Thoughts on the new Warchief

[Grocalis]

The rest of your post isn't worth responding to based off from that alone. Have a nice day and enjoy wasting other people's time.

I don't need to waste anyone's time, you are doing a great enough job wasting everyone's time for us. But sure, go have a great day crying about how the big bad troll is now ruling you, I will go on actually enjoying the game.

[Doc Friday]

Holy crap, hahaha... Orcs Vs. Humans hasn't been around since WC1 when Games Workshop backed out on the work Blizzard did for 'em, but Blizzard released anyway. WC2 was Alliance Vs. Horde, even back then it's always been 'all these fantasy dudes vs. those fantasy dudes', so not exactly orcs vs. humans. WC3 was a clusterfuck Vs. a greater evil, not orcs Vs. humans again. Frozen Throne was simply a means to bridge into WoW, WoW vanilla was the aftermath of WC3/Frozen Throne, so more of a cold war deal. BC was vs. the greater threat, WotLK was against the greater threat and, Cata was just weird given Thrall went soft in the head for some reason. Where Medivh or whatever his name was at that point is beyond me.

It's got some interesting stuff, but beyond printing money, don't read too much into the Orcs Vs. Humans thing, it hasn't really been about that for a long ass time, honestly I'd love to see some face time with other dudes beyond orcs/trolls/humans/nelves, I'm getting tired of doing shit for those dudes, hahaha...

[Wildberry]

VOljin didn't let the Horde collapse at all? You're the one making up your own bullshit with respect to the story as its written. VOLJIN held the horde together against garrosh but orc fanbois like you don't see to get the Horde isn't just your stupid fucking Orcs any more. timing is important too. Voljin was biding his time.

Vol'jin was the figurehead of a rebellion waiting to assemble at a moments notice. Baine was the voice of reason, Baine was the one Challenging Garrosh's decisions, Baine was the one actually championing the cause of the Horde publicly, not Vol'jin. Also using the word fanboi's usually discredits your argument.

He was turning his back on garrosh to keep his people from being slaughtered and left out to rot by an asshat orc who thinks they are inferior. I know you orc fantards have serious hardons for your green garbage people so much so you fail to see them as the disgusting filth they are written as, you even pardon them and say they are misunderstood or were duped lmao. But really, enough. Lor'themar had a limit and Garrosh pushed him to it, Jaina's actions extended it.

There is so much ad-hom here based off from a fictional race that I happen to like, I honestly don't know where to begin...

funny an orc fanboi wants to talk about competency. Let's see, Thrall turns over the horde to the biggest fucktard they've had since the second war, and then said fucktard loses the allegiance of all component races. Tyrande is magnificently more competent than your orc homies, so shut up with your baseless bashing.

Night Elf Fanboy accusing others of incompetence? Let's see, Inviting the Burning Legion to Azeroth? Check. Trying to use the same source of energy that attracted the Legion just after a near apocolyptic situation? Check. Starting unchecked wars of aggression only to have their Demigod killed in the process? Check. Freeing a man who has betrayed your people, AND the people he worked for after betraying you, so he could betray you and betray the people he betrayed you for again? Check. Argue against a temporary Alliance to prevent the Burning Legion's near-inevitable ascent to Hyjal, just like you personally experienced in times past? Check.

Night Elves, confirmed for biggest fuck ups in history.

orcs vs. humans isn't why I started playing. I thought Orcs were typical barbarian retards and humans your typical crusading knights. Dumb as rocks and boring as shit. A lot of other people agree, since despite humans being the most played race they are still not a majority of the Alliance and Orcs are hardly a majority in the Horde. So Orcs vs Humans, maybe YOU like it, but you don't speak for everyone. Certainly not me or all the other people playing non-orcs and non-humans. And it's not simply an "idea" any more. Voljin is the WARCHIEF of your Horde. If you don't recgonise it, that doesn't change. Bow to your Troll master you orc turd. Lol

It might not be why you started playing, it is why most Old-school Warcraft fans started playing though.

