Terribly disappointed by the game

[RoninaThorstone]

Oh yeah? Sounds pretty cool.... Is it still for "the greater good of the galaxy" or is it just shits and giggles?

No. It's like, you could save these people... But each one you save would sap you of a little of your strength. So, you choose power over the lives of innocent people. Hell, one time it gets REALLY messed up (like, a really young padawan who had nothing to do with it). Like, I didn't feel okay after part.

It's just all a giant power trip for the dark side consular.

[Venziir]

No. It's like, you could save these people... But each one you save would sap you of a little of your strength. So, you choose power over the lives of innocent people. Hell, one time it gets REALLY messed up (like, a really young padawan who had nothing to do with it). Like, I didn't feel okay after part.

It's just all a giant power trip for the dark side consular.

Sounds like Palpatine would invite you over for a cup of (dark) coffee...

[Karon]

Plays a Multiplayer Game for the Single Player aspect

Sad.

[RoninaThorstone]

Sounds like Palpatine would invite you over for a cup of (dark) coffee...

I should probably note that even Qzen Fes, who views killing jedi as earning massive points toward getting into heaven, dissaproved of cutting down a youngling.

[Venziir]

Plays a Multiplayer Game for the Single Player aspect

Sad.

To be completely honest, Bioware at many times refered to the game as a singleplayer game that just so happened to be online. Not to mention they even called it the spiritual successor to the Kotor series, a renowned singleplayer RPG series.

- - - Updated - - -

I should probably note that even Qzen Fes, who views killing jedi as earning massive points toward getting into heaven, dissaproved of cutting down a youngling.

Sounds a bit like the destruction of the Jedi Temple in Revenge of the Sith.

[kail]

You're not alone OP. The game built in plenty of hype with is IP and Bioware's history. I really wanted to like this game, hell I unsubbed from WoW 3 weeks before its release and practically /wave my guild goodbye...boy that was awkward upon my return.

As many have said though, this game wasn't going to be for you. One of my biggest gripes was how TOR became such a theme park, WoW looks sandbox next to it IMO. I expected some use of the planets they crafted other than leveling.

After hitting lv50, the only thing to do out in the world was world PvP in Illum...and that was just an abomination. So they got rid it and left PvP to only WZs (aka Battlegrounds). Ops were accessed in the Fleets. Flashpoints were located in Fleets. Mats were acquired from the menu. Dailies...that was pretty much it, and a few world bosses that dropped subpar loot.

In a nutshell, I detest MMOs where just about all of the endgame content is accessed in a main city. Lack of a usable world is fail IMO, I hated it when it was happening to WoW and it was even worse in SWTOR last I played.

[RoninaThorstone]

You're not alone OP. The game built in plenty of hype with is IP and Bioware's history. I really wanted to like this game, hell I unsubbed from WoW 3 weeks before its release and practically /wave my guild goodbye...boy that was awkward upon my return.
As many have said though, this game wasn't going to be for you. One of my biggest gripes was how TOR became such a theme park, WoW looks sandbox next to it IMO. I expected some use of the planets they crafted other than leveling.

After hitting lv50, the only thing to do out in the world was world PvP in Illum...and that was just an abomination. So they got rid it and left PvP to only WZs (aka Battlegrounds). Ops were accessed in the Fleets. Flashpoints were located in Fleets. Mats were acquired from the menu. Dailies...that was pretty much it, and a few world bosses that dropped subpar loot.

In a nutshell, I detest MMOs where just about all of the endgame content is accessed in a main city. Lack of a usable world is fail IMO, I hated it when it was happening to WoW and it was even worse in SWTOR last I played.

The trick is to empty the guild bank before you quit.
Then you don't have to worry bout wanting to go back.

[FlawlessSoul]

The trick is to empty the guild bank before you quit.
Then you don't have to worry bout wanting to go back.

Always remember: Pillage before you burn.

