Why is getting in a raid team near impossible atm?

[Deleted]

we just recruited a couple of new guys all of them wear around LFR gear and slightly above.
they all made a great application were in was visible they knew there stuff, so their lower ilvl of gear was a minor thing which would dissapear over time anyway when they joined in for 1-2 weeks of raiding.
and its not that we're bad we are currently 11/13 hc and pushing Lei shen HC, so one might think we only want HC progressed applicants which isnt true. we and many other higher ranked guilds want people worth their salt. so higher end raiding guilds will accept worse geared players as long they show their worth in the application.

but we seen enough people applicating for us with horrible applications that already showed us, that they would never be able too preform for the minimum we expect.
so we rejected them, and i heard several of them say we and other guilds were an elitist bunch that only accepted people with a crazy amount of gear/progress.
so my opion is that half of the complainers are butthurt cause a guild wouldnt carry their asses.

[Kilpi]

If you haven't already killed the bosses that the guild you want to join wants to kill, what exactly do you think you can contribute?

If you're not doing better DPS than the people in the guild you want to join, what exactly do you think you can contribute?

If you're not better geared than the people in the guild you want to join, what exactly do you think you can contribute?

If you're not better, period, than the people in the guild you are hoping to join, why would they want you?

If the problem the guild you want to join has is anything other than "we can't find more than 9 of us under any circumstances for our 10-man raid" then if you aren't better in all respects than the people in that group you can just forget it.

That's pretty much how it goes.

If this is the way most raiders think these days I'm not surprised some people don't want to play with them anymore...

[kenshinag]

I think we got a winner so if you ever find a guild were it isn't like that: hold dear to the people there and don't let anyone cahnge the attitude.

I'm lucky enough to be in one of those guilds. Everything is provided for us from our RL. All we are expected to do is show up on time, stay the allotted times, focus and do the job we're asked to do, and we're golden. The only issues we run into is with people who are loot whores and people who can't take criticism, who are easily replaced. Being able to pass BIS pieces to others is highly valued and when you can take our RL calling you out "Are you DCing? No? Then why the fuck do you not have your shield yet?!?!" when you're working on H Tortos, you'd have a home with us.

[DrMcNinja]

I love to raid, but guilds don't take me quite seriously when I have ilvl 517, no Experience in ToT but on the other hand, a ton of past Heroic raiding experience.

Been looking for a challenging boss since Lich King heroic :<

[Resentful]

I love to raid, but guilds don't take me quite seriously when I have ilvl 517, no Experience in ToT but on the other hand, a ton of past Heroic raiding experience.

Been looking for a challenging boss since Lich King heroic :<

Experience is good however proof is needed aka WoL nothing else needs to be said assuming you want a decent tier guild of course. Hell you could of been carried we don't know that hell you could of bought your account

WE DON'T KNOW lols

[Gilian]

You should just keep obtaining gear until SoO, then you will be closer to the gear level that heroic guilds are on. Going from nothing to heroic is too big of a step.

I obtained gear from LFR and some other sources and joined a guild that was near finishing normal mode and I was doing heroic mode very soon. 8/16 T14 and then I left because I wasn't having enough fun.
So, just wait a little longer if you want to join a heroic raiding guild. You can't expect them to just take you especially when they are probably getting apps from players in ilvl 520. Or you need to try harder to convince them.

If it was me I would take someone with hardcore Vanilla/TBC/WoTLK experience any day though. Gear isn't really a problem. But not everyone thinks like that ;p.

[RicardoZ]

Prove you're good not exactly a hard concept WoL logs yada yada but mostly WoL logs with that being said your entire history also contributes to a decent tier guild's application thing. People aren't just going outright believe your fucking amazing without any evidence OP.

World of Logs is useless unless you have a raid team.

[Resentful]

World of Logs is useless unless you have a raid team.

Then get a raid team once more not a hard concept or do the LFR shit despite LFR is pretty much a fucking dummy log It's something that you can provide to shit tier guilds top tier guilds mid tier guilds

You name it.