Also there is nothing that is ground breakingly creative about Night Elves either.

Vol'jin might be Warchief of the Horde, for how long though? Things are always subject to change, Hellscream sure did (DAMN LOOK AT THAT 180!)
Might I ask you to take a knee, your High King demands some respect from you tree lovers.

[Bigbazz]

Looking back at the history it makes sense that it was Vol'jin, him and Thrall go way back and let's be honest it was Thrall who decided. See, the Horde leaders still saw Thrall as the real Warchief and they look to him and hes like "No thanks mate you can do it Vol'jin mate, I'l just sit back here and sip on some wine with my woman, gimme a shout if you need a hand"

Vol'jin put in da time and now he reaping da rewards mon.

[Doc Friday]

Vol'jin was the figurehead of a rebellion waiting to assemble at a moments notice. Baine was the voice of reason, Baine was the one Challenging Garrosh's decisions, Baine was the one actually championing the cause of the Horde publicly, not Vol'jin. Also using the word fanboi's usually discredits your argument.



There is so much ad-hom here based off from a fictional race that I happen to like, I honestly don't know where to begin...



Night Elf Fanboy accusing others of incompetence? Let's see, Inviting the Burning Legion to Azeroth? Check. Trying to use the same source of energy that attracted the Legion just after a near apocolyptic situation? Check. Starting unchecked wars of aggression only to have their Demigod killed in the process? Check. Freeing a man who has betrayed your people, AND the people he worked for after betraying you, so he could betray you and betray the people he betrayed you for again? Check. Argue against a temporary Alliance to prevent the Burning Legion's near-inevitable ascent to Hyjal, just like you personally experienced in times past? Check.

Night Elves, confirmed for biggest fuck ups in history.



It might not be why you started playing, it is why most Old-school Warcraft fans started playing though.

Also there is nothing that is ground breakingly creative about Night Elves either.

Vol'jin might be Warchief of the Horde, for how long though? Things are always subject to change, Hellscream sure did (DAMN LOOK AT THAT 180!)
Might I ask you to take a knee, your High King demands some respect from you tree lovers.

This pretty much, I can't disagree with most anything he said.

[LazarusLong]

We saw how Thrall's first choice turned out....

But seriously I'm kinda indifferent to Vol'jin. Hate his model with the bat ears tho. I have a feeling they chose him as he is more likely to have skirmishes with the Alliance than Baine or Thrall would after these events.

Personally Id like to see a complete end to the Horde vs Alliance storyline. All players shouldn't be considered full members of their faction as they are adventures and work with several factions and as such battles between them should be more like mercenaries fighting each other. All Old bgs should become caverns of time bgs and any new ones could be "hired out" by the horde and alliance to other factions.

To be fair, Garrosh wasn't first choice. Saurfang junior was.

[Asotcha]

To be fair, Garrosh wasn't first choice. Saurfang junior was.

It would be interesting to see a snippet of an alternate reality where he didnt get killed off in Icecrown and was able to become Warchief--really makes you think.

[Draelandria]

I am happy with Vol'jin as the new Warchief, I think the only other good option (my opinion) would have Been Theron. I find it hilarious that people are willing to faction transfer over a Troll Warchief. Is it that devastating to some that it would completely ruin everything else about the Horde to some? It makes me wonder if they really had "Faction Loyalty" in the first place. I'm sure Blizzard will be happy with all the money they will make from all the people getting mad and jumping ship to the Alliance.

[TheShinyOne]

Operating under that logic, wouldn't that make Vol'jin a bad decision?
Also when was Garrosh showing signs of absolute racism and the desire to start a full scale global conflict and use powers darker than demon blood to cement his victory? Because I'm pretty sure when Thrall left for Nagrand, he was just a hotheaded Orc with great pride, not just for the Orcs but the Horde as a whole, not to mention Thrall wasn't expecting Deathwing to Shatter Azeroth, nor was he expecting Cairne to challenge Garrosh and NOT advise him.

