So when will Shadow Priests see the well needed buff to mobility?

[exriel]

Uh what? You didnt even list enough classes to cover the classic RMP VS WLD matches of TBC. And in Wrath almost everyone was viable Season 7, without half the retarded shit we have now.

Right, druids weren't super mobile at that time, no not at all. It wasn't the major reason for their dominance in Arena, no siree. You are right tho, I forgot mages, they have always had fun. But look at those 6 classes, all of them have high mobility either from active abilities like blink, vanish, sprint, charge, travel form, or by having a lot of powerful instant casts, PW:S, Renew, PoM, Druid Hots, Lock Dots. They all have strong survivability on their own with vanish, blind, gouge, poly, priest wings, fear, last stand, shieldwall, bear form, tree form. And they all have burst. If you didn't play one of those classes at the end of TBC, you didn't play arena. Also, no shadow priests, no holy priests, no fury warriors, no boomkin, no feral etc.

[panterarules]

Would be cool if they added more active mitigation to shadow as I feel that the constant battle for mobility vs gap closers can never be won. Something like removing dispersion in it's current form and instead absorbing the next attack/spell on a shorter cooldown, for every special attack absorbed gain an orb or something similar which will help mobile dps. I'm also sick of swifty CD's vs shield wall CD's, lame gameplay.

I would also like to see apparitions be used more actively. Gain charges every time SWP crits and be able to release them for burst, or perhaps consume 20 charges to allow your lvl 90 talent to apply VT+SWP to every target hit.

Spriest gettin kinda...boring they need to change it up. Probably the most boring caster playstyle, aside from eles. Feels like i have 2 damage abilities.

[Alanar]

Shadow doesnt need a buff to mobility, so Never! If you want to play a caster with high mobility, play a mage. If you want to play a hybrid caster, with strong defenses and team utility, play Shadow.




Cast many instant spells of varying power while they move around.

Does no one remember the good old days where casters had to actually cast and didnt get abilities to keep melee off them 24/7... the days before GC.

RNG is the number 1 here, Sw: p, Sw:d are the 2 ur mentioning.

Sw: p mana sinking if casted on the move. Plus if you have a buffed Sw: p you lose damage even.(trinket/procs)
Sw:d only useable below 20%

Then you have your rng procs which u cant rely on at all and if you look at the 90 talents I just fail to see how we can rely on those. Most usefull 90 talent is Divine star. (best self healing, the other 2 are instant cc breakers no control whatsoever)
The mana cost and the cooldown are just letting us down.

Conclusion: No hard feelings, but I think your not 100% sure how it works.

EDIT: They beter fix Divine Star actualy not shooting up the sealing or under my feet. We could use some help yes.

[Evelyn]

Shadow doesnt need a buff to mobility, so Never! If you want to play a caster with high mobility, play a mage. If you want to play a hybrid caster, with strong defenses and team utility, play Shadow.

Cast many instant spells of varying power while they move around.

Does no one remember the good old days where casters had to actually cast and didnt get abilities to keep melee off them 24/7... the days before GC.

You have no idea what you are taking about.

Your mobility is me running 500 yards away from you every when you keep me feared for in excess of 14 seconds before real diminishing returns kick in.

Whatever problems Shadow priests have, have nothing to do with Mobility. And Shadow seriously shouldn't see any sort of buff before Disc is nerfed into the ground. Because right now any sort of buff that could in any way trickle into disc, would turn the damn thing into the incarnation of Jesus Christ the Avenger, as the definition of demigod would be insufficient.

Neither do you.

[worsthitmanNa]

Shadow damage is in a good place, it's not the damage that's screwing us over. Being tunneled by every arena comp in the game and not being able to snare targets or get away from ANYONE is the one and only thing that's screwing us.

Oh, and another thing to the first reply, shadow does not have "decent self heals".

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Shackle? It doesn't work on players, it's only for undead. I believe you mean tendrils, and even at that it's piss poor.

Its really only useful versus a downer dk honestly.

[Itisamuh]

Shadow doesn't need ANY buffs until they've gotten nerfed significantly elsewhere. They're already arguably the best spec in the game.

[stickyjam]

Shadow doesn't need ANY buffs until they've gotten nerfed significantly elsewhere. They're already arguably the best spec in the game.

what areas are they best at?

