Item Squish Confirmed

[Grubjuice]

What I think is most likely to happen is that there will be random Cata/MoP mobs that will be bugged and will be 1 or 2-shotting players....it's going to be like CRZ, but worse. :P And like almost everything released in WoW, there'll be a few month period of things being broken on live before everything's working correctly.

CRZ happened and i didn't notice the difference.
except that there were more people questing in the world.

if item squish were to happen in such a way as i could hardly notice the difference, then i surely could not complain.
just as i could not complain about the smooth and barely noticeble transition into CRZ

[Elrandir]

I hope they do squish a bit, they went too far in Cataclysm and totally overdid it in MOP. Seeing people do five times as much damage as someone else in LFR is beyond ridiculous.

[Orange Joe]

The only problem that I will have with a squish is if they do it in a way that I can't grind old content. If you enter a dungeon, and your gear scales down to level, I will be pa pa pa pisssssed.

The only people who say this, are the ones who haven't seen a word blizzard has said about it. (nor read anything in this thread)

[Deleted]

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/3...egacy-content/

I do want to clarify, however, that our changes are only intended to offset the direct effects of the "squish" and our goal has been to make sure that linearizing the item curve between item levels ~60 and 463 doesn't impact the ability to solo legacy content. That is not the same as saying that we guarantee nothing will change, period - we've made a number of adjustments to tank mitigation, healing, defensive cooldowns, and so forth. That's nothing new for an expansion, and in some cases, yes, that will make old content more challenging than it was in 5.4.8, especially for tank specs that could previously use Vengeance to great effect. But that has nothing to do with the item squish.

So congratulation to all Blizzard fanboys on this thread who used to believe Blizzard lies that the item squish won't affect the soloing.
Of course they were lying. Yeah , the changes to class mecanics+the item squish TOGETHER will make bosses curently soloable harder or impossible.

This is Blizzard's way of saying, "stuff happens we make changes, not all changes are for good, and things that you used to solo in the past you might not be able to now, but we hope one day that you might. We lied when we said that previously promised content would be just as easy to solo in the next expansion as it is now."

in other words... our worst nightmare has just come real, those players that enjoyed farming that old content for those specific items or fun bosses might not be able to anymore.

So sad I must post
I told you.

[DanThePaladin]

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/3...egacy-content/



So congratulation to all Blizzard fanboys on this thread who used to believe Blizzard lies that the item squish won't affect the soloing.
Of course they were lying.

This is Blizzard's way of saying, "stuff happens we make changes, not all changes are for good, and things that you used to solo in the past you might not be able to now, but we hope one day that you might. We lied when we said that previously promised content would be just as easy to solo in the next expansion as it is now."

in other words... our worst nightmare has just come real, those players that enjoyed farming that old content for those specific items or fun bosses might not be able to anymore.

So sad I must post
I told you.

Holy necro batman!

[Deleted]

Necro because beta is ending and we finally we have the final answer to the main question in this thread.

Dear soloers, enjoy the nerfs.

[Candiman]

A necro just to prove a point that he is wrong on too. Watcher states that the squish will not affect the ability to solo legacy content but that class changes that happen with every xpac might. So I can only say you may have told us so but you were wrong.

"I do want to clarify, however, that our changes are only intended to offset the direct effects of the "squish" and our goal has been to make sure that linearizing the item curve between item levels ~60 and 463 doesn't impact the ability to solo legacy content. That is not the same as saying that we guarantee nothing will change, period - we've made a number of adjustments to tank mitigation, healing, defensive cooldowns, and so forth. That's nothing new for an expansion, and in some cases, yes, that will make old content more challenging than it was in 5.4.8, especially for tank specs that could previously use Vengeance to great effect. But that has nothing to do with the item squish."

[stgeorge78]

Necro because beta is ending and we finally we have the final answer to the main question in this thread.

Dear soloers, enjoy the nerfs.

I also said that there was no way Blizzard was going to give a crap about solo raiding - the math and the numerous other changes wouldn't support it. They painted themselves into a corner. So they gave up.

http://wow.joystiq.com/2014/02/09/11...r-post-squish/

[Deleted]

Important is that without the item squish , the exponential increase of the gear would have compensate the class nerfs/changes , making them a non issue.

And important is the final result : 1. today at lvl 90 you can solo boss A.
2. on PTR you cannot.

Technical Game Designer Chadd Nervig, aka Celestalon on Twitter, has answered a tweeter's question about item squishing with the following tidbit:


.@ToppTheDwarf The item squish *will not* make soloing old raids harder. We promise, and 110% guarantee it.
- Celestalon (@Celestalon) February 9, 2014

120% LIE.

[rda]

Holy necro batman!

He is right, though.

When they said that they are doing the squish, many people, myself included, saw the curves and what they meant for soloing non-max-level stuff and immediately started asking for details like how exactly they are going to compensate for reduced power wrt old raids, etc. We knew back then that there will be issues and that some stuff will become harder to solo than it is now and some stuff might even become impossible or practically impossible to solo.

Blizzard devs kept playing baby teachers and kept saying that no, everything that is soloable now will remain soloable in the future, etc. For a long time they weren't saying what exactly they are going to do, although we had good guesses - which turned out correct in the end, by the way.

