Thoughts on the new Warchief

[Aurabolt]

...Since Trassk is one of the few people who isn't constantly using bad English/grammar I can actually read his posts.

Having said that, what little we know about the next expansion (whose name I assume will be announced at BlizzCon) is Alleria and Turalyon will return or at the very least be directly referenced. What Varian didn't say to Alliance Players after Garrosh is downed is what I find the most telling:



He took the other Horde capitals (TB, Echo Isle and Azshara) on Kalimdor off the table even though it's pretty obvious the Horde wouldn't have been able to put up much resistence after having thrown everything at removing Garrosh from power. Wrathion's reaction to Varian's decison to not escalate hostilities right then and there confirms Varian wanted to avoid a repeat of what Lordaron did with the Orcs after the Second War. Having been used as a Gladiator himself I don't see him as the kind of guy to do that to the Horde even though no one would blame him if he did.

Now, going back to the New Warchief, Gilneas and The Undercity/Lordaron:

If not for Godfrey's Treachery The Forsaken would've taken Gilneas. The Forsaken withdrew so Sylvanas could recover and to deal with Godfrey directly (I prefer to believe the Horde version of SFK is canon since the assassination attempt is more personal for the Horde than Bloodfang settling the score). After dealing with him The Forsaken shifted their focus to expanding their territory into the Former Plaguelands. Sylvanas was explicitly banned from using The New Plague (which didn't stop her from using it in Gilneas and Hillsbrad) so she used her other trump card--the Val'kyr--to win Andorhal for the Horde.

I doubt Darion Mograine and the Argent Crusade will stay neutral much longer, either. The Crusade has been busy mopping up what's left of the Scarlet Crusade and the Cult of the Damned/Scourge while the Ebon Blade would likely consider Kolitra a hostage and not an enemy combatant. Varian said the next move is containing the Forsaken (which you can be sure will make Genn a very happy Worgen King). He said contain, not defeat which means he at least knows Sylvanas has Val'kyr under her control.

Since Lordaeron and Gilneas will likely be the next big battlegrounds in the Alliance/Horde Conflict I'm expecting Genn to take point with support from the Night Elves and maybe the Wildhammer Dwarves (Aerie Peak is nearby). Stormwind would play a support role since the Gilneans know the area best. Sylvanas would take point for the Horde obviously with support from Silvermoon and maybe the Revantusk Tribe. Since Vol'Jin is the new Warchief he's kinda forced to stay in Durotar until things get organized though he'll definitely be involved somehow.

Thus, Genn v. Sylvanas Round 2 will soon begin.

As for how Vol'Jin as Warchief effects the Horde, I don't expect any objections from the other member races except maybe The Forsaken and the Orcs who sided with Garrosh (most of whom were wiped out during the Seige of Orgrimmar). Thrall is the "new" Warchief of the Orcs. Much doesn't need to be said in that regard in terms of his qualifications. He's probably the only one capable of rallying the Orcs post-Garrosh around the new Warchief, who for the first time is not an Orc himself. Thrall has his work cut out for him convincing the young and impressionable orcs who treated Garrosh like a rock star his way was not only wrong but the Orcs are better than that.

No different from when Thrall first became Warchief when you think about it.

[Trassk]

How exactly was this expansion spitting in the face of Horde-fans? (Or Orc-fans)

If you honestly have to ask that question, that you don't know, then there is nothing anyone can debate with you. Orcs have been shit on by the devs though mists, subtley at first, but as the story escalated, it deteriorated everything the orcs past development meant, and now..

Actually, nah, not worthy carrying on, your just some guy whos going to take everything said here and try to undermine it.

[Triggered Fridgekin]

He'll be Warchief until the release of the 5.5 interim patch at which point he'll become corrupt by an Old God because, hey, why not.

Old Gods for everyone!

[Arrashi]

Oh, I know that, but if Arrashi isn't, that'll just put me in stitches.

AND completely dispell everyone's counter argument of "Only super hardcore Orc fans hate Warchief Vol'jin"

Well, where to start, im not really super hardcore orc fan tho i like them quite a bit (my 3rd fav horde race after belves and UD) and have one rusty dusty orc death knight.

Second on topic of garrosh, i really think that its cringe worthy how they mishandled his character/story arc. There could be so many possible outcomes, clash of generations within the orc society, with thrall and older, more shamanistic part of orcs being put against more industrial, younger and progressive orc generation represented by garrosh. They could went with "horde teach garrosh, garrosh teach horde" approach and really made many cool things with his character.