There were plenty of warning signs, and Thrall doesn't have an excuse for not paying very close attention to him if he was going to appoint him Warchief. There were plenty of other, much better options available than the disgruntled, hot-headed, rage-blind, racist, inexperienced Orc who was still new to the planet. If he had appointed a better candidate, Garrosh could have continued to have been groomed to be Warchief some day. If he had more time under Saurfang's wise guidance, who knows how things would have turned out?

Baine is inexperienced, sure, but, Baine also had ties to Anduin which would cement peace, not to mention he not only was the one speaking out against Garrosh the most, he also warned Jaina about the Horde's impending attack upon Theramore.

To be fair, I've never been able to take Baine seriously since Rexxar's campaign, so I'll admit I'm not being fair to his current character.

Lor'themar's only bad trait can be applied to Vol'jin twofold, he was going to jump ship, Vol'jin wanted to leave once Hellscream was put in charge, Thrall talked him out of it, he wanted to join the Zandalari in the novel, but realize the Zandalari were destined to fail, REAL LOYALTY right there! Either way, neither one left, I don't think it's entirely fair to count out Lor'thewho and not Vol'jin.

It doesn't matter if he wanted to leave in the past; what matters is what was done when it mattered most. Lor'whomar wanted to jump ship, Vol'jin took the hits and tried to fix the problem as much he could.

Also, the Zandalari might be trolls, but there's no racial kinship there, the Amani, Gurubashi, Farrakki, and Drakkari can barely tolerate one another, the Zandalari think themselves superior, he wasn't forced into a difficult decision.

Fair point, but it does demonstrate that he can look past race.

As far as knowing what is best for all the Horde and acting on it, even at great cost to himeslf? I do recall him staying silent while Baine and Sylvanas (of all people) were the only two voices of reason during the discussion about "Conquering Kalimdor".

No one's perfect? He can't have all of the screen time.

Blizzard didn't forget about Saurfang, he's in SoO, they just chose an uninteresting character.

They may as well have. Saurfang has great potential as a character to have a major impact, and he could have been written to be as heavily involved as the other racial leaders. I love the Darkspear, but I would have been equally happy with a fleshed out and relevant Warchief Saurfang as I am with the 'jin.

[Rocket Surgeon]

Thrall didn't "pass the mantle" to anyone. He just said "You've been a good leader, I'm cool with you taking over" and everyone else agreed.

[Static]

As a Horde, I'm totally fine with Vol'jin, being the new Warchief. Would've preferred Baine, but it's alright.

..I might be late to the party but, what's with this hatred towards Thrall? He probably made some wrong decisions in the past, but really, what's there to make people really dislike the guy? I could understand if it came from an Alliance player, but from a Horde? I don't think the Horde would exist united if it wasn't for Thrall, or am I wrong to think that?

[finskee]

I was hoping it would be Vol'jin for years now, Garrosh was just an obvious bad choice, Thrall finally got it right. The only thing character that would have been better for me was Cairne, I like Baine but he's too young. And to add I just hate the whole 'only an orc can be the warchief' argument it is so boring and last week. Don't worry orc lovers it doesn't castrate you and/or make you any less orcish. You can still run around grunting and smashing things. Lok'tar ogar.

[LazarusLong]

It would be interesting to see a snippet of an alternate reality where he didnt get killed off in Icecrown and was able to become Warchief--really makes you think.

I think it would still end in a civil war of sorts. Saurfang versus Hellscream.

[Doc Friday]

Come to think of it, I think it should have been Vol'jin after Thrall initially stepped down, that would have been alright, but now? Just awkward, I got the 'stale' vibe from him.

@Static: No, you're right, nothing would be as it is if it weren't for Thrall, it's just that it's been "Have a problem? Throw Thrall at it to make it go away!" which just results in lazy solutions. There's no tension because Thrall's literally Jesus now, so it takes the 'oh man, what now?' feeling out.

