'm going to attach a few logs hoping everyone can see where we are not performing to our best abilities.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-30ngm4dup17xnroo/

This is from our Ji-Kun kill. Our raid makeup is a dk and bear for tanks, paladin, shaman, and disc priest for our healers, rogue and dk for melee dps, and warlock, shadow priest, and hunter for our ranged dps. The paladin thinks that our healer is underperforming and spending too much time dps healing with atonement than anything else and his uptime on other stuff isn't high enough. Our dk dps is trying to figure out why his dps is dropping off so quickly. And our priest says that our pally's mana regen is too low because he doesn't melee. I personally just want the team to perform to their best abilities and co-exist so we can continue progressing.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-3uxvlsfjjckxlj7n/

And this log is from a few of our Durumu wipes, this is when people started to get heated against eachother.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k2b9tthapfqwpt2c/

And this is from our 1st farming night if you guys wanted to get a grasp of how things normally go. I'm mainly looking at how the healers can improve, if the dps can improve in any way and just to have our team work as a team instead of against eachother. These logs are just a bunch of numbers to me and I have a hard time wrapping my head around it hence coming here and seeking advice. For the people who do look through this, thank you for your time.

[clevin]

I'll look at the logs in a second, but you as RL need to tell everyone to shut the fuck up and make sure that THEY are performing as well as they can. Unless the pally knows disc why are they going on about the priests spell chocies? And vice versa too. Are your healers holding you back? Or are people standing in bad shit and dying to avoidable damage?

OK, your longest Durumu try... 4 of you died to EyeSore - the rogue, DK, priest and pally. Hello? What's the healer supposed to do there? The raid needs to stop standing in bad shit... (http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=2125&e=2551).

Should the pally melee more? Got me. Is the pally ooming? if so, that's an issue and perhaps they should melee more to pop regen up. If they're not OOMing (or if they're OOMing because others are taking a lot of avoidable damage that they need to heal), then why is the priest worried about it? Similarly, Atonement is usually a high percentage of healing for most disc priests... but instead of telling him or her what to do, focus on whether or not people are dying when they shouldn't. If the priest is charged with keeping a tank up, see if they are healing the tank (here's an example of what the disc priest healed on your Ji Kun kill: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...get/?source=4_) Amusingly, your shaman seems to be your best healer (at least on the long Durumu try) and from what you said they aren't bitching about anyone.

I don't heal on any of those classes so I'll let others dive into specifics, but everyone needs to start with paying attention to themselves, first and DPS (and tanks) need to make sure that they're not contributing to what can appear to be a healing issue by standing in fire or by (in the case of tanks) failing to use survivability abilities.

[Durahal]

Looks like healers are ooming because your entire raid is taking so much damage they shouldn't be taking.

[Deja Thoris]

You won't find answers in the logs.

Tell your people to work with each other instead of against each other. It sounds like you have a lot of immature people or big egos there. If they have stuff to say about each others performance then it needs to be constructive and appropriate. Yeah the disc atonements a lot and POM for instance is low. But if the pala is a dick about saying that then it just ends badly.

Improve the attitude and the numbers will improve. Also, move out of bad :P

[Xionyus]

I'm looking at your longest Durumu attempt. Eye Sore is the third most damaging ability and can easily be ignored. So you guys have a 'standing in the fire' issue. I'm not really the master of any class other than Hunter. I can try and look them over, even if they aren't the problem.

I can tell off the bat that he has issues keeping his DoTs up. His Serpent Sting and Black Arrow uptime are extremely low. I usually have my Serpent Sting around 85-90% uptime and Black Arrow around 60-65%. His is at 50% and 24% respectively. His Lock and Load procs are so low because he doesn't have Black Arrow up a lot of the time. Lock and Load is the heart of the survival spec. Your hunter also isn't using any potions at all (I don't know about you, but in my raid we all prepot and then pot again during the encounter). Also, this is just a suggestion. Dire Beast is alright, but I play survival as well (that's what spec the hunter in your raid is) and I recently switched over to the talent Fervor. Macro it to A Murder of Crows, then use the macro when both are off CD. You also should have Fervor on another key. Use it on cooldown if you have less than 40% focus. Then spam Explosive Shot, Glaive Toss, and then Arcane Shot a few more times.