With garrosh going "full retard" in MoP and all lore about him being forced as hell, it doesnt take orc fan to see that the story is bad. Its very obvious that him (and sadly with him like 90% of orc society with nazgrim and zaela on front) gets sacreficed for sake of.. what exactly ? So alliance can be happy about sieging horde city ? Read comments on these forums and you will see that it was huge failure, yet damage to story have been dealt. I don't mind garrosh being antagonized, or hell even *dying* if it makes sense and provides good story. What blizzard did in MoP isnt neither.

As for Vol'jin. There are many things I (and i guess many other people) value about characters. Personality, charisma, cool look/esthetics, interesting background story, and relevance to current plot. Vol'jin have nothing of that. He became leader of darkspears only because his father was one (on side note its funny how people point that thrall made garrosh warchief only because his father, while both baine and vol'jin and leaders only because of that, and hell noone even choose them), and was character with no importance to plot.

He changed rexxar to wyvern so he can protect his people while vol'jin does nothing. He gave you ONE quest in pre cata wchich would send you do desolace i think, and opened keg during brewfest. He was watching over sylvanas and thrall mounts during siege of UC (heroic it was !!!) and wasnt even able to defeat one deranged witch doctor without army of mercenaries and backup of loa of death.
Then he menaged to rant about garrosh (wchich gave him 95% of fans he have now) just to get told by thrall to calm the fuck down. He was able to tell other troll tribes to kiss his ass, and actively worked AGAINST them (what a man !!!). He was also bitching like a ex girlfriend in 5.1 questline, get stabbed, and rest i guess you guys are too familiar with. He also got pretty bad book.

So on finale, its doesnt take orc fan (or troll/horde hater) to see that vol'jin is bad and boring character undeserving position of faction leader. Also the moment in cinematic where thrall is buttering him, while other horde leaders bow to him, is fucking cringeworthy.

[LilSaihah]

Where's the "I AM EXTREMELY INDIFFERENT" option? Honestly I don't care all that much. The Warchief position doesn't really increase how much screentime you get unless you're a villain.

Vol'jin's basically Thrall2.0 so who really cares? You've got Thrall except he has a funny accent, blue skin and back problems.

[Clone]

Then he menaged to rant about garrosh (wchich gave him 95% of fans he have now) just to get told by thrall to calm the fuck down.

This! I am astounded by how so many people fail to see this.

To further help some other posters' case, I am not even an orc fan and I dislike Vol'jin as warchief. I don't believe that the Horde's warchief has to be an orc, and I still dislike Vol'jin as warchief.

At the end of the day, Alliance whine and Horde story gets shafted.

[Trassk]

This! I am astounded by how so many people fail to see this.

To further help some other posters' case, I am not even an orc fan and I dislike Vol'jin as warchief. I don't believe that the Horde's warchief has to be an orc, and I still dislike Vol'jin as warchief.

At the end of the day, Alliance whine and Horde story gets shafted.

pretty much. for all the alliance whining and bitching, they came out on top, with a better structure, stronger faction, and now the horde having a warchief thats the worst possible option it could gave.

[bayushisan]

pretty much. for all the alliance whining and bitching, they came out on top, with a better structure, stronger faction, and now the horde having a warchief thats the worst possible option it could gave.

You know I really didn't want it to come to this, because I'm not a big fan of hyperbole; but with all this talk about how Orcs should be the centerpiece of the Horde's story in WoW it would seem to imply a belief in some that Orcs are in some way a superior race in regards to the other Horde races.

Hmmmm Orcs as the most important race, smug sense of superiority, overwhelming pride blinding them to any other ideas. Where have I seen that before? Oh yeah. Garrosh.

[Deleted]

How exactly was this expansion spitting in the face of Horde-fans? (Or Orc-fans)

Because Orcs are made into villains and playing an Orc yourself doesn't make sense anymore. As a roleplayer my character would logically side with Garrosh, however that is not a possibility. Blizzard has alienated a good portion of their fanbase with this move.

Besides, Orcs are one of the two core races of the franchise. How did they honestly think it would be a good idea to wipe out the majority of them? Killing Orgrimmar NPCs and such. It's quite a slap in the face if you're an Orc player imo. Everything you liked is taken from you.

