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  1. #561
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
    The debate over faction story development continues internally here at Blizzard, as it does on the forums and elsewhere.

    Any chance we can get more updates on that debate? We get constant updates on gameplay mechanics from Ghostcrawler and other CMs about their thoughts and feelings, but we only rarely hear things from Kosak and friends. It'd be very helpful if they started talking to us and telling us what they're hearing, because right now it seems like there's a really big communication gap.

    It's something we're working on. I'd love to set up more story-centric interviews and conversations with the community. But, while Dave and Greg are both design leads, it's very difficult to compare their tasks, workloads, and roles within the community.

    Systems design is extremely complicated, but it revolves primarily around math. It's easier to have a conversation over class balance concerns and walk away with some objective, actionable feedback. We also try not to change classes too dramatically from patch to patch -- we don't want people logging in and suddenly not knowing how to play their class every time they download a new patch. Greg can talk about general changes early on in a patch's development cycle, and then he can take feedback and look at an array of statistical data we collect in order to finetune numbers closer to the patch's release.

    Story development works very differently. Concerns are much more subjective. This isn't to say they're inherently less valuable, as we're always taking careful note of what the popular opinion is on a given topic. But, there's often a degree of complexity to story development concerns that certainly can't be addressed by changing a couple values somewhere in the game code. And the story we want to tell, combined with the gameplay we want to introduce, is determined much earlier on in development than what class balance will look like in patch X.

    For example, there are several people in this thread asserting that the entire concept of the Siege of Orgrimmar is flawed from a story perspective, particularly for the Alliance. Well, we knew Siege of Orgrimmar would be the final raid of Mists of Pandaria before the expansion was revealed at BlizzCon 2011, and the story framework for how we'd get there was already more or less in place. So, even when we do react directly to feedback about story concerns, we're looking much more at the big picture here, and what stories we want to tell and how they should unfold over the course of several patches (or even expansions).

    We can make some tweaks and refine some story arcs along the way, but regardless of the discussions taking place right now, the 5.4 story is set. It has been for quite some time. That's in big contrast to the aspects of systems design that draw the most discussion (i.e. mainly class balance).

    So, tying this back to the varying capacities in which Dave and Greg engage the community, I couldn't be very liberal with Dave's time when it came to booking interviews. I found about an hour of his time (hour and a half if you count that I stole part of his lunch break) and sat him down for back-to-back interviews -- in, out, and done in one swoop. The reason being that his role in the development of a patch happens at a very different stage of the cycle. At this point he's not actively reading PTR feedback and tweaking how the Horde and Alliance are responding to the threat of Garrosh, or deciding to rework the conclusion of the siege. It's way too late for that, and he's already very busy working on the stories yet to unfold in World of Warcraft. And, yes, in that space he takes popular feedback to heart.

    Dave Kosak... I just don't know anyone more passionate about this game's narrative, or more burdened with the responsibility of making sure that the story is fun to play through regardless of the faction, race, or class a player chooses. He cares deeply about you feeling personally invested in what you're doing, and whether you're red or blue certainly doesn't change that.

    All this being stated, I want to add more words to this post.

    Part of my role on the WoW Community Team is fansite/influencer relations, which includes booking developer interviews. I've been on the team for six years, but I took on the role of fansite relations shortly before Mists of Pandaria was released. Not counting things like PAX or other press events, I've been responsible for booking developer interviews for five press rounds (5.0-5.4). Each time I experiment with the formula by trying to cover different formats, give different sites or people a chance to talk to the devs, etc.

    Looking back on the last five rounds to determine how we can improve the process and results going forward, I'll tell you right now that I'm most interested in bringing story discussion more to the forefront of interviews -- including WoW devs like Dave Kosak, as well as folks from Creative Dev like Chris Metzen and Micky Neilson -- and getting our artists involved more regularly, 'cause you don't hear from them enough. And finally, while I understand the importance of having a mix of text, audio, and video formats, I want the developers on camera more. I believe strongly that the more you get to see and hear the individual behind the name, the better!

  2. #562
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khalltusk View Post
    Very true but so far no Velen sound files have been found. Kinda disappointing. The only mention of him was in 5.1 we don't see him either.
    I'm still hoping he gets the Lor'themar treatment next expansion. He kinda went from zero to hero very quickly this expansion what with 5.1, 5.2, 5.4 and Blood of the Highborne.

  3. #563
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    I'm still hoping he gets the Lor'themar treatment next expansion. He kinda went from zero to hero very quickly this expansion what with 5.1, 5.2, 5.4 and Blood of the Highborne.
    Yes I can whole heartedly agree Lor'themar went from LOL WHO? to "that bench flipping super elf" really impressed by how they handled him and the elves this xpac. If they can do that for the drenai i'd be well impressed.

  4. #564
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khalltusk View Post
    Yes I can whole heartedly agree Lor'themar went from LOL WHO? to "that bench flipping super elf" really impressed by how they handled him and the elves this xpac. If they can do that for the drenai i'd be well impressed.
    Jaina should bust into Exodar and steal all their ancient magical secrets.

  5. #565
    Elemental Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Being an aggressor is the spirit and character of the faction eh?
    You may not like it, but the Horde ARE seen as the Bad Guys and the Alliance as Good Guys. That results in different expectations, and different standards do apply.

    If you look at it more closely, there are exceptions and nuances to both......but there is a reason why the Alliance are lambasted for Taurajo whilst Southshore is forgotten.

    EJL

  6. #566
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post
    You may not like it, but the Horde ARE seen as the Bad Guys and the Alliance as Good Guys.
    There are no evil/good faction. There are just two factions
    Good and bad are based on perspective
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  7. #567
    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post
    You may not like it, but the Horde ARE seen as the Bad Guys and the Alliance as Good Guys. That results in different expectations, and different standards do apply.

    If you look at it more closely, there are exceptions and nuances to both......but there is a reason why the Alliance are lambasted for Taurajo whilst Southshore is forgotten.

    EJL
    The horde _WERE_ the bad guys up until WC3 when it was turned on its head. Anyone new to the game until Mop and possibly Cata would see it as Horde = group of outcasts/underdogs banding together with alliance being your typical "human and elves good guys". In MOP for sure I could see the horde being viewed in a negative light. Cata possibly too depending on what quests you did.

    Also blizzard them selves dont state either side is good or bad.

  8. #568
    Quote Originally Posted by khalltusk View Post
    Very true but so far no Velen sound files have been found. Kinda disappointing. The only mention of him was in 5.1 we don't see him either.
    Draenei being forgotten is par for the course.

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