Now we see that there are problems. Surprise, we said there will be problems a long time ago. Moreover, I will say right now that some of these problems will remain unfixed for a long time just because many of them are one-off things and Blizzard aren't diligent enough to even fix them as fast as they are reported yet alone find them in the first place. And Blizzard are now saying that things might, indeed, change, because bla bla, and that they guaranteed nothing and that they will only fix things to the extent they are happy with, which might not - and will not - coincide with "as soloable as before", which was what Bashiok and others like him were saying.

So, yes, TOLD YOU is correct.

[Candiman]

That would be because at the minute legacy content is bugged and the buff is not applying properly while fighting bosses.

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/3...s-with-squish/

[rda]

A necro just to prove a point that he is wrong on too. Watcher states that the squish will not affect the ability to solo legacy content but that class changes that happen with every xpac might. So I can only say you may have told us so but you were wrong.

"I do want to clarify, however, that our changes are only intended to offset the direct effects of the "squish" and our goal has been to make sure that linearizing the item curve between item levels ~60 and 463 doesn't impact the ability to solo legacy content. That is not the same as saying that we guarantee nothing will change, period - we've made a number of adjustments to tank mitigation, healing, defensive cooldowns, and so forth. That's nothing new for an expansion, and in some cases, yes, that will make old content more challenging than it was in 5.4.8, especially for tank specs that could previously use Vengeance to great effect. But that has nothing to do with the item squish."

Translating: changes MIGHT TOTALLY affect soloing, and they were never guaranteeing otherwise / players took it wrong / bla bla bla.

Sure, they are doing more than the squish. Sure, things other than the squish might affect soloing, too. But when something which is right now soloable will become unsoloable (or soloable at a *much* lower speed, for example), and Watcher will say that it's not because of the squish, will it change much? And if it really won't be because of the squish, but rather because of some spell that they cut or some cooldown time that they increased, will it really be any consolation? As in, if you cut some spell that made it possible for spec X to solo stuff, and thus make some popular content that was soloable before unsoloable, shouldn't you do something to compensate???

[Candiman]

Translating: changes MIGHT TOTALLY affect soloing, and they were never guaranteeing otherwise / players took it wrong / bla bla bla.

Translation: I don't agree with you but can't disprove what you say.

- - - Updated - - -

Class changes at the start of every xpac have had an effect on soloing old content. This one is no different.

[Adramalech]

Not only did you necro a thread, you did it to be wrong.

The changes that can affect soloing are unrelated to the squish. They're class changes that would have happened regardless of the existance of a squish. Vengeance removal, healing changes, changes to defensive cooldowns, those are all things that would have affected the difficulty of soloing old content regardless. You're still wrong, and you're heavily misinterpreting your quoted post. This happens every expansion while we're still unable to level to the new cap.

Besides, we won't be spending a lot of time at level 90 after 6.0 releases. Even if we did get negatively impacted by the squish, it would be relevant for less than a month (Edit: depending on when the patch releases, that is. It's likely to be around a month now that I think about it), at which point we're allowed to level to 100 and overpower things even more.

If words won't convince you and you still think these are the arguments of us "fanboys", then check it yourself when the patch goes live, or try it right now on the PTR.

[data]

Important is that without the item squish , the exponential increase of the gear would have compensate the class nerfs/changes , making them a non issue.

And important is the final result : 1. today at lvl 90 you can solo boss A.
2. on PTR you cannot.



120% LIE.

"Old Raid Solo Bugs
Tried again in this new 18927 build, still experiencing same thing. Reduced damage against bosses.
Just to confirm, this is a bug - we're working on a fix."

[rda]

Translation: I don't agree with you but can't disprove what you say.

You made a statement "he is wrong", then provided a quote that showed exactly that the OP was right.

[Deleted]

Class changes at the start of every xpac have had an effect on soloing old content.

The changes that can affect soloing are unrelated to the squish. They're class changes that would have happened regardless of the existance of a squish. Vengeance removal, healing changes, changes to defensive cooldowns, those are all things that would have affected the difficulty of soloing old content regardless. You're still wrong, and you're heavily misinterpreting your quoted post. This happens every expansion while we're still unable to level to the new cap.

But this was soon a non issue because the exponential scale of the gear would have compensated the class changes.
Thanks to the item squish , the exponential scaling is gone.
So the item squish did it in the end.

[rda]

Besides, we won't be spending a lot of time at level 90 after 6.0 releases. Even if we did get negatively impacted by the squish, it would be relevant for less than a month, at which point we're allowed to level to 100 and overpower things even more.

Oh yeah, it's excuse time now, I love it.

[eggs]

I can live with not soloing for a few weeks until 100, but if its stuffed up at 100 its a different matter. Is this statement they made focused on 90s? As i thought at 100 we got a buff which made most old content just completly nukeable anyway.

[rda]

But this was soon a non issue because the exponential scale of the gear would have compensated the class changes.
Thanks to the item squish , the exponential scaling is gone.
So the item squish did it in the end.

The exponential scaling isn't gone, but the squish is in the end the main thing responsible for the mess, because it was the squish that created a myriad of corner cases which have to be fixed on a case-by-case basis (and some of which won't be fixed for this reason).