This is just as horrible as when the Orc shoulderplates size was bugged. Many people I know just didn't like logging in their Orc characters anymore. I've actually seen raids cancelled because Orc players simply wouldn't log in. These things just alienate people.

[Agartha]

Because Orcs are made into villains and playing an Orc yourself doesn't make sense anymore. As a roleplayer my character would logically side with Garrosh, however that is not a possibility. Blizzard has alienated a good portion of their fanbase with this move.

Besides, Orcs are one of the two core races of the franchise. How did they honestly think it would be a good idea to wipe out the majority of them? Killing Orgrimmar NPCs and such. It's quite a slap in the face if you're an Orc player imo. Everything you liked is taken from you.

This is just as horrible as when the Orc shoulderplates size was bugged. Many people I know just didn't like logging in their Orc characters anymore. I've actually seen raids cancelled because Orc players simply wouldn't log in. These things just alienate people.

If you think orc roleplayers who actually care about the story are a majority of the playerbase you're fucking delusional.

[Trassk]

If you think orc roleplayers who actually care about the story are a majority of the playerbase you're fucking delusional.

because you know every roleplayer don't you? Think you got the delusional arrow the wrong way around.

[docterfreeze]

Well, the bright side is that vol'jin doesn't have love for humans like thrall. Vol'jin knows who the enemy is, while thrall is bi-factual.

Yes I made that word up.

[Absintheminded]

Just because it's legitimate doesn't mean the players have to like it. Trolls are an inferior race, and don't deserve to be over the whole Horde. It'd be like a dwarf or draenei being the main leader of the Alliance. I don't even play Alliance, and that still wouldn't sit well with me.

Trolls are the oldest race on Azeroth, suck it Trabek.

[Mormolyce]

Boy this didn't take long.

I agree it's a shake-up to have a non-Orc Warchief, but Trolls are probably the longest-running non-Orc member of the Horde (even had an equivalent in the Old Horde). They shared Orgrimmar as a capital until Cataclysm as well (a "companion race" like Dwarves and Gnomes used to be). Plus Vol'Jin is a founding member of the New Horde. So of all the non-Orc candidates I think this is the least controversial.

Also, I've really enjoyed the character they've finally given him, so I'm really happy for him.

Vol'jin Warchief? The same guy that sat his lazy ass out due to "injuries" while I went on quests to obtain the Divine Bell and all this other shit while he sent mail: "I'll let you handle this one, II need me rest" Useless prick. If there's no glory given back to the Orcs that didn't blindly follow Garrosh then Alliance will be my faction of choice.

Well he could've just done it all himself off-screen. But you know, it's a game, obviously we have to do everything and lore characters need an excuse for relying on nameless "adventurers" all the time.

[Ilir]

Well he just speaks for the horde, he's not a real warchief.

[Torgent]

I don't hate Vol'jin. But they made the most obvious and lame choice they could make.

Not impressed at all,was expecting something more interesting.

Why do people assume that the obvious choice is a bad one? He was the obvious choice for a reason....he's the most qualified.

[Mormolyce]

Because Orcs are made into villains and playing an Orc yourself doesn't make sense anymore. As a roleplayer my character would logically side with Garrosh, however that is not a possibility. Blizzard has alienated a good portion of their fanbase with this move.

What the hell are you talking about? Both my Orc characters are passionate Thrall loyalists who despised what Garrosh did to the Horde. For bonus points: that is the position of all playable Orcs.

Did it no longer make sense to be a Human because Arthas became a villain in Warcraft III? Hell I played the fucker for the whole Human campaign!

[eldritchforeshadow]

Vol'jin is awesome, love it and was not surprised he was picked as new Warchief.

[Mormolyce]

Well he just speaks for the horde, he's not a real warchief.

Yeesh.

That's a figure of speech, he is the Warchief. Thrall even says "if you lead, I will follow".

[Lemons]

I think it's dumb how the horde has like zero democratic process. It's basically Thrall being like "dude, you did good at this rebellion shit, you're the next warchief bro." And all the other leaders are just like "eh, whatevs".

Also, I lost ALL respect for Vol'jin after his "we'll come in and clean up after the fighting is done if you don't help us" speech...it just reminded me of something a 7 year old would say to try to win an argument. It's basically like saying "hey, who here knows secret ninja moves they learned from the government!?" It's that level of mouth-breathing bravado.