[Hand Banana]

RNG is the number 1 here, Sw: p, Sw:d are the 2 ur mentioning.

Sw: p mana sinking if casted on the move. Plus if you have a buffed Sw: p you lose damage even.(trinket/procs)
Sw:d only useable below 20%

Then you have your rng procs which u cant rely on at all and if you look at the 90 talents I just fail to see how we can rely on those. Most usefull 90 talent is Divine star. (best self healing, the other 2 are instant cc breakers no control whatsoever)
The mana cost and the cooldown are just letting us down.

Conclusion: No hard feelings, but I think your not 100% sure how it works.

EDIT: They beter fix Divine Star actualy not shooting up the sealing or under my feet. We could use some help yes.

Tell that to the spriest who nearly 100-0'd my warrior while flag running and instant casting everything but VT (got it off before I could charge him) in a bg earlier. Ever heard of FDCL? Yea, some people still spec into it, and if they get a few procs with some DI procs that can instant you to death in like 5-6 globals. Dots + Instant mind spike + instant Mind blast + DP + instant mind spike and I was pretty much dead. Do spriests have some crit modifier I'm unaware of? I swear I thought their crit was in the 10% range but they seem to crit most of the time, as I got hit by like 5 apparitions as well.

[Deleted]

Shadow doesn't need ANY buffs until they've gotten nerfed significantly elsewhere. They're already arguably the best spec in the game.

Stop living in the past ... patch 5.1 is gone a long time ago

[Flaks]

Shadow doesn't need ANY buffs until they've gotten nerfed significantly elsewhere. They're already arguably the best spec in the game.

If you haven't noticed they were practically gutted to near warrior levels going from 5.2 to 5.3. All those spriests sitting on high ratings are from 5.2 as continuing in 5.3 is going to have them be butchered by most comps.

That said, spriests were doing exceptionally well (too well) without having ridiculous mobility in the past couple of patches. They definitely need buffs but I don't think they should be mobility buffs but instead survivability buffs.

[Deleted]

Shadow doesn't need ANY buffs until they've gotten nerfed significantly elsewhere. They're already arguably the best spec in the game.

You're clueless, reasons already mentioned by speakers above me.

what areas are they best at?

I'd like to know this too because i truly don't see it anywhere, apart from perhaps trolling (mind control, lifegrip, lifeswap in pve).

Tell that to the spriest who nearly 100-0'd my warrior while flag running and instant casting everything but VT (got it off before I could charge him) in a bg earlier. Ever heard of FDCL? Yea, some people still spec into it, and if they get a few procs with some DI procs that can instant you to death in like 5-6 globals. Dots + Instant mind spike + instant Mind blast + DP + instant mind spike and I was pretty much dead. Do spriests have some crit modifier I'm unaware of? I swear I thought their crit was in the 10% range but they seem to crit most of the time, as I got hit by like 5 apparitions as well.

FDCL sucks and is way less damage than insanity. Him being lucky with proccs, not to mention being lucky to even get to freecast some and not have a whole bunch of melee's introducing pointy objects to his backside, doesn't justify being called "op" from you. Instant you to death in 5-6 globals is nothing compared to what ive seen from other classes, i wanna add to that. And no priests don't have any crit modifiers. I believe you're over-exaggerating the whole scenario.

I'm surprised Yvaelle hasn't responded to this yet, I'm sure he'd share some wise words on the topic.

[unholyness]

Oh yes, I'm getting globaled in full tyr but yet it's not the classes fault. Good job kid, you're clearly retarded, go back to sleep.

User was infracted in this thread

Ya because gear means you are good,right?

[Hand Banana]

FDCL sucks and is way less damage than insanity. Him being lucky with proccs, not to mention being lucky to even get to freecast some and not have a whole bunch of melee's introducing pointy objects to his backside, doesn't justify being called "op" from you. Instant you to death in 5-6 globals is nothing compared to what ive seen from other classes, i wanna add to that. And no priests don't have any crit modifiers. I believe you're over-exaggerating the whole scenario.

