Patch 5.4 Vengeance Change, BG Healer Balancing Disabled, May 22 Hotfixes, Blue Posts

[Hexz]

We have paladin tank in our guild that stacked haste like no tomorrow. We actually disenchanted any item with "tanking stats" on it! He even claimed priority on horidon's heroic trinket! You know... the haste one? Well, we reached tortos... and guess what? His haste setup was not that good against aoe tanking. And we could not use him there effectively. I can sure say that he can shove his precious dps gear up his ... a$$

Your paladin gearing haste has nothing to do with failing on tortos, haste is fantastic for aoe tanking, I one tank tortos as most paladins do with haste step up, it was more likely your healers failed at keeping his shield topped up.

Anyways on this topic, stupid nerf, pointless and it will actually hurt fights where you can easily gain vengeance, i mean god look at horidon, wth are we meant to do on the enrage when we are suddenly getting half the vengeance, there goes our active mitigation..

Seriously what does this stop people doing 1 Tanking Council or Megaera, its like a cheap bandage, lets just fuck over the tanks actually having fun and doing there job properly, seriously its not like people are standing there trying to take more damage on heroic encounters.

[MasterHamster]

A bit weird to change Vengeance since it might affect mitigation, not just damage. (Sacred Shield for one)
Buuut I'm not exactly watching our tanks Vengeance stack anyway.

[Deleted]

I really cannot understand why you whine for the vengeance change. What is the problem, really? I am sure that if that make tanks unplayable, they will balance it somehow. I have not seen ONE come out and say "this change will break our tanking in <that> way". Something concrete instead of crying?

look it like this:
Yesterday, i was at horridon hc with my guild tanking with a druid (im a DK)
we started to speak about the armor buffs and what not, he said: well, i have now over 120k armor.. and 60% crit..
i said: i have 56k armor and 13% crit..

that's the diff between a DK and a druid..

i got 2 shotted from 2-3 stacks from horridon at p3, while he stood there taking fucking 14 stacks and solotanking the damn boss from 200 mill down to a kill..
fun for a tank? hell no..

and now they are nerfing the vengence like that`? more fun tanking? hell no, i see my self have aggro problems with our 500k+ burst rogue :/
its just.. no, its not fun to tank anymore when they do stuff like that..

[Hinalover]

Really the Vengence chance is not going to do much for "current content" tanks. Normals rarely, if ever hit 30% unless they purposely sit in pools which they are thinking of not triggering vengence. The only content that will cause tanks at current level to hit the vengence cap is in heroic. This basically downplays level 80 tanks trying to kill Heroic 25 Lich King.

[mstieler]

as you said, the dps shuld dps, why dont start dps'ing then? do what you shuld do, and now QQ over the dps..

tbh, as a tank, its FUN to have some competative dps.. its FUN to see some numbers while tanking..

and now they gonna ruin it..

I agree that seeing your name on top or near the top of the charts as a tank is great fun, especially when you're in a multi-add fight, properly tanking.

Having Vengeance proc off stuff tanks shouldn't be doing (standing in the bad) seems to be more the issue than "tanks doing DPS". Hell, the tank doing the DPS they currently are is what's keeping one of my guild's raid teams alive at the moment, helping to shore up some lacking numbers from the DPS that's a bit lower on the charts. I mean, if tank #1 can put out 100k, while median DPS is 115k, the low DPS is putting out 60k, and tank #2 is putting out 50k, I don't see the problem; tank #1 is essentially replacing low DPS on the charts, with low DPS doing "tank damage", all while doing the tanking job they're supposed to be doing.

[Hexz]

Hell I've got 725k Health buffed at 30% thats only 215k Vengeance at most, its not very hard to reach that at all even under normal conditions 2 tanking several fights being conservative for 10 man heroic fights, after paladins just came off a nerf to our SotR, all this will do is nerf out mitigation more, its stupid, even with stamina stacking which is what this would result in, pure stamina stacking which is just completely boring, i want to add stamina when i need it not just straight out stack it.

[Ragashii]

Fairly certain this change is because of prot paladins. They just do (pro)active mitigation better. Hopefully next xpac blizzard will allow other tanks the same opportunity.

