Garrosh did it ON PURPOSE!

[Aquamonkey]

Why would they do it if they are in peace talks with the alliance?

Secret peace talks between Theron and Wrynn. I doubt anyone outside the highest echelons of blood elf government knew about it.

[Thage]

Secret peace talks between Theron and Wrynn. I doubt very many people knew about it.

Not even Jaina--the same Jaina who's about the closest thing Varian has to a best friend now and Anduin's more-or-less surrogate mother, the same Jaina who's been Varian's number one advisor since Northrend--knew about it. I doubt anyone but Varian and Lor'themar knew about those talks. Odds are Garrosh set the blood elves up for a fall for the same reason he tried to set the Forsaken up in Edge of Night: other races are there to act as a buffer between his people and the Alliance, to him.

[Usako]

Garrosh is a douche. It doesn't surprise me in the least, but its does make having this information a little bit more interesting.

[Thrive]

Dalaran is the city of mages and Jaina is not only the most powerful mortal wizard in Azeroth but is also a member of the Kirin Tor. The choice was obvious.

It was obvious when she wasn't batshit insane

[Thirtyrock]

Yes he put the blame on them on purpose, but if you're suggesting that Garrosh KNEW about the negotiations between the Blood Elves and the alliance and this was his plan to sabotage it you are missing something.

Garrosh would just have killed Theron and anyone he thought was in on it. He wouldn't have done devious stuff, especially at this point. He'd just have killed them.

[Aquamonkey]

Not even Jaina--the same Jaina who's about the closest thing Varian has to a best friend now and Anduin's more-or-less surrogate mother, the same Jaina who's been Varian's number one advisor since Northrend--knew about it. I doubt anyone but Varian and Lor'themar knew about those talks. Odds are Garrosh set the blood elves up for a fall for the same reason he tried to set the Forsaken up in Edge of Night: other races are there to act as a buffer between his people and the Alliance, to him.

Spies abound. I didn't mean that post as indication that Garrosh couldn't have found out about the peace talks. I meant it more as common Blood Elves wouldn't have known when they aided Garrosh in stealing the Bell.

[Zathrendar]

Dalaran is the city of mages and Jaina is not only the most powerful mortal wizard in Azeroth

Source for this?

---------- Post added 2013-06-15 at 08:55 PM ----------

Actually, at the end of the Throne of Thunder raid, she absorbs Lei Shen's power into her staff, making her have both her own formidable power and the power of Lei Shen. She also has the focusing iris, which can vaporize entire cities like what happened to Theramore. For the alliance and in terms of pure destructive force, Jaina is the most powerful.

Yes, I am not talking about her trinkets, but her herself. I wouldn't doubt he is the most powerful mage the Alliance has, but then again I don't k now enough about the Highborne who recently joined. Or indeed, the draenei, who I am sure still have a few powerful magi amongst them. She may be all the more dangerous due to her artefacts, but that doesn't mean much, nor does her power alone qualify her to be a good leader. Far from it. She must show a cool head in addition to it.

---------- Post added 2013-06-15 at 08:58 PM ----------

She's not. I doubt she has anymore power than Rommath or Aethas.

This too. Or even Modera.

---------- Post added 2013-06-15 at 09:00 PM ----------

Jaina went ballistic on the blood elves because Garrosh abused Dalaran's neutrality and portal networks to steal the bell. Neutrality is a funny thing--it relies on everyone else being smart enough to realize not to fuck with you and leave you alone, and Garrosh dropped the ball pretty hard there even after Jaina went out of her way to re-establish herself and the Kirin Tor as neutral to the faction war, using the high and blood elves' coexistence there as a proof of concept that Alliance and Horde could eventually bury the hatchet full-time.

Plus, I am sure she felt some guilt for making Theramore into a military target.

[icausewipes]

Garrosh chose to put the blame on the Blood Elves because he knows that Lor'themar and his people are strong enough to take anyone on!

Arthas is holding on line 1.

http://www.wowwiki.com/The_Fall_of_Silvermoon

[Combatbutler]

Arthas is holding on line 1.

http://www.wowwiki.com/The_Fall_of_Silvermoon

Well if Dar'khan had not betrayed them, they might have stopped him. Arthas was able to evade most of their defences and he still called it a hard won victory.

