Patch 5.4 Retribution Pve discussion

[Deleted]

5.4 Discussion

My thoughts on the latest Ptr patch notes
I love the inquisition change 60 seconds for 3 hp pretty nice
I like ancient kings buff still doesn't line with wings after the 1st time you use it but still pretty decent at a 3min cd
I am not too sure on our t16 sets bonuses but it is Ptr and things can still change
Some good changes in all just hope to see the inquisition Buff stay

[Deleted]

I hope there's some level of protection to avoid having to use 1 HP Inq's to try and proc free DS, otherwise the Inq change is largely wasted.

[Deleted]

Is the inquisition thing really a noticeable DPS increase or just easier for noobs to keep it up? I mean ok it gives you an extra TV or two, but other than that, what? I don't so much like changes that make a spec easier, I prefer if there is a higher skill ceiling.

[-Skye]

Is the inquisition thing really a noticeable DPS increase or just easier for noobs to keep it up? I mean ok it gives you an extra TV or two, but other than that, what? I don't so much like changes that make a spec easier, I prefer if there is a higher skill ceiling.

So having to push a button when you have 3 holy power every 30 seconds required a high skill cap?

[Deleted]

So having to push a button when you have 3 holy power every 30 seconds required a high skill cap?

No but it still requires more attention than a 60 second one. I thought that glyph of inquisition which increased the duration but lowered the benefit was to help players struggling to keep this up. If there ARE players who struggle to keep that buff up then yeah there is some level of skill involved in this. It's not a big deal to me, I'm still gonna do more DPS than like 99% of retris out there, but it's just not something I am very fond of.

Though I guess on the other hand the whole mechanic of inquisition is not something I very much like since it feels a waste to get a buff up with resources instead of doing immediate numbers, so simplifying it will make it more fun for everyone.

[Mithael]

It seems like the majority of these changes are PvP focused, as opposed to PvE. (We're in a really great spot PvE-wise). In particular, the Inquisition change is a PvP change. Maintaining the buff in PvE is trivial, but is actually a big problem in PvP. Now, you can Judge, get 20 sec of Inquisition, and then bash away with TV. It opens up a huge amount of flexibility.

Now, given that this is a PvE thread, here are my thoughts on how this relates to PvE:

Inquisition change (each HP on Inq is 20sec): Minor damage boost. (Less HP spent on maintaining Inq.) Also, the buff from 10-20sec might change our opening burst. Makes it a little easier.

GAK (3-min CD, stacks reduced to 12): Despite reduced stacks, it still looks like it'll be a damage boost, since we can better sync up CDs. On a sub-6 fight, we can GAK+Wings at pull, Wings at 2, GAK+Wings at 4. On a 6:30 fight, we could GAK+Wings at pull, Wings at 2, GAK at 3, Wings at 4, GAK+Wings at 6. Even if the math works out that it's a DPS loss (which I doubt), I'll still appreciate the flexibility in using CDs. And, of course, it's a nice PvP buff.

Turn Evil: Nice little utility boost, a great PvP buff, and a really funny RP buff.

Unbreakable Spirit: I'm not sure this is all that different from live with the amount of haste that we stack as ret, but it does make it more reliable.

Hand of Purity: Wow. That's pretty nice stuff.

[Deleted]

GC actually admitted that there are a bunch of paladins who struggle with managing inquisition. comes with the popularity of the class, I guess. I myself struggle to manage it sometimes as well, even with CLCInfo.

[-Skye]

No but it still requires more attention than a 60 second one. I thought that glyph of inquisition which increased the duration but lowered the benefit was to help players struggling to keep this up. If there ARE players who struggle to keep that buff up then yeah there is some level of skill involved in this. It's not a big deal to me, I'm still gonna do more DPS than like 99% of retris out there, but it's just not something I am very fond of.

Though I guess on the other hand the whole mechanic of inquisition is not something I very much like since it feels a waste to get a buff up with resources instead of doing immediate numbers, so simplifying it will make it more fun for everyone.

Very high horse you have their. And so if you think it'll make it more fun for everyone and have never liked the mechanic. Why complain about the change?