I hope you can figure it out some of your problems and progress. Any minor changes help. Good luck. ^^

[Sesshou]

Honestly, your biggest liability looks like your rogue. He has by far the lowest survivability on Durumu and his damage is also kinda crap on everything in general. Specifically for Durumu his rupture/snd uptime is low (especially SnD, one attempt he lived for 99% of it and his SnD was only at 75% uptime). He isn't using his cooldowns for some reason either and is opting to sit on them which is dumb (you have a couple of pulls where he was alive for ~5 minutes and only used his 2 min cooldown once and his 3 min cooldown once).

[SephirothStrife]

Appreciate the feedback guys, going to have my raid team check out this topic and have a long sit-down chat with all of them on how we need to improve as a team. Sincerely appreciate you guys taking the time to looking at these logs for me. I'm hoping the issue in between the paladin and priest were just a heated exchange over attempts gone bad.

[Xionyus]

Appreciate the feedback guys, going to have my raid team check out this topic and have a long sit-down chat with all of them on how we need to improve as a team. Sincerely appreciate you guys taking the time to looking at these logs for me. I'm hoping the issue in between the paladin and priest were just a heated exchange over attempts gone bad.

If your Hunter has any questions, let me know. I can sit down and talk with them to help improve. ^^

[Deleted]

This is from our Ji-Kun kill. Our raid makeup is a dk and bear for tanks, paladin, shaman, and disc priest for our healers, rogue and dk for melee dps, and warlock, shadow priest, and hunter for our ranged dps. The paladin thinks that our healer is underperforming and spending too much time dps healing with atonement than anything else and his uptime on other stuff isn't high enough. Our dk dps is trying to figure out why his dps is dropping off so quickly. And our priest says that our pally's mana regen is too low because he doesn't melee. I personally just want the team to perform to their best abilities and co-exist so we can continue progressing.

I don't really have the time to browse through logs and armories to find what all your players are doing wrong (I might do that tomorrow), by a quick glance there's a lot: almost everyone is pulling abyssmal dps, especially your tanks=you, you are 3 healing stuff, yet people are dying from healable damage, etc. I just figured I'd mention that these things your raiders mentioned surely aren't what's causing the issues. Disc should atonement A LOT (if anything I think your disc has too little atonement healing, solace and penance should be used on cd most of the time), paladins generally don't need to run around meleeing and your dks sustained damage is hardly worse than the rest of your raids. The fact that your raiders actually stomach to blame others when they perform like this should honestly piss you off.

[Flalia4]

Well problem 1 is you don't have a warrior. That brings all raid group's down. But seriously the only thing I noticed was what Xionyus said.

[NeverStop]

Too much Eye Sore damage. You will never kill Durumu if at least 1 person dies on every maze.

[SephirothStrife]

Yeah i know, hoping people get the hang of not standing in crap. I'll just resort to yelling at them more I switched my reforges around to make sure i'm hit/exp soft capped and I just think I feel a lot more squishy, and i'm not noticing a dramatic increase in Scent of Blood procs, contemplating going back to the mastery/avoidence reforging. So as it stands right now, everyone needs to drastically improve? That is kinda the impression I'm getting from these posts. I don't mind constructive feedback mind you, thanks again

[Deleted]

Yeah i know, hoping people get the hang of not standing in crap. I'll just resort to yelling at them more I switched my reforges around to make sure i'm hit/exp soft capped and I just think I feel a lot more squishy, and i'm not noticing a dramatic increase in Scent of Blood procs, contemplating going back to the mastery/avoidence reforging. So as it stands right now, everyone needs to drastically improve? That is kinda the impression I'm getting from these posts. I don't mind constructive feedback mind you, thanks again

I'm gonna give you some advice from a different point of view since I'm currently raid leading myself as well.
I started raiding about four months ago in a second casual group of my current guild - while at the time I always heard stories about the "core" group pushing progress more I also heared stories about a lot more of yelling etc. I got asked quite a few time but I was glad to pass it since I didn't like the raiding/social atmosphere in that group. So two months later half of the core group disbanded cause of not standing it anymore due blaming, flaming, yelling etc.

