Patch 5.4 PvP Mounts, In Game Store Update, 5.4 PTR Notes Update, Blue Posts, Comic

[Duster505]

So to sum up today's MMO-Champ posting comments:

"<insert stupidity here> COULD happen, but hasn't and I can't prove it will."
"WHAT IF <insert stupidity here> happens?!?!?"
"I BET <insert stupidity here> will happen!"
"YOU KNOW THEY WILL <insert stupidity here>."
Oh, and my favorite out and out stupidity/lie of the day: "Remember when they were gonna charge for RealID?!?!?"....nope, sure don't. Because that never happened. Ever. Only in your whiny. self entitled heads.

Apparently, the group of players on MMO-Champion are omniscient or something, as they all claim to see the future, attack anyone who says anything different than their assumptions as if they are infallible, and are able to live in some alternate universe where things that didn't happen here happened there.

I think ppl have every right to wonder what will happen. Lets not forget that Blizzard managed to turn D3 into RMAH joke rather than good solid long term gameplay and character progression. Thats the real concern for many players atm with WOW.

[Dazzy]

Ladies and gentlemen, behold the massive hyperventilation that's going on here. Actually, it's not akin to selling gear. It's akin to buying Charms, which DO NOT guarantee gear. It's a gamble (everyone has the same chances), it's limited per week (everyone has the same limit), and more often than not, leaves you empty handed. That's the luck of the lottery. Let's be honest about what the real issue is here for all the whiners, at least regarding Charms, as we really have no other clue as to what Blizzard may or may not offer from an In-Game Store. It's not the purchase of Charms or other said convenience (EXP boost) items that irks them; they're butt hurt that others would be able to bypass doing dailies or other grinds for Charms. The real issue is time commitment; the whiners see their time and effort in game as more valuable than someone's time and effort out of game. Believe it or not, people who will pay for Charms are putting themselves more at risk that those who don't; if they lose on their bonus rolls, at least the person who didn't pay can say "well, my there goes the time I invested in grinding, better luck next week" whereas the person who paid loses both time AND money. Such is the nature of gambling. I say if people want to pony up and chance the odds, let them. Bonus rolls don't guarantee anything, you can't say otherwise.

I'm not arguing for or against an In-Game Store, but you make it seem as if heroic thunderforged BiS gear is going to rain from the skies. Guess what? It won't, just like it doesn't currently.

Everyone has the same chance IF they farm the max amount of them every week, those that don't have an infinitely worse chance of getting bonus loot over a purchaser. That is the definition of pay to win, look it up.

Idc either way but they are headed down a slippery slope (yeah I said it, wanna fight about it?). If it were to go live without massive sub loss, you would have to be corky from life goes on naive to believe everything in game wouldn't be in the store for cash.

I can afford to max them out for every registered user on this forum every week, I personally just can't see paying for something to advance in a game that already charges a subscription. To each his own I guess.

[Shudder]

Oh lawdy! It's so hard to get out of the game to buy pets and mounts! Bull shit, it's an in game cash shop to charge us for crap that should be included in the subscription. Pay to win, gg.

[derpkitteh]

more lame pvp BS :/

f**king hate pvp, but that horse would be perfect for my dk.

[Shudder]

I will gladly pay for a 100% buff experience. Or to avoid farming fraking coins

I bet you would, why work for things when you can just use your welfare check for it?

[Kitterfly]

They're greedy, it's a big part why I've quit.

I understand every company wants to make money. However, you best understand that I also have a right and really a duty to give them the middle-finger when I feel they're crossing a line as a consumer.

1) We pay a monthly subscription.

2) Their services are insanely overpriced.

3) You still have to buy the expansions.

4) Interestingly enough, even with this revenue, their customer service continues to degrade.

5) They've already got quite a few items up for digital download, just aesthetic. I already disagreed with this to begin with but it never did get too out of hand.

6) Now they're adding in bonuses, temporary boosts, etc. like many games have incorporated except, oh wait, they're non-subscription.