[May90]

Hyperbole. Class stories tend to be 20% of the leveling experience. You usually have 1 or 2 personal story quests with 4-6 planet quests per hub. I never had to grind repeatable quests while leveling (even as F2P)

Yes, but what is "class stories" in your opinion? It is not just cutscenes and dialogues. It is also the way from one quest point to another. If you only do story quests, you will be way behind in XP and won't be able to proceed at some point. And even if it was possible, you still need to run between questing points killing mobs, and that process, I think, is one of the worst I've ever seen in RPGs.

You played an MMO when you have no interest in the prime purposes of an MMO. (PVP, raiding, instanced group flashpoints)

How does this justify all this copy-pasting, bad voice acting, dumb quests and such? It should not be in a high-quality game, MMO or not.

good luck thrying to get into wow's quests and "storyline" lol.

WoW? I think, you're mistaking me with someone. In WoW I didn't even level my character to 90 and quit.

I mean you are in an mmo - and have cut out like what 75% of the game... just to do their leveling story line? Plan on continued disappointment.

Maybe, they shouldn't have positioned the game as a "story-based" MMO then? If they said that it is a MMO with story elements, I wouldn't even try this game. But, hey, in their blogs they claimed for so long that people who expected KOTOR 3 wouldn't be disappointed either...

---

Anyway. No matter what kind of game this is... No matter how much money has been spent on it... No matter what people this game is aimed on... The same droid at every Republic outpost speaking the same phrase every time is ridiculous. Quests like "Kill 25 Imperials, then kill 25 more Imperials, then hack 10 Imperial computers, then kill Imperial general, collect his tag and drop it into Mission Dropbox" are an abomination. And telling to F2P players that they are shit... No comment.

I don't know. Maybe there is some secret? Maybe Bioware didn't make this game at all? Maybe all Bioware stuff suddenly got ill and the game development was given to a group of Stanford students? This game doesn't look like Bioware's work at all. After Baldur's Gate 1/2, Planescape Torment, KOTOR 1/2, Dragon Age 1/2, Mass Effect 1/2/3, this just doesn't make sense.

[RoninaThorstone]

Yes, but what is "class stories" in your opinion? It is not just cutscenes and dialogues. It is also the way from one quest point to another. If you only do story quests, you will be way behind in XP and won't be able to proceed at some point. And even if it was possible, you still need to run between questing points killing mobs, and that process, I think, is one of the worst I've ever seen in RPGs. Quests like "Kill 25 Imperials, then kill 25 more Imperials, then hack 10 Imperial computers, then kill Imperial general, collect his tag and drop it into Mission Dropbox" are an abomination.

You have no idea how bad it CAN be, then.

Compared to most other MMOs, swtor's leveling experience is one of the best in the industry. You should try Rift... That's a game where I think they should just remove leveling all together, have you start at 60, and just make players scale down per zone like in GW2.

[kail]

The trick is to empty the guild bank before you quit.
Then you don't have to worry bout wanting to go back.

Didn't take your name seriously until now.

[May90]

You have no idea how bad it CAN be, then.

Compared to most other MMOs, swtor's leveling experience is one of the best in the industry. You should try Rift... That's a game where I think they should just remove leveling all together, have you start at 60, and just make players scale down per zone like in GW2.

But why can't leveling be like in KOTOR? They've developed the most expensive game ever, right? So why can't they add different fully voiced NPCs on the way? Why can't they remove all the "Kill N bad guys" quests and replace them with, say, mini-games (like Tower of Hanoy in Sith Tomb in KOTOR), dialogue-only quests and such?
That's what I expected when waiting for the game. I thought that it would be like in KOTOR, story, cinematics, conversations with some short battles, mini-games, etc. And they swore it would be like that, too.

[Musik-Diversity86]

I did the same, I was off of WoW for 9 to 10 months because I got burnt out with the release of MoP, although I noticed it got better, and I was playing Swtor since it looked interesting.

I was F2P for one month and felt convinced being a sub would make the game fun and I did subscribe but after so much questing, leveling, flashpoints, playing all classes and reaching at the most lvl 42, working on my crew skills and pvp.... basically I tried everything a lvl 42 could and I just lost the drive.