[Deleted]

Out dpsing someone doesn't always come down to skill. Sometimes people in LFR slack. Actually a lot of times they slack. Some classes just do more damage than others. Scenarios and 5-mans are just short fights without many mechanics.

[Deleted]

If you haven't already killed the bosses that the guild you want to join wants to kill, what exactly do you think you can contribute?

If you're not doing better DPS than the people in the guild you want to join, what exactly do you think you can contribute?

If you're not better geared than the people in the guild you want to join, what exactly do you think you can contribute?

If you're not better, period, than the people in the guild you are hoping to join, why would they want you?

If the problem the guild you want to join has is anything other than "we can't find more than 9 of us under any circumstances for our 10-man raid" then if you aren't better in all respects than the people in that group you can just forget it.

That's pretty much how it goes.

Is this post for real?

Dude do u know anything about raiding guilds and their recruitment?... cos this post shows u dont.

Ive never heard of a raiding guild advertising for a player who has cleared more content than the guild has managed... why the fukk would a more experienced player go to a guild whose doing worse than where he is?

How the hell does better gear prove u will do more dps than a guy with less gear? Skill and class knowledge and experience dictates that a lower geared player can out-dps a better geared player.

How do u know the guy applying is worse than your current raiding roster if u have never run a raid with them?

Dude I hope to god this post isnt from a current raiding guild and therefore shows the real method guilds r using to evaluate players... cos if it is then its total bullshit.

Ofc Normie could be just a troll who posted this rubbish up to get a response...

[RicardoZ]

Then get a raid team once more not a hard concept or do the LFR shit despite LFR is pretty much a fucking dummy log It's something that you can provide to shit tier guilds top tier guilds mid tier guilds

You name it.

But the OP's entire problem is that they can't get into a raid team. So your solution is "get a raid team". You sir, are a gem.

And I wasn't aware that anybody would take LFR logs seriously if posted to WoL. But then again, I haven't raided seriously for almost two expansions now, so I'll trust your judgment on that one.

[Tiberria]

Back in vanilla when only 2% of the players raided, they had a much harder time to get people to join them and guilds worked their ass of to get recruits geared up and skilled up. They were constantly doing old raids to help new players. Today they want the player to contribute and commit to the guild, but they don't want to do jack for the player. Actually a lot of guilds are dieing off because they can't fill spots, and they are blaming LFR instead of looking back and realizing that if they aren't doing anything to earn the dedication and loyalty of their guild members those guild members are just gonna bail as soon as a better guild doing better on progression has a spot open. It is no longer about the the players, everyone is disposable for the sake of progression. I remember when MMORPGs were actually about the people playing them.

Back in Vanilla, there was no VP gear, no LFR, no easily accessible craftable epics, no dungeon finder, 5 mans were actually challenging, etc. The only way to gear up a raider was through actual raids, so guilds had no choice but to gear up newer members that way. They added all kinds of ways of gearing up outside of raids so that people wouldn't have to be carried and so that raiders wouldn't get burned out constantly having to run older content to gear up new people.

Someone who isn't willing to take the time to gear themselves up through the easily accessible options and instead expects to join a guild and have them carry them through content that is no longer relevant to the rest of the raid is being both lazy and selfish. Plus, why would a guild expect someone that won't put the effort in before applying to continue to put the effort in after getting geared and becoming a main raider?

[DeadmanWalking]

If you want a guild that fits certain criteria I know you can find it. I myself needed a Guild that was a casual guild that raided on Friday night so I didn't try to join guilds that didn't fit my needs. If their requirements were too high I didn't try to join them and if they require an activity I don't want to do then I don't join them.

Chances are if you are looking for a guild that behaves a certain way then there is a guild out there looking for a member that behaves the same way.

[Gilian]

Back in Vanilla, there was no VP gear, no LFR, no easily accessible craftable epics, no dungeon finder, 5 mans were actually challenging, etc. The only way to gear up a raider was through actual raids, so guilds had no choice but to gear up newer members that way. They added all kinds of ways of gearing up outside of raids so that people wouldn't have to be carried and so that raiders wouldn't get burned out constantly having to run older content to gear up new people.