FDCL is actually very good, the instant mind spikes it procs do about the same damage as a mind blast. Its just not the WTFBURST that insanity is. Spriests complain about mobility and not being able to do anything on the move yet they ignore a perfectly good instant damage talent so they can 100-0 in 3 seconds with insanity. Friend of mine actually respecced it for 3s recently was in love with it in 2 games. Doesn't give the insane burst that insanity does but as long as he rolled dots properly he could basically mind spike every other gcd, said it felt like a mage spamming ice lance.

I mention crit because apparitions are only supposed to proc on Sw: P crits yet priests seem to have endless amounts streaming from them all over, even with only one target dotted.

[Alanar]

Tell that to the spriest who nearly 100-0'd my warrior while flag running and instant casting everything but VT (got it off before I could charge him) in a bg earlier. Ever heard of FDCL? Yea, some people still spec into it, and if they get a few procs with some DI procs that can instant you to death in like 5-6 globals. Dots + Instant mind spike + instant Mind blast + DP + instant mind spike and I was pretty much dead. Do spriests have some crit modifier I'm unaware of? I swear I thought their crit was in the 10% range but they seem to crit most of the time, as I got hit by like 5 apparitions as well.

Thats all cool and all, but I guess he got rng at hes side.
Insanity is soooo much better! You want to melt down a healer with a silence perfectly timed between it? pick Insanity.
FDCL is ok if you are lucky (to say the least). Most Spriest like to time their burs and completely destroy some one with Insanity. Only problem here is that it makes u stationary for 8 seconds. Which is like: HEY! look at me i am casting this giant blue beam that screams for a interrupt.
In the end it's all about positioning/timing.

Please let me be clear here. It's just a talent that gives u procs. You cant rely on procs.

Nope, most Spriest stack haste till 8 k(pvp), and rest into mastery/crit what ever u prefer. So idk maybe he did stack critt.(I wouldnt advice that)

[Deleted]

FDCL is actually very good, the instant mind spikes it procs do about the same damage as a mind blast. Its just not the WTFBURST that insanity is. Spriests complain about mobility and not being able to do anything on the move yet they ignore a perfectly good instant damage talent so they can 100-0 in 3 seconds with insanity. Friend of mine actually respecced it for 3s recently was in love with it in 2 games. Doesn't give the insane burst that insanity does but as long as he rolled dots properly he could basically mind spike every other gcd, said it felt like a mage spamming ice lance.

I mention crit because apparitions are only supposed to proc on Sw: P crits yet priests seem to have endless amounts streaming from them all over, even with only one target dotted.

I did appreciate FDCL back when mop was new, don't get me wrong. The reason you used it though was together with the glyph that they nerfed, and that insanity was rubbish. The thing is though that they are both tied to a casted dot and they are RNG, which limits it's usefulness severly. My mage can't constantly peel me through the whole game for me to dot their whole team up for those spike proccs, however he can peel me every insanity. I guess you get the point, FDCL requires a lot more freecasting time in the end to do the trick in comparison.

And priests complaining about damage on the move is justified. You can't argue about that with RNG proccs, while everyone else and their dogs get lots of either fast options for movement, or basic spells on the move. Shamans get lightning bolt, mages got scorch, warlocks get KjC, and this is without taking stuff like blink into account. There is already a thread on this in the priest forum. If someone decides to run away from me there's nothing i can do about it, as well as i can't get away from anyone either. Denying this, and priests having the worst mobility of all ranged, is you being ignorant.

I am however fine with that, so long as I instead am tanky, but you see where that tankyness is going now....

[Hand Banana]

I did appreciate FDCL back when mop was new, don't get me wrong. The reason you used it though was together with the glyph that they nerfed, and that insanity was rubbish. The thing is though that they are both tied to a casted dot and they are RNG, which limits it's usefulness severly. My mage can't constantly peel me through the whole game for me to dot their whole team up for those spike proccs, however he can peel me every insanity. I guess you get the point, FDCL requires a lot more freecasting time in the end to do the trick in comparison.

And priests complaining about damage on the move is justified. You can't argue about that with RNG proccs, while everyone else and their dogs get lots of either fast options for movement, or basic spells on the move. Shamans get lightning bolt, mages got scorch, warlocks get KjC, and this is without taking stuff like blink into account. There is already a thread on this in the priest forum. If someone decides to run away from me there's nothing i can do about it, as well as i can't get away from anyone either. Denying this, and priests having the worst mobility of all ranged, is you being ignorant.

