Blizz denies Tinker class... or did they?

[Belisaurio]

Except you really can't. They don't have to be the same to share a common theme. No two classes in WoW at the moment overlap in theme.

Demon hunters, no matter how you twist it, at the end of the day overlap with warlocks, warriors, hunters, and of course rogues.

Warden, no matter how you twist it, at the end of the day overlap with monks, rogues, paladins/priests, and whatever else I'm forgetting.

They aren't the same, but they're similar enough - you won't see it in WoW.

This is not the topic, but there are some overlapped classes/skills/themes already:
Paladin=warrior+priest
Monk= rogue+priest/paladin+shaman
Shaman= mage+priest
Druid= mage+warrior+rogue
etc...

They aren't the same, but they're similar enough - but you have all in game already, some of them using the same type of skills or the same Fx in some abilities.
But If you can give them something unique, like armour or new look, then you have a new unique class.

[Pebble]

This is not the topic, but there are some overlapped classes/skills/themes already:
Paladin=warrior+priest
Monk= rogue+priest/paladin+shaman
Shaman= mage+priest
Druid= mage+warrior+rogue
etc...

They aren't the same, but they're similar enough - but you have all in game already, some of them using the same type of skills or the same Fx in some abilities.
But If you can give them something unique, like armour or new look, then you have a new unique class.

None of those things overlap at all. You clearly don't understand what I mean by theme.

Mechanically they may appear to be similar, but they aren't.

That's like trying to say a warlock and a fire mage are similar because they both use fire.

Or that a shaman and Druid are similar because they both use nature.

In reality, fire mages draw their power from the elements, where as warlocks literally draw on hellfire and burn themselves in the process. That is a difference of theme.

Shaman, again, draw from the elements. Druids draw from the earth mother. A difference in theme.

Mechanically you can argue that a paladin is basically a priest and warrior combined, but that isn't at all true in theme.

[Count Zero]

Except you really can't. They don't have to be the same to share a common theme. No two classes in WoW at the moment overlap in theme.

Demon hunters, no matter how you twist it, at the end of the day overlap with warlocks, warriors, hunters, and of course rogues.

Warden, no matter how you twist it, at the end of the day overlap with monks, rogues, paladins/priests, and whatever else I'm forgetting.

They aren't the same, but they're similar enough - you won't see it in WoW.

It doesn't matter how much overlap there is ... one of the few things in WoW I'm sure of is that we'll see playable Demon Hunters. They'll make it work.

[Pebble]

It doesn't matter how much overlap there is ... one of the few things in WoW I'm sure of is that we'll see playable Demon Hunters. They'll make it work.

And as I also said, you can think what you want, hope what you want. Logic tells us it won't happen.

Speculating that a demon hunter class will be added at this point is nothing more that hope and desire, there's no logical reasoning behind it.

Speculation generally needs to be accompanied by more than "I want it."

[Belisaurio]

Theme= thematic that they play/use. Can be aesthetics/cosmetics or user's feeling about them:

Paladin=warrior+priest: Same cosmetics of holy energy, purity, etc...+plus warrior character to feel like a "holy" warrior.
Monk= rogue+priest/paladin+shaman: Different cosmetics (peace, zen, oriental aesthetics, etc...), but the same type of melee combat, using holy energy, flee, fight melee and use at the same type magic damage.
Shaman= mage+priest: Close aesthetics (fire/water from mages), but using different armor, and using water energy like holy energy for a priest.
Druid= mage+warrior+rogue: different aesthetics, but using the same type off melee combat in cat form like a rogue, the same feeling of a warrior in bear and close to a arcane mage in chicken form. Of course they are different, but have something really close in the character's design.
etc...

Warden can be a mage/ rogue, so they overlap like a paladin to warrior/ priest, but have the feeling to be really different and use vengeance and anti-hero type character like DKs.
Tinkerer can be a DK/Warlock: summon minions in melee and fight in mid/melee range, but they can have really different aesthetics/cosmetics to feel completely new (and different resource to not feel like an engineering but close look in their aesthetics/cosmetics/particles in skills).
Demon Hunter can be like Rogue/DK +warlock, with the same melee/magic user like rogues, but using melee summons like DK but with warlocks aesthetics (or similar).

[Pebble]

Theme= thematic that they play/use. Can be aesthetics/cosmetics or user's feeling about them:



Warden can be a mage/ rogue, so they overlap like a paladin to warrior/ priest, but have the feeling to be really different and use vengeance and anti-hero type character like DKs.
Tinkerer can be a DK/Warlock: summon minions in melee and fight in mid/melee range, but they can have really different aesthetics/cosmetics to feel completely new (and different resource to not feel like an engineering but close look in their aesthetics/cosmetics/particles in skills).
Demon Hunter can be like Rogue/DK +warlock, with the same melee/magic user like rogues, but using melee summons like DK but with warlocks aesthetics (or similar).

Again, you're completely missing the point. All the things you're pointing out are MECHANICAL similarities for the sake of GAMEPLAY. None of the current classes overlap THEMATICALLY.