[announced]

its a good idea putting Vol'jin in charge, he on good terms with Sylvanas, Lor'themar, Baine, and hes ok with the alliance. Vol'jin has all the makings of a great leader, hes smart, cautious, honorable, and he isnt egotistical. He knows his strengths and weaknesses. So what if he is a troll? The orc vs human argument is such bullshit all the orc fanboys can go cry in a corner or something. Who cares.

[Zulkhan]

I'm Horde, and, obviously, I like it.

I understand orc fans being all upset, but seriously, all that you can do for delude yourselves that this wasn't the predictable outcome is just twist arguments endlessly, but with little ground beneath their feet.

Giving the title to an orc just because, you know, we always need a damn orc as Warchief, would have been pointless, and the only orc with enough development and involvement was Thrall. Yeah, Thrall, the same orc that understood all by himself that, in the end, he wasn't fit to lead the Horde, and you know which is the painful reality? It's the truth.

Thrall is an orc raised by humans and have a "human mentality" in dealing with a lot of matters, like his desperate attempt in achieving peace between the Alliance and the Horde, the kind of attitude that made many orcs lose faith in him, because only him in almost the entire Horde shared the same way of reasoning. He was respected for his wisdom, but excatly because Thrall was the Warchief understood that his "supposed wisdom" (as Thrall himself called it) alone wasn't enough, and in the end wasn't excatly what the Horde needed.

Thrall is a kind of character that fits a lot better as protector of Azeroth, not leader of the Horde, because he's a "hero of two worlds" and having such a character tied to the Horde in such a strong manner would be simply wrong, he's simply beyond that at this point, and all his trial to become the World Shaman, nothing happened to clear his doubts about his role as Warchief, meaning that still he had those doubts and still thought everything he thought in the Shattering, and the cinematic blatantly proved that. Vol'jin didn't took the title, he called for Thrall but Thrall refused it, excatly like I expected and as anyone understanding a bit his character would have expected aswell.

Vol'jin shares the same ideals but is a very different person from Thrall, reason for which Thrall fits as world savior, while everything involving Vol'jin proved nothing but how fitting he was as leader of the Horde. I had some doubts about it, but when I read Shadows of the Horde, became obvious that he was the right man for the job.

Orcs will not become pitful underdogs, it's just, on the contrary, a golden opportunity for swallow their pride and understanding that they can be proud of themselves and be a force to be reckoned with even without an Orc as leader of the Horde, which will finally put down, once and for all, any kind of retarded sentiments of "Orc supremacy" that could still linger somewhere in their minds.

Well, nice shot Chieftain. Ops, I mean, Warchief.

[Trassk]

I'm Horde, and, obviously, I like it.

I understand orc fans being all upset, but seriously, all that you can do for delude yourselves that this wasn't the predictable outcome is just twist arguments endlessly, but with little ground beneath their feet.

Giving the title to an orc just because, you know, we always need a damn orc as Warchief, would have been pointless, and the only orc with enough development and involvement was Thrall. Yeah, Thrall, the same orc that understood all by himself that, in the end, he wasn't fit to lead the Horde, and you know which is the painful reality? It's the truth.

Thrall is an orc raised by humans and have a "human mentality" in dealing with a lot of matters, like his desperate attempt in achieving peace between the Alliance and the Horde, the kind of attitude that made many orcs lose faith in him, because only him in almost the entire Horde shared the same way of reasoning. He was respected for his wisdom, but excatly because Thrall was the Warchief understood that his "supposed wisdom" (as Thrall himself called it) alone wasn't enough, and in the end wasn't excatly what the Horde needed.

