Frostflame Weapon?

[BlissfulBlithe]

Frostflame Weapon - Increases the damage of your Lava Lash by 40% if your off-hand weapon is enchanted with Frostbrand. While your weapon is imbued with Flametongue Weapon, your attacks also slow the target's movement speed by 50% for 3 sec.

So...we now lose 40% damage on Lava Lash if we want to use Frostbrand Weapon for the Unleashed Weapon gap closer, all so Flametongue Weapon can be a mock-up Frostbrand and free up "Primal Elementalist" and "Elemental Blast" (which are clunky and often useless in PvP encounters for Enhancement).

It'd be nice if they just baked in the 40% damage to Lava Lash without the need to use Flametongue, that way we would have a choice instead of being forced out of either option and our 4pc could become something completely different.

What are everybody's thoughts on this?

[Deleted]

Well I agree PE and EB have flaws and/or are clunky but at least you don't feel so forced into UF because the set bonus favours the Imbue and the talent puts a sprint on top of it.

I still don't see the point in having Frostbrand AND Rockbitter on our arsenal anymore. One just got obliterated by the set bonus change and the other isn't used since Beth'ilac taunting/ragnaros last phase kite, and even then it was very very uncommon to have a shaman do that.

[BlissfulBlithe]

I personally preferred being forced into Unleashed Fury because the gap closer in a PvP scenario was very helpful, this change is removing the gap closer and giving us upgraded unreliable Elementals and Elemental Blast which just doesn't fit the role of Enhancement. If they kept the gap closer and baked that into this Flametongue set bonus, I'd be quite happy but that doesn't seem to be the case.

I'm going to miss speeding up everytime I use my Unleash Elements...

[Rangar]

So now there's no reason to use Frostbrand weapon... ever? I don't like this direction.

[prwraith]

I wish they'd stop half assing things. Either make some more dps classes have tanking specs or don't give us teaser abilities.

[blackblade]

It'd be nice if they just baked in the 40% damage to Lava Lash without the need to use Flametongue, that way we would have a choice instead of being forced out of either option and our 4pc could become something completely different.

What are everybody's thoughts on this?

The reason lava lash is boosted by FT is to make it a DPS loss to do WF/WF.

[Nitwit]

The reason lava lash is boosted by FT is to make it a DPS loss to do WF/WF.

Unleash Elements accomplishes that goal just fine, as does the 7% magical damage buff on flametongue weapon.

[Buxton McGraff]

Frostflame Weapon - Increases the damage of your Lava Lash by 40% if your off-hand weapon is enchanted with Frostbrand. While your weapon is imbued with Flametongue Weapon, your attacks also slow the target's movement speed by 50% for 3 sec.

So...we now lose 40% damage on Lava Lash if we want to use Frostbrand Weapon for the Unleashed Weapon gap closer, all so Flametongue Weapon can be a mock-up Frostbrand and free up "Primal Elementalist" and "Elemental Blast" (which are clunky and often useless in PvP encounters for Enhancement).

It'd be nice if they just baked in the 40% damage to Lava Lash without the need to use Flametongue, that way we would have a choice instead of being forced out of either option and our 4pc could become something completely different.

What are everybody's thoughts on this?

You apparently don't know what the enhancement 2 set is. Your frostbrand weapon also increases the damage done by your Lava Lash by 40%.

[Deleted]

You apparently don't know what the enhancement 2 set is. Your frostbrand weapon also increases the damage done by your Lava Lash by 40%.

Actually its the 4pc bonus. This "new" bonus is replacing its old one, which is why the OP colored it in red.

http://ptr.wowhead.com/spell=131554

Therefore Frostbrand just got axed because our LvL damage goes down by 40%, the other properties of the imbue like the random damage proc and the unleash effects remain untouched.

TLDR: You stop using WF/FB and continue using WF/FT for both PVE and PVP. Making Frostbrand useless.

[CHRONICGODX]

lol i dont even...

[Darksoldierr]

Wait..what? They nerfing Frostbrand? Why?

[Walktheline]

Frostflame Weapon - Increases the damage of your Lava Lash by 40% if your off-hand weapon is enchanted with Frostbrand. While your weapon is imbued with Flametongue Weapon, your attacks also slow the target's movement speed by 50% for 3 sec.