I agree that the game could have done better. You have a point where the voice acting in your character was way worse than the voice acting from NPC's...... NPC'S!!!!. I was excited to hear that Nolan North voiced the Jedi Consular and played him but even his voice acting felt like "oh hey you want me to read this? ok done I gotta go, I am hungry for some subway sammiches".

People say that one of the best parts of Swtor is the storyline. Well although it is pretty cool that quests have voices and cutscenes but that's the only thing, Swtor may not have had interesting and engaging lore but atleast it had voices. Not trying to say Swtor is the worst game in the world but it wasn't for me but it was for 500,000 other people.

WoW has things I wish could have been done like voices and cutscenes just like in swtor but I am sure that would be too much for for it since it has way too much content compared to Swtor. Plus if Blizzard does that then money is spent on cutscenes and voices instead of great stuff like content, end game, fun stuff . If you do come back to WoW then I would be happy to invite you back to our 7.7million playerbase and take your soul again lol.

[kail]

But why can't leveling be like in KOTOR? They've developed the most expensive game ever, right? So why can't they add different fully voiced NPCs on the way? Why can't they remove all the "Kill N bad guys" quests and replace them with, say, mini-games (like Tower of Hanoy in Sith Tomb in KOTOR), dialogue-only quests and such?
That's what I expected when waiting for the game. I thought that it would be like in KOTOR, story, cinematics, conversations with some short battles, mini-games, etc. And they swore it would be like that, too.

I wanted a KOTOR 3 as well. But I can't see its features working for MMOs, even if just the leveling. One of the best parts of KOTOR was the extensive backstory behind every location and event in the game, wouldn't work if playing in a group and someone is rushing you to continue on. The dialogues were cut short and decisions have zero effect except for some NPC becoming broke because of how "evil" or "good" you are.Unlike the single player games, the RPG in MMORPG has to be more player created and imagined.

[RoninaThorstone]

But why can't leveling be like in KOTOR? They've developed the most expensive game ever, right? So why can't they add different fully voiced NPCs on the way? Why can't they remove all the "Kill N bad guys" quests and replace them with, say, mini-games (like Tower of Hanoy in Sith Tomb in KOTOR), dialogue-only quests and such?
That's what I expected when waiting for the game. I thought that it would be like in KOTOR, story, cinematics, conversations with some short battles, mini-games, etc. And they swore it would be like that, too.

1. We don't know how much it cost. We have guesses ranging from 80 million to 600 million dollars.
2. The reason why each character isn't a unique voice actor is because swtor went for quality voice actors for 16 of the main story characters + a bunch of side characters all voiced by big names in the voice acting industry. Most games are actaully limited in their voice acting, like how skyrim only uses a handful of voice actors for 99% of the NPCs. I actually have theory about open sourcing voice acting as a way of making the community do free labor and having an intern select good voice acted clips. But yeah. No other MMO has the diveristy, amount, and quality of voice acting that swtor does.
3. The grind quests are there to slow players down and prevent them from reaching end game quickly. Unfortunately, the amount of time and money that goes into making the leveling process is usually not worth the time and money players spend to finish it. Players always consume content faster than developers can create it. There's a few solutions to this, one is to not be a subscription game and the other is to not have traditional leveling. Do I dislike kill 25 driods? Yes, but then, I dislike anything that is 'throw away' content.

You should have done research on swtor instead of letting yourself THINK that there's all that stuff. We've been asking for pazaak since beta. We've been asking for swoop racing. We've been asking for off rails space flight (omg it might be coming). Trust me, I was a little frustrated when they promised that they would tend to the space desires of me and my space people and then gave us more space rail combat. I bought the game and subscribed for a while under the assumption they were going to hold to their promise... It seems like they might actually do it sometime soon.

[Dedweight]

I can recommend the Sith Warrior story line, especially as a Light side user (I've done both, and now have two 50 Immortal Juggs, one Light and one dark). I've heard the Jedi Knight story is also good.

The engine is crap. It's got some nice visuals, but performs rubbish and is rather unstable.