In other words, their greed officially has no bounds and I am exhausted with it. Remember how they were discussing creating a "membership plus" model for extra features like cross-realm partying? Yeah, that, should've been a very clear and evident sign they have no interest in playing nice with people who already bleed coin to play their game.

Not to mention, Blizzy, your shit is getting boring and repetitive. You're not doing enough to refresh the formula and make dealing with this kind of crap not tempting in the least.

Great game but it's age is showing bad and it's publisher's gluttony is even more glaring.

[Idletime]

Let's see, 2004 the sub was 14.95 US, 2013 the sub is 14.95 US. Not a single raise in the price in all that time, they've merely stood on the quality of the game to insure the income. They introduce something that will be test marketed in Asia (where transactions like these are extremely common and already accepted, and even demanded) to possibly make some more money and keep the lights on and even enhance the game for others even further, people flip right out.

This will have no bearing on anyone's in-game success, and if it makes it to the US/EU servers, then it enhances QOL giving those with actual *gasp* paying jobs that have the disposable income but not the time except to raid and enjoy the game for what it is in their spare time. Maybe your raiders that are always late for raid because they have work, or those that didn't have the time to grind dailies will be able to further benefit your raid with rolls they wouldn't have before. For those that commit way too much time, you'll still enjoy the benefits of your time in-game the same way. The difference is they are starting to recognize that there is a market for those that will pay for a little assistance. For me, I'm ambivalent about how a person achieves their raid group responsibilities, just that they achieve them.

[Kitterfly]

Let's see, 2004 the sub was 14.95 US, 2013 the sub is 14.95 US. Not a single raise in the price in all that time, they've merely stood on the quality of the game to insure the income. They introduce something that will be test marketed in Asia (where transactions like these are extremely common and already accepted, and even demanded) to possibly make some more money and keep the lights on and even enhance the game for others even further, people flip right out.

This will have no bearing on anyone's in-game success, and if it makes it to the US/EU servers, then it enhances QOL giving those with actual *gasp* paying jobs that have the disposable income but not the time except to raid and enjoy the game for what it is in their spare time. Maybe your raiders that are always late for raid because they have work, or those that didn't have the time to grind dailies will be able to further benefit your raid with rolls they wouldn't have before. For those that commit way too much time, you'll still enjoy the benefits of your time in-game the same way. The difference is they are starting to recognize that there is a market for those that will pay for a little assistance. For me, I'm ambivalent about how a person achieves their raid group responsibilities, just that they achieve them.

You crack me up.

Thank you for acting like the subscription is the only way they make money and even more humorously, dismissing it as if it's not an insane revenue unto itself.

This is what makes corporate America so awesome to deal with. We have companies figuring out ways best to screw us out of our hard-earned money while there are consumers figuring out the best way to graciously accept said screwings. We can't possibly lose with this winning combination.

Awesome, awesome, double-scoop-of-fracking-ice-scream awesome.

[Shudder]

Not sure if serious...
So imagine if you can pay to get your weekly 50 lesser charms.. you choose to get them that way...
How exactly is it P2W when you are still, just like everyone else, limited to 3 runes per week?

If they let you somehow gain additional Runes, then you'd have a point.

Not sure if serious...
So imagine you can pay to get gear off ji-kun..you choose to get it that way...
I mean you're still limited to just what ji-kun drops, just like everyone else that chose not to pay and went and got to him in game. If they let you somehow get more gear off ji-kun that everyone else then that would be a point? Yeah thought so. Think before you post.

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It's entitled whiners like you that have made this community toxic, and a large reason why I left.

Um...you're still here. You wiped on leaving. l2leave.

[Sting]

I think ppl have every right to wonder what will happen. Lets not forget that Blizzard managed to turn D3 into RMAH joke rather than good solid long term gameplay and character progression. Thats the real concern for many players atm with WOW.

Again, your opinion.

