Why don't they return to the roots of the game in difficulty?

[vesseblah]

To be fair, those long attunements usually weeded out many bad players

Wrong

Attunements were forced guild activity because those required raiding, it was never about individual player ability. What it did was causing guild and server drama when attuned people were poached and hopped into higher tier guilds. That unnecessary drama is the one and only reason why those were scrapped and will never ever come again into WoW.

[Kezotar]

Thing is guys.. The game was never really hard. Players were just bad, similiar to the casuals of today, just worse. Of course we had some of the hardcore elitists, but that's about it, the game wasn't harder. I mean backpeddaling people, melee striking, facing away from the monsters, healers not healing properly, hunters having taunt on their pet. Let's not talk about how much didn't bother to repair their gear or w/e reason. Players were new to the game.

[RickJamesLich]

Wrong

Attunements were forced guild activity because those required raiding, it was never about individual player ability. What it did was causing guild and server drama when attuned people were poached and hopped into higher tier guilds. That unnecessary drama is the one and only reason why those were scrapped and will never ever come again into WoW.

I'm just speaking from my own experience, but the attunements generally meant the person had a clue what they were doing, so they wouldn't be a complete dud. If you're referring to BC attunements, then yeah, I'm glad those things are gone. Nothing wrong with the MC or Onyxia ones tho.

[Osmeric]

Those players are just as bad as all those hardcores complaining that "LFR takes their fun out of the game" and Blizzard shouldn't listen to either of them.

The logic of your argument escapes me. Why is it that if players are "bad" in that respect, that Blizzard shouldn't listen to them? When players leave the game, they get to decide why they left; Blizzard doesn't get to define their reasons as acceptable or unacceptable.

[vesseblah]

Nothing wrong with the MC or Onyxia ones tho.

MC attunement was usually done in 10 minutes with somebody showing the shortcut through lava, and Onyxia attunement was just annoying. Alliance side had the 'fun' of doing BRD jail for fucking three times and trying to get a group for those, horde side had it even worse.

[RickJamesLich]

MC attunement was usually done in 10 minutes with somebody showing the shortcut through lava, and Onyxia attunement was just annoying. Alliance side had the 'fun' of doing BRD jail for fucking three times and trying to get a group for those, horde side had it even worse.

Yet there's people saying attunements are hard lol, and yes it did take 10 minutes. Onyxia one was an epic trip around the world for horde, when you did a quest, and you know, it felt like a quest? Bring that stuff back.

[Cows For Life]

I'm just speaking from my own experience, but the attunements generally meant the person had a clue what they were doing, so they wouldn't be a complete dud. If you're referring to BC attunements, then yeah, I'm glad those things are gone. Nothing wrong with the MC or Onyxia ones tho.

There was plenty wrong with the Onyxia attunements.

[RickJamesLich]

There was plenty wrong with the Onyxia attunements.

Because it required effort?

[hrugner]

I liked doing prison runs. Marshal Windsor was a bad ass.

[Deleted]

-Nor was it hard and difficult, it was nothing compared to the difficulty in modern hard modes, etc.
-Raiding became the most popular part of the game as soon as they allowed people to raid (tbc), they couldn't take it away from them in WotLK. Those people wanted more!

I hate the "hardmode" argument. Thats not new content and its simply not rewarding enough recieving epics with diferent colors from the ones everyone already have. Its so much hardcore with so little reward...i just dont get it. And most of them are just the same bosses with improved stats, unlike Ulduar with totally new mechanics and rewards.

-To many people the true experience is still in all those things.

What things? The thing i said were completely EXTINCT? How can people experience what doesnt exist -_- wich one were u talking about:
"the social experience", "leveling", "group quests", "meeting stones", "road/paths to raids", "reputation farm zones" or "world events"

-You are acting as if people don't participate in "world events" because they removed them, but they removed them because people didn't participate unless it gave them upgrades.
That last point is the most important one!
People would just skip group-quests or invite some dude that was 5-10 levels higher.
"World events" were either abandoned or became a grievers' paradise.
One of the best examples would be Alterac Valley: Players don't even bother playing the map, they just want to rush as fast as possible and get the reward.
Blizzard didn't cause this change, the playerbase did.

I think people dont just fight for rewards. Its proven that cosmetic, funny items and mounts are more than enough to remove peoples ass from the main city to the world.
Gurubashi arena and Dire maul are sooooo old and you can still find people there from time to time. I dont think world events are as bad as you imply. Darkmoon fair is always fun, at least for me. I didnt even referenced the "world boss" topic...that thing causes too much rage and hardcore guild fights and are always a problem. But blizzard could simply implement a timer for each guild so not only the best ones couuld kill them. Bah less one funny thing in world of Warcraft just because whiners cant have them pretty epics fast enough -_-

[RickJamesLich]

I hate the "hardmode" argument. Thats not new content and its simply not rewarding enough recieving epics with diferent colors from the ones everyone already have. Its so much hardcore with so little reward...i just dont get it. And most of them are just the same bosses with improved stats, unlike Ulduar with totally new mechanics and rewards.