So...we now lose 40% damage on Lava Lash if we want to use Frostbrand Weapon for the Unleashed Weapon gap closer, all so Flametongue Weapon can be a mock-up Frostbrand and free up "Primal Elementalist" and "Elemental Blast" (which are clunky and often useless in PvP encounters for Enhancement).

It'd be nice if they just baked in the 40% damage to Lava Lash without the need to use Flametongue, that way we would have a choice instead of being forced out of either option and our 4pc could become something completely different.

What are everybody's thoughts on this?

Wait, elemental blast feels clunky? Im currently playing with ele blast as enhance, and it hits like a truck (even hits harder than LL). Also with using FT we get an overall dmg boost. FT oroccs every hit, so its basically a perma slow and elemantal blast get included in the SS debuff section. Also with using FT in your offhand, your next firespell hits 30% harder, which includes ele blast aswell. So eleblast will be hitting for even more now and is our hardest hitting ability outside of ascendance.

you keep those things in mind, its overall a buff for us.

[Kuniku]

but we still lose out on the FB UE...

[Walktheline]

With 5.4 i would have gone for ele blast either way. You gain a lot of dmg and burst, that easily outweights losing the sprint ability. Keep in mind that your soon ti be hardest hitting ability is ranged and its no problem casting it with only a few stacks. I mean its true, you will lose the sprint, but most if the time your are not alone in arena. And at least you got your freedom totem, sprint and ghostwolf.

Lil bit offtopic: ghostwolf and healing storm glyphs should get baked in. Would free up some slots you have to take.

[Omanley]

This change essentially increases the damage gap between ft and fb again, while lessening the utility gap. So IF we decide we need that UF:FB sprint, we're sacrificing even more damage than before.
Blizz seems to be as torn over the question what they want us to run around with as well.

FT: higher average proc damage (less damage per proc, but 100% proc chance), 7% increased magical damage, 40% increased lava lash damage when ft on offhand, up to 40% increased ft dmg through sf charges, 20% increased lb damage (uf), ~25% more direct damage through ue and +30% to flame shock (or eb, as uf does not feel as mandatory anymore)

vs
FB: 20% extra snare (or a seperate snare cd ,though I think it unecessary with frost shock and ft proccing snares now) and a sprint

Kinda obvious what sounds more tempting, even before the change. that said, enh is still starved for mobility...
Or is a 1min spiritwalk, ascendence and (glyphed)gw enough nowadays?

Maybe there's more to come still? More things added to frostbrand maybe? If not, what point in keeping frostbrand around any longer? Or rockbiter for that matter.

If they reduced spiritwalk to a 15sec cd, with a 6 second sprint and 3 second freedom, they could just axe frostbrand for good. It's not like it provided much.

[Venziir]

PTR is PTR....

[Deleted]

It's not like it provided much.

I remember reading a blue post about snares that came from auto attacks and the dev's view on it was that they disliked it because it was applied without thought, much like the Crippling Poison.

But I agree with the above posts. EB will be hitting people really hard if this goes through, but we will have much less uptime on targets and that constant Static Shock from auto attacks is gone aswell. Not sure if we will be starving for MSW stacks again.

[Omanley]

Well, there'll be the option of glyphed purge (the one that procs msw). Looking at how the double purge glyph wouldn't proc two charges, people could spam purge for msw charges when starved for msw. THe mana cost would still be bad though.

I must say crippling poison, or a feral's snares, yes, they dont require any thought to them, so yeah, kinda bad design. That sad, I'd rather have a 100% proc doing that than a 40% one. And enh has no instant gap closers, and no freedom for their sprints. WWT has to high a cd also, and Frozen Power is very tempting in regards of gap closing. I really hope we see something in regards of mobility in addition to this change.

[Walktheline]

In my opinion they should completely remove the 3rd tier and make it new, with some more mobility features. Im addition, remove the totem reset ability completely and make totemic restoration and projection baseline.

[Darksoldierr]

Personally im playing with Elemental Blast already (it is awsome, highly recommended), but does this change means, that you have to use Flametounge and lose Unleashed Elements slow or you lose 40% lava lash dmg to gain slow?