[Berethos08]

The difference is they are starting to recognize that there is a market for those that will pay for a little assistance. For me, I'm ambivalent about how a person achieves their raid group responsibilities, just that they achieve them.

There's always been a market for those what will pay for a little assistance - what assumption do you think the western F2P market has been operating under for several years now?

The real difference is that these other companies don't believe the market will widely accept required fees alongside monetized convenience (pay to win isn't exactly a common occurrence in the western market, the vast majority of cash shop items are vanity, cosmetic, or convenience, with a few including content, and even fewer selling legit gear...and even fewer than that selling useful, end-game gear)...it's typically seen as a trade-off.

None of these companies think they could get away with having required fees and monetizing convenience items at all - Blizzard, as of right now, seems to think they can.

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Again, your opinion.

The fact that you could spend 6 months grinding for an item and not get it, or spend less than a days pay (even at minimum wage) and get it in a few minutes shopping on the RMAH, lends more than enough credibility to that idea. The game itself is pretty good, has gotten better, and hopefully sees even better refinement when they get around to finishing the itemization patch...but the RMAH and its buddy the GAH, with the current system, do actively undermine the gameplay of a game focused around farming for loot.

Still, the RMAH surrounds a separate issue (the black market of goods sold between players) than issues that come with a company created cash shop.

[Sting]

None of these companies think they could get away with having required fees and monetizing convenience items at all - Blizzard, as of right now, seems to think they can.

I guess being market leader by a fair margin gives them the confidence to try and do it. As far as I'm concerned, nothing changes.
The Blizzard Store already exists, and except for an authenticator, I've never bought anything. I don't need xp boosts, I don't need to buy tokens that are faceroll easy to get, I don't need mount skins that are "tainted" by a RL price tag. The only thing I'd consider buying are extra professions slots if they'd implement those.

- - - Updated - - -

The fact that you could spend 6 months grinding for an item and not get it, or spend less than a days pay (even at minimum wage) and get it in a few minutes shopping on the RMAH, lends more than enough credibility to that idea. The game itself is pretty good, has gotten better, and hopefully sees even better refinement when they get around to finishing the itemization patch...but the RMAH and its buddy the GAH, with the current system, do actively undermine the gameplay of a game focused around farming for loot.

Still, the RMAH surrounds a separate issue (the black market of goods sold between players) than issues that come with a company created cash shop.

Random loot is just that, random. On the flipside, good items that you do find but which aren't suited to your specific needs/wants can be sold on the GAH/RMAH, effectively cancelling out each other. You have to keep in mind that blizzard isn't selling stuff on the RMAH, other people are.
I could argue that you don't even have to use the AH, but the terrible drop system they have right now kinda screws me over there. I sincerely hope they improve the quality of found items like they promised to, that should make self found gameplay more viable.

[Woakerio]

Everyone has the same chance IF they farm the max amount of them every week, those that don't have an infinitely worse chance of getting bonus loot over a purchaser. That is the definition of pay to win, look it up.

Idc either way but they are headed down a slippery slope (yeah I said it, wanna fight about it?). If it were to go live without massive sub loss, you would have to be corky from life goes on naive to believe everything in game wouldn't be in the store for cash.

I can afford to max them out for every registered user on this forum every week, I personally just can't see paying for something to advance in a game that already charges a subscription. To each his own I guess.

Getting 50 lesser elder charms is stupidly easy..."infinitely worse chance"? Do Isle of Thunder quests/kill mobs/dailies/etc. Now if the charms were a random drop off a handful of mobs at a rate of 1%, then we're talking P2W. As long as lesser elder charms are ridiculously easy to earn in-game, its not P2W.

[Taeloria]

Getting 50 lesser elder charms is stupidly easy..."infinitely worse chance"? Do Isle of Thunder quests/kill mobs/dailies/etc. Now if the charms were a random drop off a handful of mobs at a rate of 1%, then we're talking P2W. As long as lesser elder charms are ridiculously easy to earn in-game, its not P2W.

