[spoiler] Ghostcrawler confirms ridiculous Alliance outcome in 5.4

[Austilias]

or do you want NEW content, a good next xpack, and a swift release of said xpack?

Why compromise? I don't see why when the Alliance want their supposed victories demonstrated in-game, it's suddenly not possible due to some do-or-die dilemma between choosing new patch/expansion content, or the alteration of some old world stuff to accurately depict the course of events that are taking place in short stories/novels. Yet when it comes to demonstrating Horde victories via Theramore/Gilneas and so on, this is somehow not an issue.

[Hitei]

You realize Dalaran isn't in Northrend anymore right? They would have to completely remove that version with the post 5.1 questline phasing. Which is stupid and a complete waste of resource because the rest of that zone/continent is stuck in a time bubble from years ago when Arthas was still the LK.

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Yes, lets punish the people who helped kill Garrosh.

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It was taken over by Northwatch soldiers. I don't hear anyone crying about why wasn't it phased out of the game after Northwatch and Theramore were destroyed.

I do realize that. And I also realize that it's 95% likely we will never see the changes to Dalaran ever reflected in game, it will continue to forever be a neutral city that welcomes Horde with open arms. Hence my frustration.

You mean the people who helped kill Garrosh, after supporting him and doing his bidding for two years resulting in a large number of deaths and a decent amount of destruction around the world. The people who helped the Forsaken slaughter any and all human forces north of Arathi before the Gilneans managed to retake their kingdom?
Yes, I can see how we should just let them go. They helped kill Garrosh after all.

Because the shattered remnants of human soldiers were of little consequence, and get wiped out by novice Horde soldiers.

To keep his people from starving to death.

Yes. God can you imagine the famine that would result from the loss of all of that farmland the Orcs have in Ashenvale?

[Aquamonkey]

I don't see how it's any less stupid nor any less of a resource waste to go to the trouble of turning Theramore into a crater, or Gilneas into a ghost town.

That is current content, not something from 2 expansions ago.

[rpdrichard]

So you want a small content patch, that didn't even have a raid, to completely redo the keystone city of a previous expansion?

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Night Elves invading from Azshara happens in game.
Tiragarde Keep is in game.
SoO is in game.

No, the night elves are protecting one of their ancestral territories from being defiled by the goblins

[Aquamonkey]

Or both the alliance and horde can both live there in peace and start trading between each other again. The horde still needs land there or be able to trade with the night elves or there people will go back to starving. The only reason hellscream invaded Ashenvale was to stop his people from staving to death. His invasion there was justified because it was that or have his people starve to death. And it was all started because the night elves refused to trade with the orcs.

People forget that Garrosh got so much support in the first place because he supplied the resources they needed for survival despite the Alliance being selfish and hoarding them. A little trading and Garrosh wouldn't have gotten the support to go on the warpath.

Hellscream's ascension has been applauded by most orcs, who feel that his brash warrior instincts and unwillingness to negotiate for needed resources are more in tune with the true orc way. While Garrosh appreciates public recognition, even relishes the acceptance amongst these green-skinned orcs, he has little time or patience for ostentatious displays of leadership. His attention is now focused on strengthening the walls of Orgrimmar and providing supplies vital to his people: food, lumber, and the other essentials for living, which are growing scarcer in the recent drought. If these can only be gained through the blood of selfish Alliance dogs, so be it. (Source)

[Frontenac]

For those of you jumping all over Blizzard about the fact that the Alliance merely gives back Org to the Horde after the war, claiming that it is stupid, and unrealistic... You should look into the facts of the war of 1812 and read about the land exchange at the end.

Since you brought it up, care to light our lanterns? Because I can't see any similarities. The 1812 War ended as a stalemate because no party had a definitive advantage over the other. And what lands will be traded between the Horde and the Alliance? The Alliance as clear advantage over the Horde, which is in shambles, and could impose conditions. Yet it does not. That makes no sense after Ashenvale, Gilneas, Theramore and Stone Talon. It's just as silly as Malfurion's neutrality.

[Sandrox]

People forget that Garrosh got so much support in the first place because he supplied the resources they needed for survival despite the Alliance being selfish and hoarding them. A little trading and Garrosh wouldn't have gone on the warpath.

Yeah, fuck those night elves for not trading with the orcs who were destroying their forests and killing their people. The nerve!