Thrall is a kind of character that fits a lot better as protector of Azeroth, not leader of the Horde, because he's a "hero of two worlds" and having such a character tied to the Horde in such a strong manner would be simply wrong, he's simply beyond that at this point, and all his trial to become the World Shaman, nothing happened to clear his doubts about his role as Warchief, meaning that still he had those doubts and still thought everything he thought in the Shattering, and the cinematic blatantly proved that. Vol'jin didn't took the title, he called for Thrall but Thrall refused it, excatly like I expected and as anyone understanding a bit his character would have expected aswell.

Vol'jin shares the same ideals but is a very different person from Thrall, reason for which Thrall fits as world savior, while everything involving Vol'jin proved nothing but how fitting he was as leader of the Horde. I had some doubts about it, but when I read Shadows of the Horde, became obvious that he was the right man for the job.

Orcs will not become pitful underdogs, it's just, on the contrary, a golden opportunity for swallow their pride and understanding that they can be proud of themselves and be a force to be reckoned with even without an Orc as leader of the Horde, which will finally put down, once and for all, any kind of retarded sentiments of "Orc supremacy" that could still linger somewhere in their minds.

Well, nice shot Chieftain. Ops, I mean, Warchief.

You want to make an argument about pride, i say you should eat it. Don't patronize orc fans who have loved the orcs story in warcraft for years, just to see there favorite race yet anally raped by this story.

This whole plot turned from a story where everyone was meant to learn a lesson about the negative emotions we have.. to being it that only orcs are the ones who don't understand it, and there pride being a danger.

And yet, we see at the end of all this, human pride coming out of Varians ass, and trolls are now filled with pride in having there leader as leader of the horde.

So, pride, as something that anyone else can have and it not an issue, but if orcs have it, it is bad?

Yeah, you can shove that message. The orcs have been reduced to a lesser role in the horde because of all this.

For me, this was warcraft:



but not anymore, just replace the orc with a troll and thats what warcraft is.

[Avar ize]

He has been one of my favorite characters since I played WC3 all those years ago, I'm happy to see him get this great role!

he goes like "ya man" and turns you into spirit beasts.. and from that he was your favorite character? wat?

[dirk123]

Vol'jin Warchief? The same guy that sat his lazy ass out due to "injuries" while I went on quests to obtain the Divine Bell and all this other shit while he sent mail: "I'll let you handle this one, II need me rest" Useless prick. If there's no glory given back to the Orcs that didn't blindly follow Garrosh then Alliance will be my faction of choice.

Vol'jin who was wounded. Whom according to his book only noticed the blade that injured him had poison on it AFTER the adventurers leave him in that Saurok cave. Not to mention that the Loa, Bwonsambi (or however you spell his name), deliberately disabled the regeneration powers of Vol'jin (which he grants to trolls who make sacrifices etc for him). Which made Vol'jin recover extremely slowly at the Shado-Pan monastary. Only later in the book does Bwonsambi return his blessing to Vol'jin.

I know Blizz shouldn't force people to buy the novels if you want to know the full story, but ridiculing characters when not knowing the full picture is foolish as well. You could have read the wowpedia page at least if you didn't read the book.

[Trassk]

Vol'jin who was wounded. Whom according to his book only noticed the blade that injured him had poison on it AFTER the adventurers leave him in that Saurok cave. Not to mention that the Loa, Bwonsambi (or however you spell his name), deliberately disabled the regeneration powers of Vol'jin (which he grants to trolls who make sacrifices etc for him). Which made Vol'jin recover extremely slowly at the Shado-Pan monastary. Only later in the book does Bwonsambi return his blessing to Vol'jin.

I know Blizz shouldn't force people to buy the novels if you want to know the full story, but ridiculing characters when not knowing the full picture is foolish as well. You could have read the wowpedia page at least if you didn't read the book.

oh you mean that novel that force feed us a script for a character as there reason for him becoming warcraft, even against all reason, despite said character doing nothing for years beforehand.
yeah, that character, the one nobody remembered or cared about for years, and once blizzard threw him at this community, people reaction being 'oh hey yeah I remember him, well thats new, and I like new things, so I'll follow that'.

there are no principles in this community. people are just shallow.