Welfare Legendary

[Otimus]

What is "legendary" about an item if everyone has it (or can have it)?

What's epic about an item if everyone has it :x
What's Rare about an item if everyone has it :x
What's Uncommon about an item if everyone has it :x

- - - Updated - - -

If someone leveled a new character to 90, and decided he wanted a legendary cloak, there is no way they would have it "the first day of 5.4" it takes over a month, if not multiple months, to get your cloak. How is this not the same as past legendaries? Just because it was built up over the whole expansion, making it feel like you really worked towards something, doesn't mean it isn't "as legendary" as others. I don't understand how this is a welfare legendary, when it has one of the most epic and engaging story lines WoW has had in awhile.

Because people can get it from doing LFR, pretty much, is their problem. Which is just silly and bigoted of them, mostly!

I bet even if it had an ULTRA difficult segment in it, they'd still complain because of LFR, and ignore that. Because that's what these people are.

(They'd also probably complain if it was Heroic only!)

[Smeeh]

Because, for the millionth time, you don't need a pulse to get the Cloak because you can get most of it done in LFR.

Other Legendaries had you be a part of a guild running regular raids which are already harder than anything in this Cloak quest chain.
Not only that but you had to win over the vote of your GM or Guild to be selected for it, requiring more dedication most likely.

It's a welfare Legendary, get over it.

Or you know you could make a pug every week, like a lot of people did.

[Amsden]

If I write a label of the word orange, and put it on an apple , it does not make an apple an orange. It is still an apple.

Very much the same as this 'legendary'. You can label it legendary all you want, but the amount of them, the ease of attaining, and the fact all 10-25 people in a raid group can have it with ease make it from 'legendary'.

Blizz doesn't get to say what is and is not an apple, however they do have that authority when it comes to the items in their game. All they are is the tier above epic, nothing more. Some of you people put way to much weight in the word "legendary".

[Thatwsntmilk]

What's epic about an item if everyone has it :x
What's Rare about an item if everyone has it :x
What's Uncommon about an item if everyone has it :x

So uncommon means the same as legendary? Cool stuff.

[Gilgemesh]

"I want an item only I can get because it makes me feel special."
News flash. You still aren't special. You are human. We are not unique. Enjoy the things that matter to you and take your damn eyes off what everyone else gets. This is how to be happy.

[Thatwsntmilk]

"I want an item only I can get because it makes me feel special."
News flash. You still aren't special. You are human. We are not unique. Enjoy the things that matter to you and take your damn eyes off what everyone else gets. This is how to be happy.

If everyone can have it, it also means that it is less challenging for ME to obtain it so it has a big influence on my personal experience.

[BEYR]

If everyone can have it, it also means that it is less challenging for ME to obtain it so it has a big influence on my personal experience.

Not really. Literally every subscriber in the history of WoW can have every piece of equipment in the game. It is exactly as difficult for every single player to get. You, personally, don't have it any harder or easier than any other player to acquire that legendary. There is a set level of difficulty to get it, just like every other legendary. What you are complaining about is the fact that you are not the only one on your server showing off your shiny orange title.

[Otimus]

So uncommon means the same as legendary? Cool stuff.

I think you missed my point :x They're just words and colors that signify the rarity of an item and it's power, in comparison to other items. i.e. There's a pile of uncommon items, a lot of rare items, a big stash of epic items, and not too many legendary items. Even if it's a legendary "everyone has" (Which they don't and won't, but that's not the issue here), it's still probably, for most people, the only legendary they have :x Which still, in terms of items in the game, pretty damned rare, in a sea of purps, blues, and greens.

[dmfg]

I quite like how this legendary was handled actually.

From a lore point of view - it's given to you by Wrathion, who is already known to be a devious, manipulative double dealer trying to play both sides at the same time. He is already telling both Alliance and Horde that they are his chosen side, and it makes perfect sense that he would try to buy as many heroes into doing his bidding at possible by telling all of them exactly what they want to hear - that they are special and unique, and that they are the only ones he has chosen to bestow his gifts on.

Whereas in fact, he is slowly and secretly buying out heroes on both sides. When his master plan kicks into action, will we stay loyal to our faction leaders, or be tempted into following Wrathion?

[Gilgemesh]

If everyone can have it, it also means that it is less challenging for ME to obtain it so it has a big influence on my personal experience.