[MisterMxyzptlk]

Why compromise? I don't see why when the Alliance want their supposed victories demonstrated in-game, it's suddenly not possible due to some do-or-die dilemma between choosing new patch/expansion content, or the alteration of some old world stuff to accurately depict the course of events that are taking place in short stories/novels. Yet when it comes to demonstrating Horde victories via Theramore/Gilneas and so on, this is somehow not an issue.

its called time and money of development, and you say that like none of the alli victories in cata existed in game, they do exist
please return to reality, the point of cata was to revamp the world, and when they did players whined and subs dropped.
the majority of people don't want revamps they want new, and blizzard knows this.

[Aquamonkey]

No, the night elves are protecting one of their ancestral territories from being defiled by the goblins

Their ancestral territories that haven't been in their control since it was taken over by Naga...

[Ephinia]

That is current content, not something from 2 expansions ago.

-what-? Theramore in the old world is -not- current content. It's as much current content as Dalaran in Northrend being current content. Why change one without the other?

[Airwaves]

Yeah, fuck those night elves for not trading with the orcs who were destroying their forests and killing their people. The nerve!

They were not destroying the forest or killing there people till after they refused to trade with them. Because it was either kill the night elves and take there land OR watch there people stave to death. Even Thrall would have taken the same step to invade ashenvale if he was put in the same place as hellscream, both had to look after there people first and foremost.

[Austilias]

Their ancestral territories that haven't been in their control since it was taken over by Naga...

I suppose that it's more acceptable to let the Horde charge in and defile them further then.

[Sandrox]

They were not destroying the forest or killing there people till after they refused to trade with them. Because it was either kill the night elves and take there land OR watch there people stave to death. Even Thrall would have taken the same step to invade ashenvale if he was put in the same place as hellscream, both had to look after there people first and foremost.

I guess you missed all of classic through wrath then eh?

[Hitei]

I guess you missed all of classic through wrath then eh?

You mean all of WC3 through wrath.

[Seramore]

It's pretty funny how people actually get buttmad about a story that's not even theirs. Get over it, for realz.

[Austilias]

They were not destroying the forest or killing there people till after they refused to trade with them. Because it was either kill the night elves and take there land OR watch there people stave to death. Even Thrall would have taken the same step to invade ashenvale if he was put in the same place as hellscream, both had to look after there people first and foremost.

They may have had their reasons; but they can't blame the Night Elves for wanting to defend their ancient forests. Just what did the Orcs need all that wood for, exactly? The Night Elves certainly managed to get by just fine without decimating the place. If it is the case that they needed the wood to fuel their "Horde War Machine", then the aforementioned war machine can't claim to be surprised when it finds itself encountering war at the hands of the Night Elves who defend their homes.

[rpdrichard]

A Horde centric expansion? The Alliance raiding the Horde capital city and defeating their leader within a Horde centric expansion? Are you out of your mind?

If the Horde had conquered Stormwind and left the population alone you would also call it a Horde centric expansion I bet.
You aren't satisfied until the Horde is completely gone from the world, are you? Well, I have to give you a little hint, it's never going to happen.

The core of the game is Horde vs Alliance, there can NEVER be a true winner. So stop hoping for it.

Is not the alliance raiding a horde city, is the alliance helping the horde to raid a city that they already lost to Garrosh, and killing the guy they want dead anyway and hasn't being recognized as the horde leader for a while now.

[Airwaves]

They may have had their reasons; but they can't blame the Night Elves for wanting to defend their ancient forests. Just what did the Orcs need all that wood for, exactly? The Night Elves certainly managed to get by just fine without decimating the place. If it is the case that they needed the wood to fuel their "Horde War Machine", then the aforementioned war machine can't claim to be surprised when it finds itself encountering war at the hands of the Night Elves who defend their homes.

They needed to clear the wood for farms so they could feed there people.

[Oswen]

I never expected any more from SoO, it was clear from the beginning what the outcome would have become.

However even if not changing/phasing zones (which can only be done for Theramore ) they could have added some more interesting lines, even without harsh conditions the Horde itself, which values honor, could have stepped up and apologize, planning to help to rebuild the damage they did like Theramore/Gilneas/Southsore/whatever, showing they actually feel in debt and are willing to collaborate, like a true honorable being would do.

[Aquamonkey]

-what-? Theramore in the old world is -not- current content. It's as much current content as Dalaran in Northrend being current content. Why change one without the other?

Small quest hub of relative insignificance vs the entire center of an expansion...

TBH, I don't know why they even wasted redoing Theramore. But I guess it's kind of a big deal since they didn't give us a proper pre-MoP event. And turning something into an unpopulated crater is easier than trying to redesign a city's NPCs.