Some of the F2P limits are irritating, agreed, and the "SUBSCRIBE, PEON" is a bit overdone. But hey, they fucked it up originally so they're obviously going to fuck up the attempt at fixing stuff.

I agree that space missions are pretty dumb, but that may be changing: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ser-from-Dulfy

I haven't kept up with the game since I quit a month or two after release but from what I remember I'd have to agree with this and a lot of what others said. The Trooper story was pretty meh, I never finished the Bounty Hunter or Smuggler lines so no comment on those, but the Warrior line as light side was pretty great(I especially enjoyed some of the "WTF" moments when certain Alliance NPC's realized I wasn't going to kill them).

[Musik-Diversity86]

But yeah. No other MMO has the diveristy, amount, and quality of voice acting that swtor does.

Well in terms of quality and diversity I wouldn't go THAT far but it does have a large amount of voice acting.

[RoninaThorstone]

Well in terms of quality and diversity I wouldn't go THAT far but it does have a large amount of voice acting.

Um... Since there's really only one other MMO that has a lot of voice acting (GW2) and it pales in comparison... I would go that far.

[CandyCotton Marshmallows]

You played an MMO when you have no interest in the prime purposes of an MMO. (PVP, raiding, instanced group flashpoints)

I agree with caveat; MMO is about multiplayer experience, which doesn't require you to pvp, raid, or do flashpoints. Just questing and doing the stories with other people is a multiplayer experience.

Basing this game off the 'single player experience' is not necessarily as intended at all. It is the BEST MMO for a single player experience on the market though. But they encourage group play pretty strong, if not indirectly. Group quests on all the planets, group areas on all the planets. Giving you quests for the flashpoints to encourage you to group up with others to get them done. World bosses to attempt to take down.

Basing the game on KotOR is wrong as well. My wife and I thought about buying it, but when we saw that popup combat crap, we both knew it would be the worst gameplay experience we could imagine.



1) I hear inflection. I hear attitude. Maybe it is just the OP that wants a bubbly teenager to shout the lines? Every line cannot be unique though; there are budgets and deadlines to hit, which they pushed back many times until EA FORCED it out the door, they still wanted another year or two before release.


2) 'shiny' moments ... hmm, well, not everyone likes every score. A planet in a state of disrepair from a past war, with plague outbreaks and war, shouldn't sound like your pop music channel. Again, it has atmosphere and decent; but outside of a few places in the WoW universe like Grizzly Hills, I don't really recall any ambient music directly in any game. It is background. If you want, you can always play your own 'shiny, happy, people' music in the background!

3)ALL MMOs are this way. WoW is not any different. In fact, WoW is less 'immersive' because you aren't making choices on how to approach a mission (which does affect what you do in quite a few cases). There is nearly zero voice acting for questing in WoW. You claim to not come from WoW, and that is obvious, because you don't understand that WoW is more repetitive and tedious than SWtOR as far as questing goes. All the standard mechanics apply outside of 'action-combat' MMOs like Tera. WoW copied theirs from EQ, so SWtOR didn't 'copy WoW's combat', they copied the industry standard that existed BEFORE WoW. Tell me how you wish to accomplish combat without keybinds and action bars? Even Tera with its different combat style still uses keybinds and action bars; because there is no other efficient way to do it, or at least no one has come up with it yet. You don't not use wheels and tires if you develop a car because 'Ford did it' first. I found my sorcerer, especially the healing aspect, less boring and repetitive than WoW, especially after Cata where they homogenized all the class to a small, slow, cheap heal, expensive, medium, fast heal, expensive big, slow heal. At least for a while, they tried to get druids to not HoT, Disc to not bubble, etc. Ridiculous. The class you play and how you approach it means everything.


