Why do lesser skilled players feel entitled to see content?

[Jtbrig7390]

Your the one saying it has an effect...

And I gave you examples on how it "Could" have a effect and yet you refuse to defend you calm that it dose not have a effect.

all you keep doing is "I say it dose not so it don't" when I give you ways it could/dose now prove your calm or stop replying to me because until you can defend your argument you won't get a reply from me anymore.

[Deleted]

/watch?v=GFWh9aY4pas everything is here youtube video enjoy

[Jtbrig7390]

Maybe for a single player game yeah, but this is an MMO, your playing with others
Go out and tell trade chat you killed Lei Shen on LFR - everyone will laugh at you or not take you seriously at all

Once again I do not CARE what other people in the game think or have done stop trying to talk for me.

I have done proved to feel this way is on a personal level and is not a fact the game being a MMO dose not chance this.

[Dormie]

And I gave you examples on how it "Could" have a effect and yet you refuse to defend you calm that it dose not have a effect.

all you keep doing is "I say it dose not so it don't" when I give you ways it could/dose now prove your calm or stop replying to me because until you can defend your argument you won't get a reply from me anymore.

So how something 'could' do something is an argument now?

[PenguinChan]

Can you name any of these games that are not Dark Souls Or GTA???

Because I play games a lot and only know of a handful that don't have different settings.

But that's part of the appeal, is it not? Dark Souls and Demon's Souls would definitely not be as popular as it is now if the difficulty was changeable. You can't tell me a game where it's notorious for its difficulty suddenly drops it will do well. It just won't, and will probably lose a lot of faith in its community who liked it hard, and gain only people who enjoy the varied difficulties. It'll switch out your entire base of players, which generally isn't a good idea.

[jbombard]

That is question only blizzard can answer I guess they feel that flex raiding should be its own lockout since its really its own mode.

But yet feel that heroic mode should be tied to normal modes lockout since you need to beat one to do the other.

- - - Updated - - -

Your argument is that it dose not.

I defend with ways that it dose now back up your calm or move along.

Flex is for different people than LFR. LFR is for people who can't or don't want to raid on a schedule.
Flex is for guilds with members that raid on a schedule but have a problem with everyone showing up, it allows them to run their raids with the people who made it without having to pug to fill the holes.

[Deleted]

All LFR proofed was that it is not capable of getting new players in, halt or even slow down the decline in subs. The only thing that prevented wow losing even more subs was the annual pass.

LFR doesn't bring in new players but drive them quicker away because it takes out every reason to stay subbed longer if you are interested in endgame. It gives you a false look at what raiding really is. If you only knew LFR, which of course is the first thing a new lvl 90 will do, you had to think this game is boring and has no point, no interaction, no carot on the stick.

The legendary RNG quest stimulates you to keep subbed. Character and gear progression does, too.

I do agree with you that players who never try further than LFR are potentially missing out. I'd assume players are generally aware there are 2 difficulties higher than LFR (Normal and Heroic) and that LFR is the Easy mode. I have high expectations Flex will be able to fill the gap between LFR and Normal, able to function as a stepping stone.

[Jessicka]

The brainstem is a small part of the body just like the 1% of WoW upper tier guilds. Cut them from the scene ENTIRELY by removing the mode and the body will die. I know it's hard for you to grasp this concept but the 1% is extremely important for the appeal of the game in general. You don't witness a random que LFR raid at blizzcon live raid to amuse viewers do you?

I think you're overestimating your self importance. While they are a draw to the game and they do offer inspiration, they only do so to a very few who would serve to become a part of that 1% anyway.

Because i have no other options. Whenever i can gear up my alts from organised raiding again you won't see me in an lfr anytime soon. Too bad LFR killed that, at the pug/alt level at least.

Christ this is going in circles lol.

I don't feel like it did, my realm is pretty small but I can still find pugs to old content, less so to ToT but that's a difficulty issue. Flex will fix that, none issue.

He's spot on. No need for the 1%. the 99% really dont care about them

Another would take their place. It's probably less than 99% but, it's the stuff for the 1% that provides the overriding themes and story for the rest to dig in to. They don't care about the players, but they do care about the plot and activities.

So incrase the difficulty of 5mans and LFR? Problem solved!

