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  1. #141
    No the new system is much better, especially for PvP. Some of them have the one talent that's clearly the best but overall it's allot less copy-paste the best build like the old system was.

  2. #142
    The Insane Aeilon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    *insert funny location here*
    Yes in the sense of leveling to max level...but the same goes for getting spells without going to the trainer. Catering to the supercasuals is stupid.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Champxoxo View Post
    Yeh, from a PvP perspective they were clearly trying to make it "tailor to your playstyle" but its really even less customizable than the old one.

    Its much much much harder to balance with 3 ability changes per tier. They ran out of ideas for talents for a lot of classes, so they simply removed existing abilities from baseline to put them in.
    Indeed, warlocks and warriors notable examples. The new talent system is still better but we need more changes every level.
    Quote Originally Posted by kbarh View Post
    may i suggest you check out wowwiki or any similar site, it's Grom that orders the murder of Cairne

  4. #144
    I do not. Looks are deceiving. At first glance, there seemed like there was a ton of choices, but the reality was many of the talents were either useless or would completely gimp you. And I believe that's why it was so cookie cutter. I prefer the current system much more. Less choices, but the choices are very wide open for many specs/fights/pvp. It's great. What I would like Blizzard to improve on though would be to add even more choices. Instead of 3 each level, have 4 or 5.
    Last edited by KCguy; 2013-07-27 at 09:16 AM.

  5. #145
    It could still be improved for some tiers on most classes, but I like this one better than the old one. I don't feel pressured to take every individual talent everyone else is taking just to "fit in" or "do things right". I have a little bit more choice than I did before. I also find it a lot more rewarding, getting a new move every 15 levels. Most of the talents I really like, and some I really don't.

    But yeah, overall I like this one a lot more.
    3 hints to surviving MMO-C forums:
    1.) If you have an opinion, someone will say that it is wrong
    2.) If you have a source, there will be people who refuse to believe it
    3.) If you use logic, it will be largely ignored
    btw: Spires of Arak = Arakkoa.

  6. #146
    Ill admit many of my characters had talents copied from the web. But there was always something different. One or two talents where I deviated and I did fine. But that was only on my main raiding peeps. On my alts I specced hybrid, or whatever I felt was interesting. I didnt give a shit what the internet said.

    Putting in a talent every level was nice. It may have been a dumb talent, woo 1% more crit, but it FELT good. Leveling FELT a lot more important than it does now. The other main issue is that we can now redo our talents whenever we want. That and every "specialization" has the same talent options. I change my talents depending on the fight, or situation in general. My talents are not something set in stone but rather something that is BEST. Because of the lack of finality if you will, my talents feel unimportant. I no longer feel like a shadow priest who decided to be unique and put those 5 points in THIS instead of THAT. Im now JUST a shadow priest. Like every other shadow priest

  7. #147
    Nope, and I personally put little stock in the 'it makes leveling less rewarding' argument because, unless it's your very first char, leveling quickly becomes just a race to the cap to do the content that most of the players are at and doing. It makes it simpler to customize your char and reduces the chance of you picking a crappy build that does little to benefit you. I'm sure we're gonna see even more streamlining in the xpac to character abilities and so forth, and I for one will welcome it(Hunter button bloat says hi, BTW).

  8. #148
    Stood in the Fire tinyninja's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    New talents are just less exciting and anti-climactic. Every 15 levels for one new talent... and a lot of the talents are very boring, some of them can just be ignored. I think each one should provide exciting benefits, even if it's just a cosmetic thing, people like it when big new sparklies appear on their computer screen instead of just another button to add more numbers to damage or healing. They had the opportunity to make talents something really interesting and out there, but really it just feels like they kept it because there HAD to be talents in the game, even though most of the important spells/abilities just migrated over to specializations.

  9. #149
    Herald of the Titans Strafer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Yes I do. Very much.

  10. #150
    I didnt like changes they did from wrath to cata, and I havent played MoP but didnt like what I saw. And what happened to priest manaburn?=(
    Thats why I like Rift, it has the talent trees I wanted wow to have, and as dominator I can be a mana drainer as well :P
    You hoped it was over but Murky is back
    Sign + avatar by Visenna

  11. #151
    In a lot of ways I do miss the old talent system, but in just as many ways, I (Don't like) agree with Blizzard's view on the new system. I just wish they went with it in a entirely different way to make classes more... unique / defined / iconic to what they where originally designed as.

  12. #152
    Fluffy Kitten Zinnin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Not even a little bit. I find that right now I go through several stacks of ths reagent to switch talents a week, compared to ths old system the amount of choice that I have now is insane. The only complaint I have in the new system is probably the leveling complaint, but at this point I really believe that you should be able to just roll max level characters anyway, leveling in this game is almost pointless once you'
    ve done it once.