I am however fine with that, so long as I instead am tanky, but you see where that tankyness is going now....

FDCL is getting a decent buff in 5.4 so it may be more worth it over insanity depending on your comp (like dotcleaves). Still, the problem is that insanity is too good, which makes spriests into the tank -> tank -> tank -> turn around and global you playstyle.

I suppose the justification for spriests on the move is that the have instant defensive spells to use like PWS and pom and such to go along with their dps, even more enforcing the turtle -> nuke playstyle. I personally don't like shadow; I play disc currently so I know of the mobility problems spriests have but make up for it with being the tankiest caster. However with the nerfs in 5.4 like you said, going to be rough. Might have to play with a healer like an hpally that can give you freedoms especially with the feather buff to 80% move speed. Thats pretty legit if used right.

Personally, I think they could change mind spike to always be instant but do less dmg and maybe extend dots like fel flame, and change FDCL to something else for shadow. Spike has literally 0 uses in pve or pvp outside FDCL which most people don't take (or none at all for pve).

[stickyjam]

@thisnamesucks

the FDCL proc spamming only really occurs consistently in rbgs.
5 crits in a row is also mad rng for a 10% crit.
it can do more dmg than insanity if you crit constantly, will it though consitantly? no.


Easiest way to put shadow back at 5.3 levels atleast is put 15% dmg reduction in the set bonus

[Evelyn]

FDCL is getting a decent buff in 5.4 so it may be more worth it over insanity depending on your comp (like dotcleaves). Still, the problem is that insanity is too good, which makes spriests into the tank -> tank -> tank -> turn around and global you playstyle.

I suppose the justification for spriests on the move is that the have instant defensive spells to use like PWS and pom and such to go along with their dps, even more enforcing the turtle -> nuke playstyle. I personally don't like shadow; I play disc currently so I know of the mobility problems spriests have but make up for it with being the tankiest caster. However with the nerfs in 5.4 like you said, going to be rough. Might have to play with a healer like an hpally that can give you freedoms especially with the feather buff to 80% move speed. Thats pretty legit if used right.

Personally, I think they could change mind spike to always be instant but do less dmg and maybe extend dots like fel flame, and change FDCL to something else for shadow. Spike has literally 0 uses in pve or pvp outside FDCL which most people don't take (or none at all for pve).

Except for spriest aren't really tanks, not compared to locks. Not to mention, we are getting a nerf come 5.4 that will make us even less tanky. Other caster classes might be able to get away from melee, or cast while they are moving. We already have a lot less mobility then most caster classes. We're labeled a utility and support class, yet as far as rbgs are considered, even ele and boomkin seem to get picked before spriest. We can't even compete with locks and mages for first pick favor.

[Deleted]

FDCL is actually very good, the instant mind spikes it procs do about the same damage as a mind blast. Its just not the WTFBURST that insanity is. Spriests complain about mobility and not being able to do anything on the move yet they ignore a perfectly good instant damage talent so they can 100-0 in 3 seconds with insanity. Friend of mine actually respecced it for 3s recently was in love with it in 2 games. Doesn't give the insane burst that insanity does but as long as he rolled dots properly he could basically mind spike every other gcd, said it felt like a mage spamming ice lance.

I mention crit because apparitions are only supposed to proc on Sw: P crits yet priests seem to have endless amounts streaming from them all over, even with only one target dotted.

I generally adhere go the rule "play the class before qq", all you are sayingis that useless apparitions sprout from players, supposedly cause the game is broken and sp's are op. Also your friend loved fdcl in 2 games? At what rating?

Please just play sp and find out what its like outside bg's play some melee comps in 3's and then come talk. Also 3 sec channel 100-0 is utter bullshit, for almost any class.

If mind spike glyph worked with fdcl again stuff would be sweet with sp's, not even op

[Gilian]

You think shadow is tanky? Wow, you clearly haven't played one. And the shadow-form nerf next patch is going to ruin us further.

I'm no pvp expert but I don't feel like I die very fast. But maybe that's because my opponents are just noobs :P. I was actually surprised that I didn't die faster.