The overlap that would exist for Demon Hunters and Warden are THEMATIC similarities, not mechanical.

- - - Updated - - -

In game there's fire, nature, frost, holy, etc. Those are mechanics. For gameplay purposes.

In reality, it isn't that simple. There's multiple types of fire, there's multiple types of holy, there's multiple types of nature, frost, etc. They are different in THEME.

[BlackwingHecate]

None of those things overlap at all. You clearly don't understand what I mean by theme.

Mechanically they may appear to be similar, but they aren't.

That's like trying to say a warlock and a fire mage are similar because they both use fire.

Or that a shaman and Druid are similar because they both use nature.

In reality, fire mages draw their power from the elements, where as warlocks literally draw on hellfire and burn themselves in the process. That is a difference of theme.

Shaman, again, draw from the elements. Druids draw from the earth mother. A difference in theme.

Mechanically you can argue that a paladin is basically a priest and warrior combined, but that isn't at all true in theme.

And Demons Hunters and Warlocks would differ in theme in that DHs use their own power to fight against demons specificially, where as warlocks sign contracts with Demonic powers to use their power against whatever foes they face. It goes both ways.

[Count Zero]

And as I also said, you can think what you want, hope what you want. Logic tells us it won't happen.

Speculating that a demon hunter class will be added at this point is nothing more that hope and desire, there's no logical reasoning behind it.

Speculation generally needs to be accompanied by more than "I want it."

Well, you can assume the motivation behind my post all you want, but I don't believe Demon Hunters will be playable because "I want it". I don't personally care whether they appear or not.

Tom Chilton recently said: "The number one most requested race for us to do -- by a long shot -- it was pandaren, from various different ways that we gather information".

They listen to player feedback. I'd never heard much, at all, talk about folks wanting Pandaren in the game. But I've been hearing a ton of folks requesting Demon Hunters, for a long time. They will fit them in.

[BlackwingHecate]

Well, you can assume the motivation behind my post all you want, but I don't believe Demon Hunters will be playable because "I want it". I don't personally care whether they appear or not.

Tom Chilton recently said: "The number one most requested race for us to do -- by a long shot -- it was pandaren, from various different ways that we gather information".

They listen to player feedback. I'd never heard much, at all, talk about folks wanting Pandaren in the game. But I've been hearing a ton of folks requesting Demon Hunters, for a long time. They will fit them in.

Slightly off topic, but I personally know I pre-ordered BC as soon as I heard that the Pandaren would the Alliance race for it, and have always used that as my answer on "What race would you like to see in game" polls, but then, I'm just one person.

[Pebble]

And Demons Hunters and Warlocks would differ in theme in that DHs use their own power to fight against demons specificially, where as warlocks sign contracts with Demonic powers to use their power against whatever foes they face. It goes both ways.

They're both using demonic powers. From demons. It's the same thing. It's not like a fire mage and a warlock, or a Druid and a shaman.

[Count Zero]

Slightly off topic, but I personally know I pre-ordered BC as soon as I heard that the Pandaren would the Alliance race for it, and have always used that as my answer on "What race would you like to see in game" polls, but then, I'm just one person.

Yeah, I mean, they did say it was the number one requested race -- so obviously I either missed out on the forum posts, or it was largely in different ways they gathered that info.

That being said, if Pandaren were number one most requested race with that flying under my radar, then surely Demon Hunters (with me noticing they're the most requested class) must be pretty popular in all the ways they gather data.

[Belisaurio]

The overlap that would exist for Demon Hunters and Warden are THEMATIC similarities, not mechanical.

I don't understand.
You said that Demon Hunters overlap with:

warlocks, warriors, hunters, and of course rogues.

Warlocks: same energy (like paladins and priests: holy energy), but they play really different (ranged/summoner vs melee) and they look really diferent: long clothes vs tattoo without any armor (like priests and paladins).
Warriors: Can use the same weapons? Don't find anything similar, maybe the orc-warriors are close in aesthetics because they don't wear too much armor?
Hunters: The name? They hunt things (one hunt beasts, and other hunt demons)?
Rogues: The only class that I see they can overlap, but one is a rogue (something that can steal your watch in a handshake!!), and the other one is a magical user that use demon-energies to kill demons (fight fire with fire!!). A fusion of shaman/monk and rogue could be close maybe.

Warden

I can talk about them too, but I must go out (job to do) sorry.

P.D: I find more overlaped thematic-things in a priest-paladin-warrior or shamman-mage-monk than Demon Hunters.

[TheWindWalker]

Monks are unarmed fights that focus on using martial arts, powerful brews, and the aid of celestial beings. That is nothing like a rogue or ret paladin. The fact that they have energy and wear leather does not make them a rogue. The fact that they have a resource system does not make them ret paladins.

You didn't ask "are there lore differences between these" you said "do they overlap." Mechanically, a WW/BrM functions the same way an unstealthed Rogue and Feral does up until you mix in the way Ret handles using Holy Power for Templar's Verdict. If you're going to pull that kind of excuse on me you might as well say that bringing in a Demon Hunter exactly like Illidan with renamed attacks and manditory swords wouldn't have any overlap with Warlocks. You can't have it both ways and that's literally what you're trying to do here.