4) each planet was different. architecture in places is usually similar, especially when military is involved. There are only so many ways you can make a bunker to protect yourself from the cold, and the smart thing to do would be the most efficient. You mass manufacture materials at specific sizes, and that allows speed of production so you can get stuff built faster; we aren't in an artsy community, we are dealing with war and setting up bases quick, not always worrying about aesthetics. Even places that feel similar, like Nar Shadaa and Coruscant, are still visually much different; but when you are on a city planet, there isn't much else you can do but run around inside buildings. Boring only because you are boring/bored with it. Negative attitudes means you get negative results. If I try to play WoW right now, I could hate everything about it, because my attitude towards a lot of things has been tainted because I don't like a lot of the directions they have taken ... that doesn't make the locations boring, but I would be bored with it because I'm not investing into the game to allow myself to immerse, because I see the clunky combat in WoW, I see the repetition, and other stuff; that people who are loving the game at the moment, don't see; the same as when I first started playing, Outlands was amazing, and when I hit my prime in the game, no matter how much I ran the same dungeons in wrath, I was never bored; though there were people who found it boring. It is your personal attitude that affects this the most, not so much the game, because it isn't universally boring.

5) They are droids. Robots. Of course they have similar programming. But the NPCs you get quests from, the ones out in the world, are all mostly different, as much as the customization allows. You get quests from fat people, from skinny people, from women, from men, some have scars, some don't, they are different classes, they have different gear. I mean, I could say Garrosh Hellscream is in Nagrand, Borean Tundra, Icecrown Citadel, Ogrimmar, etc. all at the same time gameplay wise, even though not in lore; but I'm not making a case against WoW which I respect the fact people love it; no need to stretch the truth and ignore everything else to make some false point.

6) Check the teaser for SSSP, they've been working on off-rails space combat for a long time; they just aren't ready for it. It was never intended to be a major part of the game, as it isn't a common thing in MMOs to have space combat, and this is NOT SW:G. Crafting? Well, you can send your people out to gather you tons of mats and earn tons of credits, without doing a single thing yourself. You don't craft anything yourself. You have at max level, more companions than you can send out at once, if subbed, each one can be tasked at 5 at a time. That means you can set up 25 crafts, while you go do dailies with another companion and just let the stuff get dropped into your bags while you do more important stuff. In WoW, which you've compared to yourself, you have NO choice; you either buy stuff off the AH, or you farm every mat yourself. When you craft, you have to sit there, yourself, and turn ore into bars, mill herbs, craft gear. You have to stop playing to sit in one spot and watch your toons hands move up and down for a very long time if you already spent hours farming a ton of mats (it takes forever to smelt 1000 ore, or worse, mill 1000 herbs). Just don't see the validity of a complaint about telling a companion to do something for you while you can continue to play, whether the craft takes 1 minute or 2 hours, you don't stop playing, your servant does the work for you. Space stations are actually a bit different for each planet, but the loading, especially those not on SSDs gets annoying. You do have options to avoid some of it, like fleet passes, and the mission boxes to move among planets, at least for the daily zones. In reality, if you are leveling, you should be on the planet for a long time, not planet hopping that much. Outside of that, passes + perks give you a lot of bypassing, not to mention shuttles now take you to your ship, and the flashpoint shuttles take you to fleet as well I think.

7) advertising in any game is annoying, good thing Blizzard is making an in-game store! but honestly, you don't need the increased xp, or boosts. If you are clearing planets and doing absolutely anything on the side, you will still outlevel the planets. Always log off in a cantina. Do all the heroics and area quests (they provide nice upgrades most of the time, so not only do you play with others, you get great xp, credits, and gear! wow, playing the game rewards you!!!). When the game launched, sprint was 15 for subscribers. No problems there. I believe mounts were at 20 iirc (I know it was nice to get sprint, then it was nice getting a mount later). Spend only $5 on anything in the game, and you get 4 quickbars; though 2 is fine if you use them efficiently. Ability bloat doesn't really happen until much later, and even then a lot of abilities are situational (you can 'seethe' from the menu system, etc). Not to mention, things like quickbars, etc can be unlocked by earning in game credits and buying the unlocks off the GTN, let others spend their money and you get the unlocks without spending a dime. Hmm, WoW you can only play to 20 for free and have all sorts of trading, AH, chat restrictions. Are there better F2P models? Yes, Tera, Rift, and Aion. I don't sub any longer; but I've earned credits from dailies to unlock essentially everything I need, without paying anything. I get the full experience I did as a sub now, without paying a sub. Unless you raid a lot, do flashpoints a lot, or pvp a lot; the experience is nearly identical; you just 'feel' like you are missing out.