  13. #153
    Field Marshal
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Frost tanks.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Iciya View Post
    Frost tanks.
    I liked them, never played myself and didnt like the bad rep "omg frost tank nabb". I thought it was cool dual wield tanking, and it went well those frosty tanks I played with. Very unique playstyle and a shame they skipped it, and even the entire uniqueness with dks having 3 tanking specs, undead or what the third spec after blood had kind of cool tanking as well. Bad move for dk class I must say. I also know many people loved blood dk dps.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Haha it was funny when you had to kill dks twice as well, they died and ressed as undead monsted you had to kill again =) It was so cool.

    - - - Updated - - -

    As a former shadow priest I must say I loved having an army of shadow copies
    You hoped it was over but Murky is back
    Sign + avatar by Visenna

  15. #155
    Blood DPS I saw as the primary / highest sustained with Armor Penetration.
    Frost DPS as the "Burst" with the scaling of both Strength, Spell power, Spell Haste, Haste, Armor Pen, and spell pen.
    Unholy as the "CC" close quarters spellcaster.

    Blood Tanking I viewed as the Passive / Self healing tank spec.
    Frost as the Active / larger physical damage reduction for enrage /burst phases.
    Unholy as the anti-caster tank. (Malygos, Sindy, Most of Naxx, Mimiron, Thorum...)

  16. #156
    I miss some of it, I Miss being able to do it " my way" That i could make a shockadin, Or a more defensive build to what ever class.

    What i do not miss is how 70% of taltens where useless and items such as " give you 2% more SP/AP"

  17. #157
    Titan draykorinee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Ciderland, arrgh.
    I really miss following what everyone else does, now I have to think about the encounters and switch around.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Ethes View Post
    What I was trying to say was, is that at the level of heroic raiding there is not really a 'choice' to begin with.
    Couple of things:

    1) Obviously throughput (healing and DPS) talents will usually end up having a mandatory choice. This goes without saying.

    Same goes for the old trees, you can make things as fucking obfuscated as you want, but at the end of the day out of the retarded possible configurations of throughput talents, there will be a correct one. All other configurations are doing it wrong, just it's "cleverly" disguised behind a pile of crap.

    So yes, for paladins, the 90 talents have mandatory choices for fights, the 45 talents for healers have mandatory choices for fights, and the 75 talents have mandatory choices for DPS etc.

    2) CC tiers aren't useful very often in PvE content. Same goes for CC talents, they are simply not taken on the old trees (or grudgingly taken if it is required for a later talent or if there is simply no other option). How's this better or "more interesting" or more of a "choice" than the Tier 2 paladin talents?

    Also remember my hybrid point. Some of the least used talents for Holy (Sanctified Wrath, Selfless Healer, Execution Sentence) are mandatory or near-mandatory or Ret. Sacred Shield is mandatory for Prot. Long Arm of the Law has far more situational use for Ret, Pursuit of Justice has far more situational use for Prot. The "junk" talents (Hand of Purity, etc.) are being fixed for 5.4 and Blizzard is trying to encourage more varied use of all talent rows for everyone by nerfing "overpowered" ones and buffing or even completely reworking the shit ones.

    But still at the end of the day I think we have to accept for hybrid (and even pure) classes, some talents will appeal more to some specs than others, and no amount of changing will fix that without just gutting the talent itself.


    Simply put anyone who believes the old talent trees had more "options" or "choices" is delusional.

    [edit] Case in point even on a holy paladin (with "required" this or "required" that as you claim) I average spending most of my 20 tomes in a given raid night. In Cataclysm, I'd have respec'ced... zero?... times... and maybe spent 2-3 dust... maybe.
    Last edited by nightfalls; 2013-07-27 at 11:52 AM.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by draykorinee View Post
    I really miss following what everyone else does, now I have to think about the encounters and switch around.
    That was part of the issue though. Because people where getting benched or denied from doing content because they didn't go an exact cookie cutter. With this new system, that process is slowly coming back into place for some classes.

    I figured that it would only happen again when they decided to mix the talents up so much across the board for all classes where some talents are complete crap, where others are obviously overpowered.

    But those issues lay just as much of a problem as Glyphs go too. But with how much different each boss fight is, you almost need to have one or two stacks of those talent/glyph usages based on your raid comp if you really want to number crunch or drastically need that extra 1%.

    If anything, I'd like to argue that the new system is only MORE picky than the previous (Class-by-class, spec-by-spec basis, of course.)

  20. #160
    Moderator Nobleshield's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Trinity, FL
    Not one bit. The old talent system was an illusion of choice, and illusion of choice isn't worth anything. Getting a point every level is meaningless when those points have to be put into certain talents later on to be effective, while other talents are never picked at all.

    The new system is infinitely better, even if it looks like less we have much MORE choice than we ever had before.
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