Someone who isn't willing to take the time to gear themselves up through the easily accessible options and instead expects to join a guild and have them carry them through content that is no longer relevant to the rest of the raid is being both lazy and selfish. Plus, why would a guild expect someone that won't put the effort in before applying to continue to put the effort in after getting geared and becoming a main raider?

I just wanted to say that. Pretty ridiculous that someone blames a guild for not gearing them up to be honest.

And you get plenty from guilds. You get to raid and you get people who are willing to schedule their time to do so. And nowadays you get nearly all consumables for free since they are easy to obtain for a guild (this was almost not possible for my first own TBC raiding guild, costs were too high and income was a joke compared to now, perks for the win). At least that was the case in my guild. They also gave craftable items (which some guildmembers spend significant time on collecting) for VERY reasonable deals if you contributed yourself by being on time for raids or other activities, playing properly and also donating stuff or helping others and stuff like that.

[DeadmanWalking]

I'll also note that there is a Guild called the 'convert to Raid' guild on Airey Peak alliance side, they have 3 guilds folded into one with tons of members and they have groups that are dedicated to scheduled raiding and they also have constant pick up groups. When you have 3 maxed out guilds worth of members its not hard to find people who want to do some raiding.

[Gilian]

Then get a raid team once more not a hard concept or do the LFR shit despite LFR is pretty much a fucking dummy log It's something that you can provide to shit tier guilds top tier guilds mid tier guilds

You name it.

I thought about using LFR for my application. It only makes you look worse, lol. Unless they are going to plow through the whole thing to see that all the fail in the log isn't your fault. Too many people affecting your performance, in a bad way.

[Aphrel]

why not start pugging normal modes? and with hc scenario every day.. in a week or 2 you will be nearing 520 easily. (and if ur on a dead server with no pugs, MOVE! dead servers suck balls, go to wowprogress and look throu realm lists to see wich servers have the most active players.)

[RicardoZ]

I thought about using LFR for my application. It only makes you look worse, lol. Unless they are going to plow through the whole thing to see that all the fail in the log isn't your fault. Too many people affecting your performance, in a bad way.

That's another why World of Logs really isn't the best tool to measure somebody's performance in the first place. First off, you pretty much have to have a decent dedicated group that is willing to buff you to the max and make sure you get the best parse possible. There's a lot of little exploits people use to boost their numbers that doesn't necessarily make them a valuable member of a raid team and are entirely dependent on the group "carrying them" through the fight just to get a higher parse.

---------- Post added 2013-06-28 at 09:15 AM ----------

why not start pugging normal modes? and with hc scenario every day.. in a week or 2 you will be nearing 520 easily. (and if ur on a dead server with no pugs, MOVE! dead servers suck balls, go to wowprogress and look throu realm lists to see wich servers have the most active players.)

No achieve no invite is still the golden rule unfortunately on most servers as far as I know.

[brirrspliff]

[...] What has happened to WoW?

this seems to be the summary of your post. let me tell you: nothing has happened. you are behind the curve, that's all. get that gear going. use openRaid or similar things, organize your own pug to clear normalmodes (they still are easy, after all). when you have ~520, apply to a real raiding guild.

any serious guild is progressing on hardmodes right now (or even finished with it!), so they won't take people with ~505 iLvl, naturally. but since you are a veteran as you say, you should know all this already.

[Sprinky]

Most points have been covered already but Ill just stress the importance of continuing that focus on gearing up. Do everything each day/week to get any upgrades possible. I have so many people whisper me each week looking to raid but they are leveling some crappy alt instead of focusing on gearing their main character. Top guilds will take the time to look at how many times you have run each lfr even if you just needed 1 item. Once you have a full set of items for your main set start to gear an offspec. Make sure you are up to date with the legendary quest, and valor capping every week. Ive recruited a couple of freshly dinged/sub 500 ilvl people recently and they all geared up to enough for heroic progress within a week or 2.

Gem, enchant and reforge all items to the maximum.

TLDR: 100% focus on maximising every resource available to your character.