500% Threat generation is not enough!

[Deleted]

i dnt see why people dnt get this change is in place for lower geared tanks that see their vengeance dropped significant.
sure the better geared tanks will hardly notice this except a dps drop, but i geared up a tank alt myself just ago and its actually quite hard keeping aggro when the dps does so much damage and threat. and the veng nerf was only going too make it harder for fresh 90 tanks, so for them its a very welcome buff.

[kaiadam]

The vengeance nerfs are a collection of changes aimed to prevent seasoned tanks from abusing the mechanic to generate unintended and massive amounts of attack power resulting in the scenario that I linked above. The nerfs will barely affect new level 90s and the zones and dungeons that he'll likely experience. Given the dps buffs that warriors and dks received, I'd wager that the average newbie 90 tank will be doing more damage next patch.

If they really wanted to let tanks at ilvl 450 compete with dps at ilvl 580, they'd just simply make autoattacks unable to target non-tank specs. Even at ilvl 550, most specs are able to burst for 300k dps for the duration of a boss fight in a heroic mop dungeon run/scenario, and a new 90 tank isn't going to be able to hold threat regardless if his multiplier was 5 or 7, it'll be downright impossible when dps will go in at ilvl 580 with 500k dps.

[RuneeBH]

Whats the difference between having to monitor threat and not damage (in the past) and now monitoring damage and not threat?..it's basically the same thing, it just engaged and involves the tanks more in the fights and group and makes us more of a factor. Of course they can find a perfect spot where both dmg and threat would matter, but until then dmg>threat to keep us playing and tanking.

[Tinykong]

Threat should be irrelevant.

Threat at max level is something good tanks don't worry about, but threat at low levels is what makes people not want to play tanks, or just quit the game. Thunderclap, Keg Smash, Hammer, swipe, etc. should be learned at level 15, and generate enough threat so that low level tanks never worry about it in dungeons. All it does it frustrate people when dps pull off tanks, and tanks don't have their full tool kit to deal with stuff.

[Deleted]

There are loads of bad tanks out there who claim to be focusing on "survivability" and keeping aggro, because that is their job (hint: That's outdated). This change is a bad thing, as it doesn't punish (really) bad tanks at all. At least it was still possible to pull off threat off a bad tank during burst. Even that will be impossible at this point.

I kind of die a bit inside when I hear that someone in my raid say that someone is "doing less damage than the tank". For lots of fight this is how it's supposed to be. It has ceased to be a bad thing.

[kynthrus]

back then it took skill now its just a aoe holds aggro

No tanking has never required a large amount of skill. AoE always held enough aggro if you did it right and knew how to tab.

[Simulacrum]

No tanking has never required a large amount of skill. AoE always held enough aggro if you did it right and knew how to tab.

So you mean "aoe always held enough aggro"... if you relied entirely on single-target abilities to hold threat? How did that make sense in your head?

You weren't going to be holding threat on shit with something like thunder clap back in the day (which was warrior tanks' best "aoe" threat ability, not counting the amazing demoralizing shout of course, which also did *some* threat). Heck, it wasn't even aoe back in the day, it was like a 4 target cap ability or something, and even then you only used it for the debuff and MAYBE to get just barely enough threat to keep the *healer* from pulling while you tab through the targets. I remember I'd carry around that sporeggar dot shield with a spike on it, for when I came across a genuine aoe pull.

I remember, when I played my priest, I'd spam prayer of mending on the tanks on cooldown. Not because it was mana efficient, or a strong heal, but because it was bugged to give threat to the target that was healed instead of to the priest. It helped out many a tank noticeably, at least on the pulls.

Find it kind of hard to believe you're not just pulling it out your ass.

[Omega10]

I like this change. More tanks are needed, and this will make it easier for fresh level 90 tanks to tank heroics and such with high dps teammates.