8) They have fixed TONS of bugs and mistakes. The game has come a long way since launch. It still has a long way to go, but I'd rather them continue to fix things like memory leak crashing instead of a misspelled word or grammatical error that most won't notice. Don't know, I get 100 fps with max settings including shadows; maybe update your gpu driver? clean out the dust in your pc? upgrade? You know you don't have to play on max settings. I can't play Rift on max settings, but I don't go there and say it is a problem with the game; I just know that my system isn't capable of max Rift settings. They could optimize a bit better, or enable multi-core support, but that doesn't detract from the game; because I still think their world is beautiful; just like you not having max settings in SWtOR isn't really their fault, because others do have it so you just don't have as good a rig, your problem My computer NEVER overheats from the game. If your PC is overheating, clean the damn thing out, check that is airflow around your rig is good, if you are overclocking, then maybe you shouldn't. There is a problem on YOUR end if your PC overheats. It means you are running your cpu/gpu to its max, and you should probably do something to slow it down, whether lower graphics settings or better cooling or not overclock. I've played SWtOR in the past for 12 hours straight and my PC didn't overheat. I've also never had a connection issue that was related to SWtOR servers. I've had connection issues, but I've had them with WoW too. It could be a hop between you and their servers. It could be your ISP. But I'm usually at a steady 80ms on a bad day, and 30ms on a good day. 'Lag' has been no more prevalent in this game, than any game, such as WoW, Rift, Aion, LoL. They've all have had their share of lag spikes, but since it happens to them all, it really isn't an issue; and some games deal with lag better on your client side.



I could say the same thing about WoW if I disregarded the things they do right. Cata was a massive middle finger considering they made as much a month or two in wrath as SWtOR spent on the entire development of their game. All games have budgets and resource limitations. KotOR looks like shit imo. I'm so glad I watched some let's plays before ordering them. That pop up combat actions is atrocious. My wife was so excited to possibly order those games until she saw the vids, and we watched several to see if it was just one person choosing it, or something for a specific version (console vs pc).


You are entitled to your opinion. You have every right to not like the game; but at least be realistic with your expectations. EA did a number to Bioware, I'm sure of that. SWtOR was released a year or two before it should've, EA made them. They've had massive cuts to their teams. They were forced into F2P, which delayed other content. EA LOVES pay per piece models (check out Sims addons for a great example, tons of expensive additions to an expensive core game).

But the game itself is great at its core. You don't need any subscriber benefits. The only real restriction is not getting Makeb, but individual class stories stop at 50 anyway. You can essentially eliminate the Cartel Coin icon by shrinking it and hiding it behind another UI element. You can earn most of the unlocks by playing the game through earning credits, which will come hand over fist with dailies at 50. Not every class story is for everyone, if you don't like one, definitely try another, even the advanced classes play enough different that if you don't like the one you chose, level its mirror class of the opposite faction and choose the opposite mirror advanced class. The story will be different as well. A Sorcerer/Consular plays nothing like a Assassin/Shadow, etc. There are flaws, but there are in every single game. MMOs are not single player games, though this one makes the experience per player the best in the genre, but they still intend you to group up while questing.


If you don't like it, you should feel free to move on. But I suggest you take a deep breath, clear your mind, and try to look at the game without trying to make it fill your ex's shoes. Don't think about xp bonuses. Don't worry about action bars. Just play and involve yourself in the story. Let go and have fun. Find some people you enjoy, and play together. This isn't KotOR, This isn't WoW. In dating, if you are trying to replace your ex, you will see the differences and not give the new girl a chance (and she won't like you much either comparing her to someone else); but if you start anew, at least you are judging them solely on what they are and the experiences you have with them untainted with expectations or prejudice.

just have fun

[Pantelija]

Considering that co-founders of Bioware have left the industry as a whole it doesnt surprise me that the game has sunk so low