[Zathrendar]

Makes sense. If the blood elves leave, so does a huge chunk of the Horde's magical artillery, most of their paladins (Sunwalkers are apparently still a bit of a cultural novelty in-lore), and an easy route to reinforce Forsaken holdings in northern Eastern Kingdoms. It also puts the Forsaken at risk of a hammer-and-anvil strike, gets the Alliance access to the Sunwell (imagine if that were weaponized), and it would have unified Dalaran as a nation with even more magically-inclined elves under its banner ready to lob artillery strikes at the Horde, rather than the recent cuts in membership due to batshit crazy leadership.

Aye, people tend to underestimate the blood elves. Aside from the fact that they repelled the Scourge with few resources to commit to that end, even from the Forsaken (who provided strategic aid mostly), they have proven themselves to be a very resilient, adaptable race in Draenor, and now again on the Isle of Thunder. Bearing in mind the context that most races are probably very few in numbers, and that the blood elves boast skilled warriors (especially the BKs and Spellbreakers), rangers and, above all else, sorcerers, and of course the Sunwell, you can see why losing (or indeed, gaining) them as an ally is a major affair. Also, like you said, it'd severely compromise the already weakened Forsaken, and risk losing the Horde's hold on the northern EK.

[leaks]

Arthas is holding on line 1.

http://www.wowwiki.com/The_Fall_of_Silvermoon

Didn't they have about 10 times the numbers back then? Last I heard they needed the Forsaken's help to hold their own lands.

[Zathrendar]

Arthas is holding on line 1.

http://www.wowwiki.com/The_Fall_of_Silvermoon

Yes, see above.

---------- Post added 2013-06-15 at 09:12 PM ----------

Didn't they have about 10 times the numbers back then? Last I heard they needed the Forsaken's help to hold their own lands.

So what if they did? The Scourge wasn't a conventional army. It desecrated their territories and took the rangers, who were the main defensive line at the time, by surprise, in utilising the plague to damage their forests. The Scourge also brought Lordaeron (and Dalaran, and so on) to its knees, and like Combatbulter posted, it wasn't an easy victory for Arthas. Moreover, the kingdom was still recovering from attacks made by the orcs and Amani during the Second War. The thing about the Scourge is that, as its opponents numbers fall, its own numbers swell. Former countrymen become your mortal enemies. Yet people insist on belittling the risk the Scourge posed. It was one of the most powerful foes ever to confront the playable races of Azeroth.

Over and above this, the blood elves got up and fought back, purging the Scourge from their territories and, on Kael'thas's front, serving as the front lines for Illidan's armies. I am assuming the majority of those who died were civilians, anyway, which would make sense, and who would by no means be able to take on the Scourge's undead hordes. These were driven back by the magisters. All things considered, they are pretty impressive, and I trust this is why Garrosh - even though he dislikes the race - uses them in sensitive missions.

The aid provided by the Forsaken according to the NPCs was strategic, and little else. The only real aid the Forsaken provide is their positioning. They make entering Quel'thalas even more difficult than it would be due to the mountains surrounding it. Bear in mind, up until the Val'kyr, the Forsaken were in an even worse position populationally than most other races, because they had no means of reproducing, aside from necromancy I assume, which they did not practise to the degree that the Scourge did, for obvious reasons.

[Deleted]

You should check this out! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbGSNnO7q6M
I know its just fanmade but hell this bloodelve looks awesome

[Aquamonkey]

You should check this out! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbGSNnO7q6M
I know its just fanmade but hell this bloodelve looks awesome

Trying too hard to be Snake Plissken.

[Deleted]

Trying to hard to be Snake Plissken.

Who the fuck is Snake Plissken?

[iamthedevil]

Garrosh is one devious Orc. Well played.

---------- Post added 2013-06-15 at 05:09 PM ----------

Who the fuck is Snake Plissken?

Lol, i'll double that question.

[Aquamonkey]

Who the fuck is Snake Plissken?

Lol, i'll double that question.

[Deleted]

Well, I really like Garrosh, even if hes a hotheaded douchebag. But thats what I like... I like it that War between alliance and horde takes the majorpart in World of Warcraft, he knows how to lead a war, you must take every chance. Even if there is some dirty work to do... but hell, this is War. I hate Thrall for being a softy Hippy, throwing with Butterflys and Flowers.

I hope we will get a Warchief who knows how to encourage the hearts of the Horde, and how to shock the hearts of our enemys.

[PenguinChan]

-snip-

Haha, glad I'm not the only one who enjoyed (Or at least knows) those movies. He certainly doesn't look like him though, at least not to me.

[Deleted]

Garrosh is the True Warchief, whatever we get next, I'll spit on!