Did you play in early Cataclysm solo joining using the LF tool? Even Wrath had Occulus and HoR which would cause people to jump out the moment they zoned in. Any instance could do that in Cataclysm. That's why you can't raise the difficulty level of LF-level content.

Yet the 99% are all trying to be like the 1%.

I don't believe that at all. There's probably another 1% trying to be like the 1%. They're just very vocal.

Yeah sure, put the axe in normal modes and nerf them to the ground, not like i would mind, its not relevant content to me.

That would be the logical solution, were Flex not incoming. Heroic would still be hard and those who want the exclusive content would still have at least designs on being there.

I still promise you it wouldn't help much because its still more efforts than queueing -> leaving my character auto-attacking the boss while i take care of the laundry for example, and coming back with items more than powerful enough to allow me to do about anything on my alt, Secrets of the empires for that alt's legendary cloak and valor points.

Is it a bad thing to do? Yes. Why do people like me do it? Because the content is literally not worth playing for people like and doing it doesn't have any real impact on the group's success simply because of how untertuned it is. I've seen 5 people kill Durumu from the first Death Beam phase to the end.

So you think you're above it? I think most players think they're above where they really are. It's like a survey of drivers found the overwhelming majority of drivers rated themselves above average.

[Dormie]

The legendary RNG quest stimulates you to keep subbed. Character and gear progression does, too.

I do agree with you that players who never try further than LFR are potentially missing out. I'd assume players are generally aware there are 2 difficulties higher than LFR (Normal and Heroic) and that LFR is the Easy mode. I have high expectations Flex will be able to fill the gap between LFR and Normal, able to function as a stepping stone.

I just think it's sad we need a stepping stone between LFR and normal...

[Deleted]

Flex is for different people than LFR. LFR is for people who can't or don't want to raid on a schedule.
Flex is for guilds with members that raid on a schedule but have a problem with everyone showing up, it allows them to run their raids with the people who made it without having to pug to fill the holes.

Flex is not necessarily for guilds, for Flex is x-realm. Flex does not require a guild or even realm group. Flex requires a peer group (ie. friend list, Openraid, guild, trade chat, realm forums, ...). The existence of Flex allows Normal and Heroic to be tuned higher, too.

[Jtbrig7390]

But that's part of the appeal, is it not? Dark Souls and Demon's Souls would definitely not be as popular as it is now if the difficulty was changeable. You can't tell me a game where it's notorious for its difficulty suddenly drops it will do well. It just won't, and will probably lose a lot of faith in its community who liked it hard, and gain only people who enjoy the varied difficulties. It'll switch out your entire base of players, which generally isn't a good idea.

Right but would you rather have a game that is hard but only 500k people playing it or a game that is easy or cater's to both modes that has 5 million people playing it.

[PenguinChan]

Right but would you rather have a game that is hard but only 500k people playing it or a game that is easy or cater's to both modes that has 5 million people playing it.

Dark souls and Demon's Souls has millions of copies sold and is quite popular. Just because a game is hard does not mean it isn't popular. Granted this is an arbitrary example set by me and you, since it is a non-subscriptions game. I personally favor the harder, more rewarding game. Everyone has different tastes -- I get that.

[Dreknar20]

Flex is for guilds with members that raid on a schedule but have a problem with everyone showing up, it allows them to run their raids with the people who made it without having to pug to fill the holes.

so then once again why does it not share a lockout with normal/heroic if its for people who cant run normal'heroic?

[Dormie]

Right but would you rather have a game that is hard but only 500k people playing it or a game that is easy or cater's to both modes that has 5 million people playing it.

I'd rather WoW pre-Cata with 11+ million and still a game with integrity.

[Jtbrig7390]

I just think it's sad we need a stepping stone between LFR and normal...

Well for new player's wanting to jump from LFR to Normal mode it mite be to much since Normal Mode is 500% harder.

You don't just jump in the pool you put ur foot in first and test the water.

[anaxie]

can you prove the subs leaving is because of LFR because I bet if it was not for the fact people have something to do "LFR" there would be a bigger sub drop.