Now since then I just rolled into leading the core group (or my GM was planning on it really subtile, I don't even know yet) and I really had to get used it.
Lucky for me I'm a teacher as occupation and I know quite some stuff about how to optimize group performing and improving individuals on a different level (each person is unique and has it own starters level/skills). The first rule is that you as a leader are the person that has to point out the borders, I personally don't even allow/try to avoid yelling in my raids because it will only frustrate and demotivate while raiding; people are only more afraid to fail and watching what others are doing instead of concentrating on themselves. You could try one of the things I'm trying to do:

* Start by just having a good social climate, we're raiding with ten people and all ten people like each other and we have a good atmosphere in vent and chat during raids, this allows people to make mistakes and even honestly admitting they did something wrong.
* You are the one securing the atmosphere borders during the raid, Some raiders are having some useless discussion at certain point but instead of involving myself I'm always just cutting it off - as a raid leader you're suppose to watch who succeeds or fails but also make sure that persons get another chance without being afraid of blowing it again.
* Give people responsibility; I'm mostly looking at the "overall raid awareness" from the raiders during the fight, I have 1 healer assigned who takes the lead over managing healer and cool downs during the fight. For Durumu I mark 2 people who (mostly) never fail on the maze phase so others that have trouble with moving can just simply follow them.
* When everyone feels they are involved and important to the group this will mostly take up everyones skill level without people even noticing it.
* Durumu is not exacly a dps race but more a survivability/coordination fight. We're two healing it on farm but we always make sure that we just don't fail on the maze phase - there is plenty of time to dps at the end of the phase when everyone is alive and in the other 2 phases.
* Talk with people outside raiding times about there performances and try to improve them by constructive advice and feedback (direct them to MMO, Icy-veins or even youtube videos

The last few weeks we had some really decent amount of applications and people are having a joy in the guild just because it's so social (even to non-raiders) and during the raids. In the future you will probably deal with replacing new people as well just as I had to do this week again due 2 non-active raiders cause of exams. All the new people stick to the guild and don't wanna think of leaving with the grant bonus that we're progressing greatly the last two weeks. New people have to feel comfortable to fit into the group and you will have a grant role in this process. Not all of this might be a useful for you but I hope I can assist you in anyway with these points if needed.

[Lunareste]

what the hell is your rogue doing?

Slice and Dice is the single most important buff rogues have, and anything less than 99.9% uptime is absolutely TERRIBLE. Same thing for Rupture; single most important debuff rogues have, and it should NEVER fall of for more than a second.

Quick tips for DRAMATICALLY improving DPS, because the rogue you have right now should be ashamed of himself/herself:

1. Cast Slice and Dice at the beginning of the fight, Envenom will refresh it for the rest of the fight.
2. Use Anticipation to generate combo points for free Ruptures; if you have less than 5 seconds left on the duration, get ready to spend combo points to refresh it
3. Use your damn cooldowns
4. Get RoguePowerBars
5. Stop standing in fire

[Serendepityz]

I see some problems in your druid tank tbh.
A. nearly 5x more Frenzied regens rather than savage defense especially on durumu where his tank mechanic reduces healing received making Frenzied regen garbage.
B. He is specced Nature's Vigil when he should be speccing heart of the wild. any fight that has tank downtime he just hits heart and Wrath spams for insane dmg OR in a really healing intense portion of a fight he can hit HoTW and run OP rejuv's on the entire raid IN BEAR FORM.

[SephirothStrife]

I'll have a chat with my bear tank and rogue about both of that stuff. Spartex my apologies but the "yelling at them" comment was partially in jest. While sometimes I do crack the whip and point out bad failure when I see it, I've become more relaxed with the raiding atmosphere and I think the team has benefited greatly from it. Our bear tank is pretty reasonable so I'll point out these facts and I'm sure he'll change his talents around, I'll also suggest our rogue to snag that addon and hopefully it'll help him keep track of all his buffs. Thanks again for all the suggestions, hopefully a few changes will really help our attempts out.

[Deleted]

I'll have a chat with my bear tank and rogue about both of that stuff. Spartex my apologies but the "yelling at them" comment was partially in jest. While sometimes I do crack the whip and point out bad failure when I see it, I've become more relaxed with the raiding atmosphere and I think the team has benefited greatly from it. Our bear tank is pretty reasonable so I'll point out these facts and I'm sure he'll change his talents around, I'll also suggest our rogue to snag that addon and hopefully it'll help him keep track of all his buffs. Thanks again for all the suggestions, hopefully a few changes will really help our attempts out.