Really the Vengence chance is not going to do much for "current content" tanks. Normals rarely, if ever hit 30% unless they purposely sit in pools which they are thinking of not triggering vengence. The only content that will cause tanks at current level to hit the vengence cap is in heroic. This basically downplays level 80 tanks trying to kill Heroic 25 Lich King.

They already fixed this when they capped vengence at max health.

[Salech]

Their talk about talent trees are so stupid, these new talents are not better in anyway it's just bad.

[Ruck]

And the downward spiral continues...what a stupid change.

[Strakha]

So tanking is just back to babysitting retards and BGs are back to losing because there are no healers.

Sounds like something worth subscribing too, lol, jk, see you next expansion.

[Rixarius]

As a tank, I gotta say that these Vengeance changes are brutal. A 70% nerf? You could nerf it 40% and the tanks would be below the DPS and still feel like they're contributing. This is just insane.

[Deleted]

As a tank, I gotta say that these Vengeance changes are brutal. A 70% nerf? You could nerf it 40% and the tanks would be below the DPS and still feel like they're contributing. This is just insane.

must agree.. 70% is quite alot..

[Korru]

Vengeance, "broken" since 2010.

[Tofifi]

As a warrior tank /care, we are top of the meters anyway. Oh wait!

[Toby451]

Getting over 200k vengeance is rare (10hc), unless you are going out of your way to take extra damage purely for the sake of building extra vengeance (IE: using diffuse magic to soak thunderstruck). Your not even going to notice a change the other 99% of the time. I usually sit around 250k on heroic horridon after he enrages and that's the highest I ever get (I dont stand in bad stuff for extra veng).


Major overreactions going on in here.

[risingforce]

Stupid change, completely over the top.

Back in the day my tanking DPS propped up a lot of LFRs and I heard no one complaining then.

This seems like Blizzard cutting off Tanking's nose to spite its face.

[pimpeddakota]

Lets nerf tank damage because raids are having a hard time clearing these raids... sounds like a smart idea blizzard make it even harder for guilds to clear content.. /claps as your player base still shrinks

[Nobleshield]

All this tells me is they really have zero clue what they're doing and are just tossing out random numbers to see which causes the least complaints. Sad.

[Moshots]

Lets nerf tank damage because raids are having a hard time clearing these raids... sounds like a smart idea blizzard make it even harder for guilds to clear content.. /claps as your player base still shrinks

the people who complaining about clearing are normal mode players. show me a normal mode tank that gets close to 250k vengence since even the 30% cap will be 250k vengence. I get over that on 3 fights. DA which i tank 3 adds at start for 700k vengeance abuse, solo tank iron qon I hit like 250-300k with all dogs. and ill prob hit it on ra-den p2. highest ive seen up to 50% on ra-den is like 240k. Change will for the most part only eliminate the abuse of stuff like triple add DA to hit 700k vengeance and basically 4 shot adds.

[Toby451]

As a tank, I gotta say that these Vengeance changes are brutal. A 70% nerf? You could nerf it 40% and the tanks would be below the DPS and still feel like they're contributing. This is just insane.

Not even close to a 70% nerf in reality. It is a 70% nerf in maximum theoretical vengeance but it is impossible to achieve those levels of vengeance anyways (unless your doing something weird like the level 85? paladin soloing dogs). Nothing hits hard enough to sustain 700k vengeance (easily attainable for a tot geared tank without even stacking stamina) and even if it did, the damage would kill you and you would have 0 vengeance.

---------- Post added 2013-05-23 at 10:43 AM ----------

the people who complaining about clearing are normal mode players. show me a normal mode tank that gets close to 250k vengence since even the 30% cap will be 250k vengence. I get over that on 3 fights. DA which i tank 3 adds at start for 700k vengeance abuse, solo tank iron qon I hit like 250-300k with all dogs. and ill prob hit it on ra-den p2. highest ive seen up to 50% on ra-den is like 240k. Change will for the most part only eliminate the abuse of stuff like triple add DA to hit 700k vengeance and basically 4 shot adds.

+1. This change will only be noticed in the most extreme of situations. the other 99% of the time it will be the exact same or a small nerf.