Suggestions for new Warlock 90 Talents

[Jessicka]

Current PTR state, they're all bad and old KJC isn't coming back, we have a thread for collective whining about it, so keep that whining there. This is for discussing alternatives. Given the current discussion, perhaps the theme of the talent row could be mobility rather than random utility?

Firstly though is a proposition for a Glyph.

Glyph of Fel Flame
- Your Fel Flame no longer refreshes the damage of, or extends the duration of your Immolate, Corruption or Unstable Affliction spells.

Clearly a major issue with the KJC change is the updating of DoTs apparently making Fel Flame undesirable, this glyph would fix that and give you at least something to cast.

Archimonde's Vengeance.
- Your Immolate/Corruption damage has a chance to increase the damage of your next Fel Flame by 200% and reduces the mana cost by 100%. Stacks twice.

This would give you some random proc globals to move in much like the old Nightfall talent. It would be a slight DPS increase, but that's offset by the random nature of the extra movement.

Kil'jaeden's Cunning
As PTR Spiritwalker's Grace copy.

Illidan's Guile (Yeah the old name for the 3rd talent )
- Your Fel Flame now has a chance (based on crit?) to trigger an additional tick of your Corruption/Immolate/Unstable Affliction spells on the target.

This would give you better controlled movement at a reduced loss, but still a loss.

Obviously this means there's no space for MF in the talent tree, but to be honest if they want to nerf it to how it is on the PTR, I think its situationality would permit it to be baseline.

[superdooper]

Does anybody even use - or want to use - fel flame?

[Jessicka]

Does anybody even use - or want to use - fel flame?

If they don't, it's because they're specced into a version of KJC that wont exist in the next patch. After that, they'll all pretty much have to use it; these are intended to fix some of the issues that some players have with it.

[Elwynta]

The fact that you ended up having to make both a glyph, which would be probably become as prevalent as the 4th soul shard glyph was before it became baseline, and 2 level 90 talents to make Fel Flame even somewhat attractive to use is evidence that Fel Flame is not the direction to make up for the loss of current KJC.

[Grizelda]

This sounds like more whining. Please, please get rid of KJC.

We can do these 50 ad hoc changes and rework the whole class in the middle of the expac. Bring back this, change the values for that. Throw out all the cool directions we were going and base the whole of the class around....Fel Flame? We get that you like Fel Flame. Enough already.

If Warlocks are supposed to turret cast, why don't we remove Touch of Chaos? Demonic leap? All the things the things that make Demo so mobile?

Lore said that warlocks were not supposed to be able to move and cast. I don't buy that. He's just being an apologist for GC or Holinkas mood swing.

The Devs gave us an ability so that we can move and cast. It has worked out well.

Maybe next expac they can rethink things. Just leave well enough alone for now.

[Bluesftw]

just make KjC only work with grasp , shadowbolt and incinerate aka filler spells , there problem fckin fixed, also make haunt return with hp like it used to.

[Puri]

SoulHarvest: After you successfully complete channeling SoulHarvest (new 3s cast) your spelldamage is increased by 15% for 60s
Empowered Teleport: When you are standing inside your Demonic Circle your spelldamage is increased by 15%
Empowered Twilight Ward: When Twilight Wards ends or is fully absorbed your spelldamage is increased by 15% for 25s

And wait till you hear about my "Jainas cunning" proposal for new level 90 mage talents!

[Grizelda]

Really hating on the.... when its passive it does this, when you activate it does that but then it does nothing the rest of the time style of talent.

Enough with those.

[Shodan30]

I would prefer they increase the snare effect to 75 or even 90% then make this change to KJC. The 'fun' part of kjc is not having to interrupt. movement is important sure, but being able to finish that cast while your moving out of the fire is so much more fun then continually doing no damage or wasting embers cause your maxed out because you cant get off chaos bolts.

[Sylar Hao]

It seems warlocks is a class that trades strengths and powers, and I like that concept.

Archimonde's Vengeance:
- Passive: Increases damage taken by X% and you revert back X% (yeah, double dip)
+ Perfect for fights with lots of damage and in pvp you can take advantage of this if your being babysitted by a good healer.

Kil'jaeden's Cunning:
- Same as actual. We snare ourselves, every melee can stick to use without any problem even if we move. C'mon...
+ There's no need to explain how awesome this talent is, even with its flaws.

Mannoroth's Fury:
- Increases damage and range by your AoE abilities by X%, but decreases the damage and range of your single target spells by X%.
+ Perfect of AoE heavy fights, have fun in Alterac Valley.

[Deleted]

Kil'jaeden's Cunning:
Your Fel flames now knock you back 10 yards in the opposite direction of your target. You can cast while flying.

This effect has a 5 sec cooldown.


a.k.a Direhorn's Vengeance

[Grizelda]

Oh here we go...

