What is the tipping point on pay to win in this game?

[Baracuda]

I doubt they'll put new character models in the store, character customization though

[soulzek]

What a controversial topic
http://www.mmo-champion.com/search.p...rchid=54940948

[Gambit5555]

Except that a lot of people would probably disagree with you. While it may not be P2W, if they charged for the new player models you would see an uproar you haven't seen since they tried putting peoples real names on the forums. The rest of it though I would probably agree with as well.

I believe this list was more in response to what would be the tipping point before they quit, not what is pay 2 win. Two different conversations going on at the time. Plenty of people have their tipping point well before pay to win.

[Venant]

Actually I'm not saying that at all. What I am saying P2W is, is when you obtain an item that is better than anything that exists currently in game. For example, the best weapon in game provides 9000 DPS. The cash shop weapon provides 10,000 DPS. This is P2W.

And no, I am not assuming that players have an infinite amount of time. However, if like in your example it takes 10,000 hours to grind out a weapon or $20 bucks then it is the company screwing you over. That doesn't make it P2W, just makes the company greedy because they are purposely making it all but impossible to obtain in the game and forcing you to spend money.

I'm just curious, do you think that the RMAH has made Diablo 3 pay-to-win? Perhaps the ultimate solution for WoW will be to adopt what they did in D3, make all items that drop in Raids sellable on a Real Money Auction House. Perhaps add some random affixes on to those items that would make it extremely difficult to ever get a 'perfect' item.

[Gambit5555]

I consider it Pay to Win when i can enter in my CC info, pay 25 dollars, and I'm sitting on the Throne of Stormwind with a giant Statue of me in front of the keep. That, my friends, is how you pay to win

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Ethics say that they should. And your argument collapses on that single word. Most people care about the principle, not the net importance.

You're argument that most people care about the principle implies that you speak for most people, which you dont. Thats where your argument collapses on a Single word

[NightZero88]

I'm just curious, do you think that the RMAH has made Diablo 3 pay-to-win? Perhaps the ultimate solution for WoW will be to adopt what they did in D3, make all items that drop in Raids sellable on a Real Money Auction House. Perhaps add some random affixes on to those items that would make it extremely difficult to ever get a 'perfect' item.

No, I don't because you can farm all that gear. However, that being said I think the system itself is stupid simply because the amount of time it takes to farm the piece you need (.000000001% chance it seems like) basically forces you to use the AH. However, there is a GAH and a RMAH. You can use the GAH instead of the RMAH and not spend any money. But you would need to farm to get the gold. So really it's a bad cycle. But no, I don't because it all came from someone farming it in game.

[Gegan]

The answer would seem to be when a real world financial transaction actually affect the game in a non-cosmetic way.