RIP Haste >Crit. Haste scaling removed from RPPM proc chance.

[Ashcatchum]

With these changes crit will outdo haste again... but haste triumphs mastery still

How do you know? Wheres your proof that will happen?

[Glurp]

Not sure what you mean by RIP and "it was fun while it lasted" considering all it did gameplay wise was make your Cobra shot a slightly faster cast. The thing that made Haste > Crit for BM was Blink Strikes. Prior to 5.2 the difference in the weight of our secondary stats was so small that the change to Blink Strikes scaled with Haste better than Crit and Mastery which was enough to push Haste to the top.

Haste will still be the top stat for BM in 5.4 considering we get another RPPM proc in the legendary cloak.

[zenyatta]

Not sure what you mean by RIP and "it was fun while it lasted" considering all it did gameplay wise was make your Cobra shot a slightly faster cast. The thing that made Haste > Crit for BM was Blink Strikes. Prior to 5.2 the difference in the weight of our secondary stats was so small that the change to Blink Strikes scaled with Haste better than Crit and Mastery which was enough to push Haste to the top.

Haste will still be the top stat for BM in 5.4 considering we get another RPPM proc in the legendary cloak.

Pretty sure it also affected trinkets, 2pc, 4pc, and the meta gem. Those aren't exactly tiny splashes on our overall dps.

[Deleted]

Pretty sure it also affected trinkets, 2pc, 4pc, and the meta gem. Those aren't exactly tiny splashes on our overall dps.

Crit also effects those though, if you really think about it

We'll need the maths gurus to run sims with the new data, but i think this change will bring crit quite a lot closer again

[Beoren]

Imo its a nerf for us in 5.4, the T16 2-set will make Rapid Fire +80% uptime and Rapid fire is Haste which increase RPPM procs -.-

[Tehstool]

I don't think the tier is rppm, it's a % and no rppm description in the description either.

I think they meant the old tier. Not the ones on the PTR.

Only rppm seems legendary meta, cloak and some trinkets atm.

Yep.

[Deleted]

The only RPPM agi trinket is the reverse renatakki one (I believe the 2 with damage proccs are bad enough to not take them into account), with which sometimes you could blow all the 20 stacks in less than 10 sec, making it a bit bleh. the bad thing is that when 5.4 hits, our 5.3 BiS trinkets will suffer a big nerf, and instead of keeping them until HCS, we will want to change them asap. I believe that our current tier bonuses will not be affected by the change, other than the initial change of puting the bad luck protection to 90s by default, so proccs in the start are no longer guaranteed. The tier bonuses didnt double dip with haste acording to their idea of double dipping, as they are flat damage proccs that will deal the same damage whatever is your haste. The meta gem shouldn't be affected, as it is also a flat damage proc in the end. I believe this tier we will go back to traditional ICD trinkets, and that the CD reduction one and the agi one with mastery procc will be our BiS, we will need to see how the change to RPPM works.

[Glurp]

Pretty sure it also affected trinkets, 2pc, 4pc, and the meta gem. Those aren't exactly tiny splashes on our overall dps.

I said gameplay wise, not mechanically.

[Deleted]

RPPM was never fun. How is it fun to have your dps tied to rng stat procs that are so big, a few missed procs and your performance looks terrible?

They should remove them from the game.

[Effinhunter]

This will be a noticable nerf to hunters, but this should be an even larger nerf to classes that scaled well with haste (e.g. warlocks). Overall, I think this will be a positive outcome that will make it more feasible for Blizzard to strike dps balances between the classes.

[Tecnice]

This is going to bring the highest damage doers more down to our level evening out the playing field. Given we get any more buffs, we could actually pull ahead or at least battle for #1 spot in 5.4

[Deleted]

The only RPPM agi trinket is the reverse renatakki one (I believe the 2 with damage proccs are bad enough to not take them into account), with which sometimes you could blow all the 20 stacks in less than 10 sec

Sorry for ignoring half your post and not contributing to the topic much, but I have two things I want to talk about.

The reverse Renataki trinket has been reworked some time ago, it now gives you 20 stacks upon activation and you lose 1 stack per second. So it will always run it's full duration and it's literally a reverse Renataki apart from instead of gaining/losing a stack every 2 seconds, it's every 1 second.

Second thing is, the Multi-Strike trinket for Survival at least actually doesn't seem that bad now. It's been slightly reworked as well to include an agility proc much like the cooldown reduction trinket, but the proc itself was doing a ton of damage for me and our two other Hunters on the PTR bosses we tried it on. The proc chance of Multi-Strike has been slightly reduced since then though. I've always said that the trinket was going to be utter garbage for us because our pet doesn't benefit from it. However, I'm starting to change my opinion.

For what it's worth, the cleave trinket now has an agility proc as well.

[Tehstool]

Just copying this from the 5.4 trinket thread that got pushed back a few pages.

5.4 Raid - Normal - Siege of Orgrimmar - Boss X Loot X - Agi DPS Trinket (1)

• Beastmaster Hunter - http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/145964-readiness
• Marksman Hunter - http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/145965-readiness
• Survival Hunter - http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/145966-readiness

5.4 Raid - Normal - Siege of Orgrimmar - Boss X Loot X - Agi DPS Trinket (2)

5.4 Raid - Normal - Siege of Orgrimmar - Boss X Loot X - Agi DPS Trinket (3)

5.4 Raid - Normal - Siege of Orgrimmar - Boss X Loot X - Agi DPS Trinket (4)

5.4 Raid - Normal - Siege of Orgrimmar - Boss X Loot X - Agi DPS Trinket (5)

[Deleted]

Haromm's Talisman is almost 5% DMG increase only via Multistrike which would be huge if it worked on all of our damage (pets / guardians). Even if not, Ebon Detonator give us 3.27% additional damage on pets. ATM, damage between us and the pets is roughly 50:50. So, if this will remain the same (50:50), HT will passively boost us by 2.3% while TEB by 1.64%.

However, the hardest nuking abilities come from pet(s). On the other hand, TEB will be much much harder to gamble then Rentaki.

EDIT: Errmm, or is it 3.28%? Our mastery is doubled?

[gulder]

Ooh they added an agi proc to the Cleave trinket too. Interesting.

[Noctifer616]

Just copying this from the 5.4 trinket thread that got pushed back a few pages.

5.4 Raid - Normal - Siege of Orgrimmar - Boss X Loot X - Agi DPS Trinket (1)

• Beastmaster Hunter - http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/145964-readiness
• Marksman Hunter - http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/145965-readiness
• Survival Hunter - http://ptr.wowdb.com/spells/145966-readiness

On the PTR Stampede CD is still reduced by the trinket.

[Deleted]

the last time I tried the new trinkets was 1 or 2 builds ago, and the multistrike procc was accounting for less than 1% of my total damage on the dummy, close to 2k out of 200k. If they buffed or either fixed it gives us at least the chance to have multiple viable options, not like ToT were the difference between the BiS pair of trinkets and the others was abysmal. The procc needs to be at least 3% of the total damage to compete with the other options. I also hope it doesn't turn into the new Vial of Shadows, making it way better than the others.