Why do people say MoP is not alt-friendly?

[Deleted]

I played 2 alts in the last weeks. With my Paladin I got into Throne of Thunder LFR the week he hit 90, with my Warlock it took two weeks. But if I hadn't been so lazy I could've grinded honor to get the iLevel 476 pieces. Getting to the current tier of raiding is as fast as in past expansions.

[Orbitus]

I played 2 alts in the last weeks. With my Paladin I got into Throne of Thunder LFR the week he hit 90, with my Warlock it took two weeks. But if I hadn't been so lazy I could've grinded honor to get the iLevel 476 pieces. Getting to the current tier of raiding is as fast as in past expansions.

Because they THINK they have to do dailies to get gear.

[blackii]

It -used- to be a freaking pain with the whole daily grind fest. Atm its a pisstake

[flavie]

i agree. gearing up alts is very fast these days, and i NEVER EVER do dailies. For me personally the 'alt-unfriendlyness' lies within the fact that i cannot stand lvling through pandaria even one more time. Even made me faction change to alliance, just to get 85-90 from a different view, and then go back horde at 90 lol....

[Eazy]

Couldn't you just ask about it in Trassk thread?

It wasn't very alt-friendly because in 5.0-5.1 patch it was better to do some dailies, which were boring.
And doing once more the same quests in Pandaria is also tiring I think.

[Weightlifter]

That's how it was before 5.2

[APKMNPVE]

Couldn't you just ask about it in Trassk thread?

Mods here don't seem to like merging threads or shutting down dupe/op threads. I guess they get more ad views or something by leaving their forums a messy troll breeding ground.

[Deleted]

Mods here don't seem to like merging threads or shutting down dupe/op threads. I guess they get more ad views or something by leaving their forums a messy troll breeding ground.

I don't think you understand what troll means.

- - - Updated - - -

That's how it was before 5.2

Even in 5.0 it didn't take long. And I never did dailies on my alts.

[vesseblah]

I played 2 alts in the last weeks. With my Paladin I got into Throne of Thunder LFR the week he hit 90, with my Warlock it took two weeks. But if I hadn't been so lazy I could've grinded honor to get the iLevel 476 pieces. Getting to the current tier of raiding is as fast as in past expansions.

Back in WLK and Cata you had three instances to spam every day with total boss number pretty close to T14 LFR, with the exception that one had daily lock-out while LFR is on weekly. That's seven times more gear (on average) for people without gold to spend on AH.

You can get to ToT in a week if you can afford to drop 100k into AH (at my realm's prices) to boost the item level with crafted shit but that's really not an option for most players.

[Deleted]

The only slow part of gearing up alts is between dinging 90 and getting to item level 460 for LFR. After that you will be in ToT LFR within a couple of weeks.

I have found that the best way is to farm justice points via scenarios, convert them to honor points and then buy the item level 470 pvp epics. They are far better than the blue ilvl 463 heroic dungeon gear, and easier to get. On some realms it 'may' be quicker to actually do random battlegrounds, or if you have a decent guild group farming JP's from heroics can work out quicker.

Or if you have a wealthy main, just by epics and crafted pvp gear from the auction house.

[Riavan]

Well, to be fair, theres still a lot more dungeons/raids and LFR RNG GODS that you have to wade through to get to the last raid (ToT), than there was in other expansions. the other stack of upgraded 5 mans that the last few xpacs have had I guess, mean if you get unlucky you will have to wait a lot longer to catch up.

[Deleted]

Back in WLK and Cata you had three instances to spam every day with total boss number pretty close to T14 LFR, with the exception that one had daily lock-out while LFR is on weekly. That's seven times more gear (on average) for people without gold to spend on AH.

You can get to ToT in a week if you can afford to drop 100k into AH (at my realm's prices) to boost the item level with crafted shit but that's really not an option for most players.

Uhm no, I did not spend one single gold coin on the auction house. You can get full 476 from doing PvP and you can get tons of coins for extra rolls on LFR bosses. Reaching 480 is easily doable in a week even without spending 100k on the AH.

[Vensu24]

Running LFR for 3 weeks and only having a few hundred gold to show for it....

[Maconi]

I'll try to put this the best way I can, although it'll probably just get lost in the sea of replies (I've thought about creating a new thread on the matter a number of times but couldn't really figure out how best to put it into words).

I agree with the overall sentiment that what has been lost is the sense of progression and the viability of alts, but due to slightly different reasons.

I think their first big mistake was replacing the TBC raiding model. Now hear me out on this (since I'm sure that first statement has been said a billion times before). In TBC raid content was NEVER obsolete. Bosses were pretty tough at the relevant gear levels. You had to follow the progression line (starting with Kara) and gear up your character before you could ever hope to handle the next raid's bosses.

What did you do if you couldn't progress past a certain raid (which was most guilds since the raids were pretty tough). You either kept trying and eventually got it (making it feel extremely satisfying, and the gear you earned made each future attempt that much easier), or did what? Made alts and started gearing them up in the previous raids (either because it was fun or because you wanted to try that class in the harder raids hoping that would help you finally progress past it).