No problem then my man - was just here to help you out, if you already have it sorted then that's even better news =)

[Neonkitza]

Well your priest could start using spirit shell on Durumu in light beam phase Everyone else should try to stay as close to the boss as they can, so it's easier for him to stack it on everyone. Also, be careful about life drain in 2nd and 3rd light beam phase, don't stand too close to the boss that people can't take it off of you. Good luck with your progress

[caant]

I was going to just look at your HPally since that's what i know best and was I only looked over your Dumuru wipes:
1. Beacon never swapped. You do a tank swap, the beacon should swap too. (longest wipe had 50.2% OH on beacon - swap that to the other tank, that number drops and eases healing. also - losing out on Tower of Radiance by using DL or FL if target doesn't have beacon, up to 6 possible holy power losses on longest attempt).
2. Hpally needs to stop using Light's Hammer on Dumuru. Holy prism is the proper choice here - can quickly top a tank after a hard stare/arterial cut.
3. Too much flash of light use, not enough holy radiance. HR generates holy power and is a more effective heal than flash. Also, less holy radiance = less daybreak procs.
4. if mana is an issue, he should melee for mana. not a ton of time to melee on this fight, but definitely enough to help regen. he did melee, but over 5 wipes, he got 93K mana back, my last kill, i got 132K mana back over 7:44. he could melee more.
5. no well fed buff...is he eating?
6. flask of the warm sun buff: number = 1, uptime = 0%. a) maybe he flasked before log started tracking, so maybe he did have the buff..... b) if he didnt flask before log started tracking, is he immediately cancelling the buff after using the flask? c) is he drinking the flask right before hearthing when raid ends leading to the 0% uptime? (too lazy to check what times he used it). (same thing on the "farming night")
7. on the dumuru wipe night: no potions drank (no mana regen needed?)

8. seeing as how the pally keeps getting those 6K mana innervates from the druid, there must be a mana problem...see issues above

[Deleted]

Since I'm a disc priest myself (~500 ilvl), I'll focus on yours mostly. I'll also restrict it to the Ji-kun kill, since I'm pretty familiar there and feel it's a good fight to judge whether ppl dodge crap properly. Looking at the logs he seems to be using the correct stuff, but I do notice a huge difference in # of casts for the following (my log can be found here):

• PW: Solace (98 vs 212!)
• Prayer of Mending (11 vs 21)
• Prayer of Healing (15 vs 23)

There should be no excuse for such a low uptime on solace (it's a free smart heal that also gives mana), so he should improve that. Since I only use the other 2 spells for quil healing, a low uptime might just mean the extra healing isn't needed. If ppl are dropping low (or even dying) during quils however, he should improve uptime on these spells.

I also notice he has a lower uptime on Evangelism. My uptime is almost 100% since I only pop Archangel during quils. Outside of that moment I simply don't need AA and mostly spend my time doing atonement+shields. If he's popping AA inbetween too, he should consider he's actually losing dmg and healing until Evangelism ramps up again. This is perfectly acceptable if atonement doesn't suffice (aka he needs to flash heal someone low), but this would again indicate someone else is doing a poor job avoiding stuff.

There's also a huge gap between # of defensive penance casts between us (I do less than half). However, this may be caused by 2 scenarios: he's using it to keep grace on the tank (which isn't bad) or he's using it on raidmembers fairly low on hp. If it's the latter, I'm inclined to think those ppl are standing in bad stuff they shouldn't be in. Although it might just be them soaking slime pools as ordered (we hardly need to), in which case I don't see a problem on the healers part.

From my personal experience, everyone except tanks can avoid all the dmg except quils and they should. The only ppl I actually use flash heal or penance on, are tanks suddenly dropping or when someone doesn't dodge caw (in which case, slap them). Your priest and pally stand out here: they get hit a lot by caw (~30% each), which shouldn't happen. They should start moving the second caw is being cast and not stop until they can confirm the projectile won't hit them (it has roughly 20y aoe). They're either not paying attention here, or are afraid someone is going to die, but neither is a valid excuse. If they dodge properly, healing inbetween quils is quite easy so that's the perfect time to go atonement heavy.

Btw, this is all from the perspective of platform healing, which I assume your disc is doing.