Every person can get every available item in the game minus select one-time things, like the aq mount and that neckpiece. The fact that one item might have been more time consuming, or logistically more taxing makes no difference IF the person considers their new item worth less simply because someone else already has it. This is that comparitive attitude I just mentioned. If one cannot be happy with an item simply because someone else can also get it the same way you did, then no item will ever fit the bill, as everyone can still get those items too. This is bad logic. If you need to feel you worked harder than everyone else to get your item, then work harder than everyone else to get the item. Video yourself working harder, put it on youtube, then show off your work. This probably will do no good, as you've already decided to be unhappy about the situation because you were too busy watching everyone's items and not enjoying what is yours.

The only person we can use for personal improvement is our own self. If you play, and get better, and improve your toons...guess what??? you've totally played the game to its fullest.

[RickJamesLich]

Because, for the millionth time, you don't need a pulse to get the Cloak because you can get most of it done in LFR.

Other Legendaries had you be a part of a guild running regular raids which are already harder than anything in this Cloak quest chain.
Not only that but you had to win over the vote of your GM or Guild to be selected for it, requiring more dedication most likely.

It's a welfare Legendary, get over it.

Yeah, essentially, the fact that this thing is obtainable via LFR is what tarnished it I think for most. When the guys that would typically always wipe your raid and couldn't cut it on the roster end up getting legendaries, you know something in the game is way way off lol. Personally for me, I got one of the wind bindings the other day in MC, it felt like a bigger accomplishment lol.

[Thatwsntmilk]

Not really. Literally every subscriber in the history of WoW can have every piece of equipment in the game. It is exactly as difficult for every single player to get. You, personally, don't have it any harder or easier than any other player to acquire that legendary. There is a set level of difficulty to get it, just like every other legendary. What you are complaining about is the fact that you are not the only one on your server showing off your shiny orange title.

Example: Val'anyr: only few per guild/server could get it because it took a certain amount of time/raids to get it => harder to obtain for me because I need to have proven that I am worth it to my guild.

[AeneasBK]

Example: Val'anyr: only few per guild/server could get it because it took a certain amount of time/raids to get it => harder to obtain for me because I need to have proven that I am worth it to my guild.

And those people who got it overcame exactly the same amount of difficulty as other people faced in getting it...

[HeedmySpeed]

An entire expansion worth of grinding doesn't show any dedication to the cause? Other legendaries were mostly drops (either the item itself or the needed components) that required nothing more than looting the item. It was RNG. In most cases, yes the GM had control of who it went to (or ninja'd it) but that doesn't make any part of obtaining it difficult. Hell, I set foot in MC twice while it was current, neither time as part of a guild and almost got the left binding in a roll because nobody needed it. I think you officially have rose-tinted snowflakes falling in your eyes.

It shows dedication for sure but far from doing a regular raids and dealing wit icky-poopy-meanie schedules.
You showed a modicum of dedication.

And again, it's like you guys have amnesia or something but you keep forgetting you still had to raid normally for those same inane boss farming quests.

I didn't play WoW back in Vanilla or TBC but it doesn't take much brain power to see how Legendaries functioned what with DKP, 40 man raids, tiered raiding system and all that entails.
Today you don't compete for resources and raiding is a joke with LFR.

Really I don't know what this has to do with nostalgia or the "snowflake" insult but clearly you don't know when those terms are applicable. Keep tunneling.

[Deleted]

Use of the term welfare implies that there are others putting in time and effort to help someone else have it. This was the case for the older legendary's. Now the sole responsibility is on the person who wants it so it's not really welfare, is it?

- - - Updated - - -

It shows dedication for sure but far from doing a regular raids and dealing wit icky-poopy-meanie schedules.
You showed a modicum of dedication.

Or, on the flip-side, it shows great greediness as you are forcing other people to help you get an item only you can use. Now, its down to personal responsibility (across a whole xpac and not just one patch cycle) to put the time in to do it.

[purebalance]

Use of the term welfare implies that there are others putting in time and effort to help someone else have it. This was the case for the older legendary's. Now the sole responsibility is on the person who wants it so it's not really welfare, is it?

- - - Updated - - -



Or, on the flip-side, it shows great greediness as you are forcing other people to help you get an item only you can use. Now, its down to personal responsibility (across a whole xpac and not just one patch cycle) to put the time in to do it.