The raiding model encouraged you to create alts and to continue playing ALL the content in the game. You didn't have to have stuff like LFR to show you every raid in the game on easy mode. Which brings me to my next point, yes LFR.

I agree that I think LFR was a mistake. It's the equivalent to cheating IMO. You get to clear every boss with God Mode enabled basically and you get gear with the same models/names as the regular raids. What's the point of doing the raids on Normal/Heroic after you've seen almost every boss and have on most of the loot anyway? IMO it subtracts from the experience and accomplishment and also diminishes the desire to raid, especially on alts (this goes back to my TBC point). Why play alts when your main can clear everything easily anyway? There's no "I can't clear xyz raid so I'll just play my alts through the other raids again" or "We need to gear up xyz to help us on xyz raid" anymore.

Not to mention the fact that all of the prestige is now gone. Those Warglaives? You were a GOD if you had even 1, much less 2. Most guilds didn't even see Illidan, much less down him, much less SEE that drop (during TBC). You wanted to keep banging your head against that wall, even if it was hopeless, just because of that slight glimmer of hope that you could look that fucking awesome (excuse my nerdgasm). You tell me, is there an item like that in MoP? That when you see it you think "Damn that player/guild is awesome/lucky" or "Man I want to start trying to get that, I don't care how hard it is"?

Even Wraith had a few of these moments (Shadowmourne, Invincible, Mimiron's Head, etc.). It just doesn't happen anymore.

This, basically.

[The Kao]

Guess some people are still longing back to Cata times where you could essentially assemble an item level that gave you access to anything with a small stack of gold and 5 minutes at the auction house, and as far as DS is concerned go blaze through the final expansion raid a few hours after reaching level 90. Plus since there was really not much else to do in endgame they got the feeling that they've seen everything.

While today's system is much more relaxed than what we had when MoP started it still takes you one or two weeks, maybe even up to four in average, to catch up. You are furthermore forced to progress all LFR raid content from MoP in a linear way (while we still hear people longing for attunements that were essentially the same) and even when there's not much more for you to gain there's still quite the gap between you and the regular player.

This is what most interpret as "not alt-friendly"; the catch-up process takes longer than a day and you can't fully catch up even if you tried. The fact that until few years ago devoted catch-up systems didn't even exist and that the current system really is vastly supportive doesn't seem to matter anymore.

[Manabomb]

Back in WLK and Cata you had three instances to spam every day with total boss number pretty close to T14 LFR, with the exception that one had daily lock-out while LFR is on weekly. That's seven times more gear (on average) for people without gold to spend on AH.

You can get to ToT in a week if you can afford to drop 100k into AH (at my realm's prices) to boost the item level with crafted shit but that's really not an option for most players.

Also in wotlk and cata you had justice gear that was actually worth a damn instead of being choked into paying "half price" for half shitty valor gear from a content patch ago. Right now the only good way to spend justice while gearing up? Convert to honor and get some 476's.

It irks me from a design standpoint how infuriating the gearing system was before 5.2, and even then it took me 2 and a half weeks for my priest to finally beat my monk in ilvl, and this was with minmaxing all over the damn place. (Also, Ilvl was around ToT ready ilvl, not posting exacts, but inbetween 496 and 505.)

I will say, atleast 5.3 barrens feels like you can get some good gear fairly quickly, and heroic scenarios are nice too. If only they had made t14's valor gear justice bought with 5.3 instead of waiting until 5.4, then justice could be useful again as a currency instead of a dump into another currency.

[Deleted]

So what gear level is considered as "caught up" for alts?

The ToT LFR opens at.. 470? And that's not very hard to get to considering that you are over 460 pretty much as soon as you can equip lvl90 stuff. You can jump from leveling -> MsV LFR (460) with craftable PvP blues and the trinks that drop from Shieldwall rares without ever having to do dailies (or pvp)

But that's not really the problem - so you're sitting pretty at 470 and get to ToT LFR. Now what? Grinding it weekly for 502 and capping valor for 522 welfare epics? If you want to be "raid ready" you'll probably need to hit at least 516-ish before anyone is even willing to take you along for ToT Normal Pug. After 480 you can hit HC scens and it makes it a bit easier - but that 470->516 stretch in ToT LFR is annoying and boring as hell.

Once you're in the ballpark of 516 and can start faceroll ToT Normal, you're ok though.

[Poodles]

RNG is RNG

OP got lucky and thinks it's normal (hint: it's not)

[AVPaul]

Gearing up alts may be easy today, but I just don't like the way, I have to do it. And if I don't like the way, I don't want to reach the goal too.

[Ellixen]

TBH I can't even level an alt. In cata I got 5 toons to 85, but here i can't get past jade forest on any of my alts. (main is 90 already), also i can't even get my priest past 45, i'm probably just burnt out but the problem is i barely started playing again 2 months ago...