That's how I feel. I won't be buying any out of principal, also in part that I get my mogu runes every week and still have more lesser than I know what to do with. If someone wants to purchase some lessens on their own I don't see the problem, my personal experience isn't affected one bit by it. My main point is, I'm not going to complain about ant true p2w schemes (aka auto h-raid clears or even h quality items dropping in lfr, etc) until there's really something to complain about.

[Shudder]

You're naive if you think they'll keep lesser charms insanely easy to get. Why would they charge for them if they were easy? That makes no sense, they'll make no sales. They'll make them harder to acquire to tempt you into purchasing them. That's just insanely obvious.

[shadowfyre27]

I'm genuinely surprised at how many people are ok with Blizzard selling gear in a cash shop because that is precisely what they are doing with the lesser charms. Alot of people seem to constantly overlook the fact that the lesser charms in a very direct way lead to gear. I pointed this out earlier in the thread. As others like the person above me pointed out if you believe that they will allow non "premium*" players to be able to get the lesser charms as easy as they do now 1 of 2 things is happening. Either your just deluding yourself and don't want to believe the writing that is currently appearing on the wall or Blizzard is even more stupid and idiotic then any of us could have ever thought. Personally I'm leaning towards people deluding themselves, because Blizzard has in the past shown that they are willing to try anything and do anything to make an additional buck.

[Deleted]

Bahh, everyone about p2w and mounts. I burst into laughter at Dark Legacy Comics when she proposes to him !

[MasterHamster]

The funny thing is that's pretty much what they are offering. Technically speaking by offering to sell lesser charms they are by proxy offering to sell you the best gear in game. You can't truthfully say that they aren't. As I pointed out lesser charms lead to a chance at gear. For heroic raiders this means that you can technically speaking purchase thunderforged heroic items. Is it a sure thing you will get a thunderforged heroic item? no, but then you can therefore it is by proxy technically selling BiS gear and that you can't say it isn't.

Since they'd be paying just to get their 3 Runes faster than other people that week, yes I can safely say it is not p2w to buy Charms. I don't care that Charms -> Runes -> Chance at HC Thunderforge items, so are the ones you get from dailies. If someone is willing to pay to skip the dailies, then they can do it. All they are getting for paying is lesser time spent getting runes. EVERYONE GETS THREE RUNES EVERY WEEK.

As said, if they allowed you to gain more Runes per week, then we'd have a problem.
Think for a moment before you jump to these ridiculous conclusions. Runes are capped, therefore the only thing you can earn by buying charms is time, not power.

Not sure if serious...
So imagine you can pay to get gear off ji-kun..you choose to get it that way...
I mean you're still limited to just what ji-kun drops, just like everyone else that chose not to pay and went and got to him in game. If they let you somehow get more gear off ji-kun that everyone else then that would be a point? Yeah thought so.

What are you even trying to argue? Paying to get runes faster is like paying to get an extra chance from a boss? Or are you comparing someone who paid for getting his runes versus someone who didn't get theirs at all? Zero sense.

Think before you post.

How ironic.
I figured that buying charms can't be p2w since it doesn't allow you to gain more runes than anyone else that week. Paying for convenience, not power.

This is the outcome if we are allowed to buy charms (we still don't know details but for now I'm going to go as if we could buy 50 charms for a set sum). Things that theoretically could come after, such as increased charms required for the weekly so people are more likely to pay, or any other conspiracy theory, isn't relevant:

Player A doesn't want to pay for charms. He does his 20 dailies and gets the rest from other sources.
He exchanges them for 3 Runes. The weekly maximum.
Player B doesn't want to do his dailies. He pays [sum] to get 50 lesser charms.
He exchanges them for 3 Runes. The weekly maximum.

Player B did not buy character power. If anything he bought time and convenience.
Case closed. It's not p2w, no matter how people want to twist and turn it, or speculate about lesser charms becoming harder to get just to boost sales.