IT always required personal dedication.

Go read how to get warglaives the first day they were available that I posted in this thread. You had to do personal work all the way through to be able to get foot in BT. It took more "work" to get into BT day 1 than it did to get this silly welfare cloak.

[Deleted]

IT always required personal dedication.

Go read how to get warglaives the first day they were available that I posted in this thread. You had to do personal work all the way through to be able to get foot in BT. It took more "work" to get into BT day 1 than it did to get this silly welfare cloak.

That's not my argument - I'm just pointing out that the use of the word 'welfare' is incorrect.

[purebalance]

Also to those claiming that past legendaries were popularity contests, you were in a horrible guild then I'm sorry.

Every legendary to date in guilds I was in was either A) DKP or B) judging by dps, survival in raids, and attendance. There was never a question as to whether the right person was chosen for them in situations I've been in. I was the first choice hands down when we started on DW even though I had just blown my wad of dkp. Not a single person questioned it. I showed up to every raid. I took personal accountability for my survival. I always helped out with fixing something we were messing up on even though I was not an O. I'm sorry the rest of you were in terrible guilds who awarded the wrong person a legendary. Hell officers and GMs often DO deserve they for the on the side work they do. It might not be the best for the guild if they aren't the top dps, but they do a lot more than peon joe in the raid.

- - - Updated - - -

That's not my argument - I'm just pointing out that the use of the word 'welfare' is incorrect.

It's very correct. Everyone can get it and you can get it with minimal work compared to past legendaries. That part has already been laid out. Also already proven that past legendaries required more work.

The only other thing left to prove is the silly "you can get carried" to older ones, but let's be frank and say that is a lie since your guild can tell if they were carrying you and wouldn't award you one.

This legendary is in fact welfare.

[purebalance]

No, your guild had to work all the way through to be able to kill Illidan.

And is "getting a cloak on the first day" such a problem?

To be able to get into BT the player needed to have done about 50ish or more max level group quests that were semi hard even with a group. Don't kid yourself thinking that in BC your guild did all the work

- - - Updated - - -

Let's lay out the current legendary and keep in mind you had rewards all along the way.

First series had NO extra work that you weren't already doing: Getting honored with wrathion would have happened if you were working on your other factions and all of the sigils etc just dropped by raiding which you were doing. So Sha touched gems were freebies. 0 work. Just pick up the quests and do what you would have done.

Second series: only "extra work" was win 2 battlegrounds and kill an elite. Still minimal work. You get an extra weapon socket for that.

Third series: only extra work was to help wrathion at the forge. anything else you were already doing. You get a meta gem for this.

Fourth series: Celestial challenge. You get an ilvl 600 cloak for this.

Final series: Collect some timeless coins which you might or might not already be doing but hey we'll say you weren't.

Soooo we have win 2 battlegrounds, kill an elite, help wrathion at the forge, complete celestial challenge, and get some timeless coins and that gets you a sha touched gem, a prismatic socket for a weapon, a meta gem, an ilvl 600 cloak, and then ultimately your legendary cloak.

Yeah no this definitely wasn't a welfare epic..... yes it most certainly is. At least the rogue daggers had you go out for some challenging fights. At least DW changed things for the raids and gave an extra boss and a difficult scenario to solo. At least Shadowmourne challenged your raid when you were on the part with the wing bosses and even the part to get the hammer was harder than most of what I listed. At least Valanyr required you to do heroic mode yogg saron. At least Thoridol was in what is considered the hardest wow raid ever. At least getting glaives when they came out required a lot of personal work OUTSIDE of raiding.

[HeedmySpeed]

Or, on the flip-side, it shows great greediness as you are forcing other people to help you get an item only you can use. Now, its down to personal responsibility (across a whole xpac and not just one patch cycle) to put the time in to do it.

Except its not "force" because it's in the guild's best interest to obtain the Legendary for progression.

Personal responsibility is nice but it undermines the 'multiplayer' portion of the game. So it's good to have once in a while but never fully.
And now that it's all on personal responsibility you make every player feel obligated to work for the Legendary as it's so easy to obtain that it will hinder progression if you don't.

So really it's the same problem as before by making players "forced to get you an item."
You'll still making everyone put in work.