[RebelElite791]

So having to push a button when you have 3 holy power every 30 seconds required a high skill cap?

You might be surprised...

[Tangra]

Is the inquisition thing really a noticeable DPS increase or just easier for noobs to keep it up? I mean ok it gives you an extra TV or two, but other than that, what? I don't so much like changes that make a spec easier, I prefer if there is a higher skill ceiling.

It's a mostly a PvP change I would guess. Since due to cc and other issues, Inquisition can become a massive hassle in the unpredictable environment that is PvP. In and of itself a skilled player can manage it, but keep in mind that Ret has pretty terrible sustained damage in PvP in between cooldowns, so the last thing you need is to waste a global and a TV on some upkeep mechanic every 30 seconds.

[Reith]

It's a mostly a PvP change I would guess. Since due to cc and other issues, Inquisition can become a massive hassle in the unpredictable environment that is PvP. In and of itself a skilled player can manage it, but keep in mind that Ret has pretty terrible sustained damage in PvP in between cooldowns, so the last thing you need is to waste a global and a TV on some upkeep mechanic every 30 seconds.

and against teams with Shamans on them, I suspect the new Glyph of Inquisition will be very good.

[Bijin]

Is the inquisition thing really a noticeable DPS increase or just easier for noobs to keep it up? I mean ok it gives you an extra TV or two, but other than that, what? I don't so much like changes that make a spec easier, I prefer if there is a higher skill ceiling.

i guess u love play on TBC with 30 sec seal buff and with judd lose it....

In TBC u can use 2 or 3 seals in a boss fight.... right now just click and go... thats is what u want???

[Nairobi]

i guess u love play on TBC with 30 sec seal buff and with judd lose it....

In TBC u can use 2 or 3 seals in a boss fight.... right now just click and go... thats is what u want???

Most of us, yes.

Fire-n-forget is great for starting out or new players who don't want to be "overwhelmed", but 1 button every 30 seconds is hardly challenging (in PVE). Granted, things get a bit more..."iffy" in PVP, when you have to make timing and counter-based decisions, but I would confidently say that the vast majority of good/skilled Rets (and players in general) prefer a class/spec with a high skill cap rather than a low one.

It gives us the opportunity to differentiate ourselves from the mediocre players.

If 30sec Inq is too hard for you, check out a Frost DK.

[Tangra]

and against teams with Shamans on them, I suspect the new Glyph of Inquisition will be very good.

Does killing totems count as a kill, I hadn't noticed?

[Deleted]

If 30sec Inq is too hard for you, check out a Frost DK.

Diseases are hard. Inq is hard. Dots & bleeds are hard....

[Deleted]

Very high horse you have their. And so if you think it'll make it more fun for everyone and have never liked the mechanic. Why complain about the change?

My point was. I don't like when stuff becomes easier for me, I like to know that I can master something others are struggling with. But also, this particular change I will welcome, since the mentioned mechanic they simplify is an annoying one in my opinion. I didn't complain at all.

[anaxie]

There is nothing hard about maintaining inqu and the duration increase is hugely welcomed. Now ignore this thread because it's relevant 5.4 info is already being discussed in the major thread. read next time.

[Deleted]

Never liked inquisition tbh. The easiest to live with it, the better. Not because it's "hard" to keep track of it, just because its anoying and more of a burden than a skill/fun button to press.

[Tangra]

Never liked inquisition tbh. The easiest to live with it, the better. Not because it's "hard" to keep track of it, just because its anoying and more of a burden than a skill/fun button to press.

Yeah maybe if they made us put some thought into when and how to refresh it. It should have never been a 100% upkeep mechanic, those just shouldn't exist.

[Deleted]

Yeah maybe if they made us put some thought into when and how to refresh it. It should have never been a 100% upkeep mechanic, those just shouldn't exist.

It's no different to the buffs/debuffs other classes need to maintain, such as slice and dice for rogues. Although I'm not strictly in favour of the rapid fire nature of paladin dps these days (though a huge improvement on the days when it was largely autoattack), I have no issue with needing to spend some of my second resource on a buff to be maintained. I also suspect it keeps the pvp wolves away from our door.