[Gorthan]

Kil'jaeden's Cunning:
Your Fel flames now knock you back 10 yards in the opposite direction of its target.

and interrupt your casting?

[WarlockJack]

OP, why would you go to the trouble to make NEW talents and then base them around a spell that hits like a noodle and is super mana inefficient?

Kil'jaeden's Cunning:
Your Fel flames now knock you back 10 yards in the opposite direction of its target. You can cast while flying.

I'd laugh my ass off if I saw warlocks flying backwards all over through the air in pvp. rofl

[SpamHealzu]

I've always had the problem where our level 90 talents are not real "through put" talents much like other classes

Boomkin - Heart of the Wild/Natures Vigil
Hunter - Glaive Toss/Powershot/Barrage
Mage - Invocation/Rune of power/Incanter's Ward
Elemental Shaman - Primal Elementalist/Elemental Blast/Unleashed Fury

All of these classes get new unqiue abilities that in some way up their damage. We get utility. I do not mind utility at all but I do admit it was a little boring. Now making the utility talents even more worthless makes them even less fun. And if I can recall GC said talents when MoP came out he wanted them to be FUN talents. There is nothing FUN about having a spirit walkers grace. There is nothing FUN about having 15 seconds of Rain of Fire. What would be FUN would be something that PURI mentioned, new abilities that are extremely meaningful.

I will admit PURI's suggestions are just a slight retool of current mage talents, but it is a step in the right direction. The portal idea is nice because the idea of giving up something for more damage is an interesting way to make talents. You use the portal as a DPS buff, you remove the utility the portal brings. I think another talent could be tooled around healthstone or soulstone consumption on yourself

Soul Consumption - You consume your soulstone increasing your highest secondarystat by x%. You sacrifice your batte rez utility but you gain a dps cooldown.

[Jessicka]

OP, why would you go to the trouble to make NEW talents and then base them around a spell that hits like a noodle and is super mana inefficient?

Because I remember forums crying from TBC until the end of Wrath for its implementation and its praise as the saviour of all Warlock kind upon its announcement for Cataclysm.

It's the movement option GC tweeted about:

Greg Street ‏@Ghostcrawler 14h

@Binkenstein @realnzall @Lhivera Everyone (even locks) has something they can do to mitigate moving. Doesn't always have to be a new spell.

[Grizelda]

For the new Mannoroths Fury: I would like to FnB a soulburned Seed of Corruption, and when it pops it pulls down a HoG on each target.

[superdooper]

For the new Mannoroths Fury: I would like to FnB a soulburned Seed of Corruption, and when it pops it pulls down a HoG on each target.

Followed of course by RoF and a 6s stun on each target!

Perhaps an easy & fun change to compensate for the KJC nerf is to:

--> Increase the cast speed of your next successive MG or CB cast by 15%. Stacks up to 4 times.

This would give some extremely spiky results - which is always fun (of course benefiting those who move less).

[mipper]

I've always had the problem where our level 90 talents are not real "through put" talents much like other classes

Boomkin - Heart of the Wild/Natures Vigil
Hunter - Glaive Toss/Powershot/Barrage
Mage - Invocation/Rune of power/Incanter's Ward
Elemental Shaman - Primal Elementalist/Elemental Blast/Unleashed Fury

All of these classes get new unqiue abilities that in some way up their damage. We get utility. I do not mind utility at all but I do admit it was a little boring. Now making the utility talents even more worthless makes them even less fun. And if I can recall GC said talents when MoP came out he wanted them to be FUN talents. There is nothing FUN about having a spirit walkers grace. There is nothing FUN about having 15 seconds of Rain of Fire. What would be FUN would be something that PURI mentioned, new abilities that are extremely meaningful.

I will admit PURI's suggestions are just a slight retool of current mage talents, but it is a step in the right direction. The portal idea is nice because the idea of giving up something for more damage is an interesting way to make talents. You use the portal as a DPS buff, you remove the utility the portal brings. I think another talent could be tooled around healthstone or soulstone consumption on yourself

Soul Consumption - You consume your soulstone increasing your highest secondarystat by x%. You sacrifice your batte rez utility but you gain a dps cooldown.

Be careful what you wish for, I would trade mage lvl 90s for lock lvl 90s any day of the week.

But, back on topic, I like the idea of knocking locks backwards with fel flame, would be entertaining.

[Kagecamia]

If they don't, it's because they're specced into a version of KJC that wont exist in the next patch. After that, they'll all pretty much have to use it; these are intended to fix some of the issues that some players have with it.

I remember seeing Vreivai (sorry for misspelling name) post that she and many other locks would quit the game or class before going back to fel flame again. I am among those same people. Fel Flame is a relic of an outdated play style that should just be changed.