People blame sub drops on far too narrow range of things. I believe the encouragement to complete your charm quest weekly , VP cap, LFR, Difficult fights, Easy Fights, PvP XXX reason, Real life issues outside the game. ALL these things contribute to sub loss. I quit for 6 months because of real life issues towards the later end of ulduar till half way through ToC. I didn't hate the game.

Now that doesn't mean all these things are bad. VP upgrades IN THE CURRENT implementation is a fantastic feature. VP and badges in general have been relatively useless since their implementation after a certain point.

Coins despite being a chore to gather do have upsides AND extreme downs. I have experienced both extremes. From getting 7 IN A ROW BACK TO BACK coin BiS H items in a row. To going the entirety of ToT not getting a single item to even d/e.

My ONLY ONLY complaint with LFR is that it needs to do a better job promoting group play. But it appears they are going with flex and using that as the alternative stepping stone to raiding. If that is the choice they make then it's a good one so long as the modes are able to lead more fluidly into another so players aren't lost inbetween trying to make the jump.

LFR is the greatest thing that has ever happened and one of the biggest trajedies at the same time for various reasons.

HOWEVER, the benefit that it provides by allowing more reasources to go towards raiding and offering more content for EVERY SINGLE PLAYER of all skill levels is a huge bonus especially after disaster of the late half a cata. MoP has been everything blizzard strived to create and then some.

Brawlers a completely spur of the moment implementation is a fantastic addition to the game imo. Pet battles is a HUGE part of the game now. Pet battle participation <those that enjoy it> is very likely larger then the Heroic and Normal mode playerbase.

[Jtbrig7390]

I'd rather WoW pre-Cata with 11+ million and still a game with integrity.

In otherwords Wrath I take it. Because personally I wouldn't mind having wrath back ether.

But in what you was commenting that was not a choice.

[Deleted]

I just think it's sad we need a stepping stone between LFR and normal...

How is that sad? If it isn't for you (say you main in a heroic raiding guild) it won't affect you.

The two are quite different, and the ilvl difference is too (20 ilvl in 5.2, before it was only 13). Good luck clearing Normal mode with LFR gear from previous tier (483) you will not get very far. So you have to do ToT LFR first and get VP. And then Flex provides an appropriate content before Normal mode. X-realm, with a flexible amount of players.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

The reason people for anything or any reason ever feel entitled is because it already has been given and it then becomes expected usually because they are dependent upon it. It is a yin-yang concept really. Because people were given a easier path they expect the road to remain easy and have become either lazy or less skilled as a result. Of course this doesn't apply to everyone and, in fact, I would suspect to the fewer. Something similar to welfare, in the United States, where most of the people that use it have it as a safety net and then get off it when they recover because they try and find to get a job. But sadly you only hear about the few that use it and abuse it the rest of their lives so the "better off" people can harp on it.

Sound familiar?

Both sides of the argument have to realize that it is being exploited from two directions. Yes, absolutely people that are less skilled and able use and abused things like LFR to inflate their egos and ilevel to feel like more then they are. They will never want to give this up and will never believe you if you point it out. The ego is already to well feed. But honestly for the most part this is a slim but likely vocal minority. But on the other side of the coin most of the complaining about how easy content and entitlement has ruined the game is a falsehood as well. It is a slim number of people that exploit it so. LFR has likely really increased the number of folks that are interested in raiding and seeing harder content because it has given them an opportunity to either realize it exists or can be fun. It is just something that is really hard to see because a lot of guilds won't or don't give these people a chance because they are only interested in a slim .5% of the population to join them.

WoW is one of the few games that has really ever seen something like this because of the generational change that took place in it. Our parents had trouble passing the mantle to us because of our "self entitlement" , "immaturity" and of course "lack of experience" (if you reached the age of 20-30ish). They all thought we had it easier and sure we did. We had computers and they had type writers. We have cell phones and the internet and they had land lines and the encyclopedia. Best thing everyone can do is embrace the change and help everyone we can get into real raiding. Stop pushing folks away. Give a helping hand. Allow everyone to grow as they see fit. This goes all the way to Blizzard staff, LFR raiders, normal raiders, heroic raiders, and all the rest of the spectrum.

[anaxie]

PvE already requires considerably less skill than PVP, as you're facing a scripted, somewhat predictable encounter, rather than an actual human being.

Human beings are very predictable. Why else are there comps and counter comps?