[Pebble]

Yeah, I mean, they did say it was the number one requested race -- so obviously I either missed out on the forum posts, or it was largely in different ways they gathered that info.

That being said, if Pandaren were number one most requested race with that flying under my radar, then surely Demon Hunters (with me noticing they're the most requested class) must be pretty popular in all the ways they gather data.

Except pandaren being requested and demon hunters being requested are two very different beasts. If Pandaren had already been seen in game pre-MoP and existed in some form (neutral faction, etc) you'd have a point. Proceeding to add them as a playable race would have conflicted with something else in game.

They didn't exist, had never been seen. Adding them didn't conflict with anything currently in game.

Demon Hunters exist, they've been seen in game, their abilities and theme have been farmed out to other classes. Adding them now directly conflicts with those classes.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

If there is one thing I've learned, it's Teriz is addicted to Tinkers. I mean if it fit Dark Below sure more power to it but I don't see how really.

[Pebble]

You didn't ask "are there lore differences between these" you said "do they overlap." Mechanically, a WW/BrM functions the same way an unstealthed Rogue and Feral does up until you mix in the way Ret handles using Holy Power for Templar's Verdict. If you're going to pull that kind of excuse on me you might as well say that bringing in a Demon Hunter exactly like Illidan with renamed attacks and manditory swords wouldn't have any overlap with Warlocks. You can't have it both ways and that's literally what you're trying to do here.

I said do they overlap in THEME. Theme is not mechanics, theme is basically the lore of a class. Do I need to define my every word? I said do they overlap in theme. I'm not taking anything back or trying to have anything "both ways."

And No, actually bringing in a demon hunter exactly like illidan would directly overlap with warlocks metamorphosis.

That said, my response to bringing in a class exactly like Illidan would rather be that it's far too specific to base a class (and thereby three specs) from. "Illidan" is far too narrow a scope for an entire class, even ignoring the obvious overlap issues.

Mechanically basically every class overlaps in some way. MECHANICALLY we may as well have only four classes: Tank, Healer, Ranged DPS, and Melee DPS.

But we don't, do we? Because mechanics aren't the primary driving force for a new class, the THEME is.

[razorfire]

they denied it, they said no and that it was too "whimsical"...meaning it's not happening anytime soon, if they choose to use it they will but if they don't they won't. so can we PLEASE STOP WITH THE STUPID CLASS SPECULATION THREADS WHEN WE DON'T EVEN KNOW FOR SURE THEY'LL ADD MORE CLASSES?!

[Deleted]

finally a ray of hope, there is no place for tinkers in wow.
waiting for the next bad idea from the community.

[razorfire]

finally a ray of hope, there is no place for tinkers in wow.
waiting for the next bad idea from the community.

new proffession: woodcraft: build amazing furniture that will never appear in game such as chairs, tables, and if you are truly skilled....a credenza. (warning, none of these items are place-able and they give no in game benefit, use of woodcraft requires hand-saw(5k gold) measuring tape (4k gold) and duct tape (100k gold))

[Pebble]

they denied it, they said no and that it was too "whimsical"...meaning it's not happening anytime soon, if they choose to use it they will but if they don't they won't. so can we PLEASE STOP WITH THE STUPID CLASS SPECULATION THREADS WHEN WE DON'T EVEN KNOW FOR SURE THEY'LL ADD MORE CLASSES?!

Actually no one denied anything, you should probably check the tweet again. And, if you'll recall, similar comments were made about Pandaren just weeks before Mists of Pandaria was announced.

Further, of course we don't know what they'll add, no one except blizzard does. That's why it's called speculation.

But! We can assume a few things based on what we DO know.

First, Blizzard NEEDS a major new feature for the expansion. Historically these have been either races or a class.

1. We know that Blizzard is redoing the older race models for 6.0. This effort undoubtably takes time away from their art team, taking up time that could normally have gone to completely new races. Could they do both? Sure, but we can assume that it won't happen.

2. Fourth specializations for all of the classes would be far too large an undertaking for a single expansion, and won't happen.
3. Fourth specialzations for a select few classes would technically be new content for only a portion of the player base, and would likely need to be joined by another major feature (IE New Races), thus making it an unlikely option.

What are we left with? A new class, an expansion featuring basically just revamped races, or a completely new type of major feature to head the expansion.

Bringing nothing to the table but revamped content isn't a mistake they'll like make twice, they learned their lesson with Cataclysm.

A completely new type of feature is of course possible, but what could be as major as new races/ a class?

Which leaves us with a new class for the expansion. There are very few themes that aren't already occupied by other playable classes. Basically missing are a bard-type class and a technology class.

So, of course, the speculation is focused at the moment on a new class.

The name of the expansion suggests underwater, and technology and underwater exploration are commonly intertwined. Yes, even in WoW.

So here we are.

And, if you don't like speculation threads, there's a simple answer. DONT CLICK ON IT. Magic, I know.