What things? The thing i said were completely EXTINCT? How can people experience what doesnt exist -_- wich one were u talking about:
"the social experience", "leveling", "group quests", "meeting stones", "road/paths to raids", "reputation farm zones" or "world events"



I think people dont just fight for rewards. Its proven that cosmetic, funny items and mounts are more than enough to remove peoples ass from the main city to the world.
Gurubashi arena and Dire maul are sooooo old and you can still find people there from time to time. I dont think world events are as bad as you imply. Darkmoon fair is always fun, at least for me. I didnt even referenced the "world boss" topic...that thing causes too much rage and hardcore guild fights and are always a problem. But blizzard could simply implement a timer for each guild so not only the best ones couuld kill them. Bah less one funny thing in world of Warcraft just because whiners cant have them pretty epics fast enough -_-

Awesome post, totally agree that people always say "but, but, but, you got hard modes!" those last a few hours, and they are just a re-hash of stuff a lot of us already did. The social experience in particular was one of the biggest factors in wow, I think I made like 30 different friends while leveling in the past, now that stuff has pretty much been killed as there's no need for people to ever have to work together, the game even finds people automatically for you to match up with for dungeons without ever having to socialize lol.

[vesseblah]

Awesome post, totally agree that people always say "but, but, but, you got hard modes!" those last a few hours, and they are just a re-hash of stuff a lot of us already did.

You and your guild can opt to not do any other raids except the heroic ones if you want to. Just pay somebody who cleared normal mode first week to come open the heroic mode instance for you on 2nd week and you're done. No rehashing, no old content you did before.

Don't claim it's not possible to see the hardest content and progress through it like it was in vanilla or TBC because it would be a blatant lie.

The social experience in particular was one of the biggest factors in wow, I think I made like 30 different friends while leveling in the past, now that stuff has pretty much been killed as there's no need for people to ever have to work together, the game even finds people automatically for you to match up with for dungeons without ever having to socialize lol.

Today people want to reach the level cap as fast as possible avoiding all contact with other people while using tools like LFD. The problem is not in the tools and it's not Blizzard's fault nor anything they changed in the game, it's the people. There's nothing your whining and crying can do to change the minds of the other 7M+ players who want to get on with their lives without being forced to socialize with morons while they're questing. And yes, I do mean being forced to deal with morons. My ignore list in vanilla was constantly full 50 and I had to weekly remove random people from there to add in new idiots while friendslist never went over 10.

Having people in friends list happens naturally when the game is new and everybody is doing the same content, but after years spent in the game you just don't have anything in common with new random people you meet. You're stuck with your current guild and current friends and ask them to help with hard quests, and there's nothing in the whole world which will bring back the first months when everybody was equally noob and equally without guild to lend a hand. Nothing besides blank slate in new MMORPG

[HeedmySpeed]

You and your guild can opt to not do any other raids except the heroic ones if you want to. Just pay somebody who cleared normal mode first week to come open the heroic mode instance for you on 2nd week and you're done. No rehashing, no old content you did before.


Don't claim it's not possible to see the hardest content and progress through it like it was in vanilla or TBC because it would be a blatant lie.

Wow. Just letting you know you really mind fucked me at how retarded this statement was.

Today people want to reach the level cap as fast as possible avoiding all contact with other people while using tools like LFD. The problem is not in the tools and it's not Blizzard's fault nor anything they changed in the game, it's the people. There's nothing your whining and crying can do to change the minds of the other 7M+ players who want to get on with their lives without being forced to socialize with morons while they're questing. And yes, I do mean being forced to deal with morons. My ignore list in vanilla was constantly full 50 and I had to weekly remove random people from there to add in new idiots while friendslist never went over 10.

"Today, most kids just want to eat candy and fastfood avoiding all vegetables while going to places like McDonalds and Burger King. The problem isn't the parents, it's the kids fault."

The thing is most people haven't even been given the chance to appreciate player to player interaction in this game.
I sure as shit did not expect to make friends or get familiar with players when I started WoW.
But over a few tiers and forced player interaction I saw familiar faces and it was nice.

It's not something that's common in other games which is a huge strength to WoW.

If you don't know what I'm talking about you should Twink at some level that has a strong community. *Shout out to my level 60 homies*

[Dormie]

Thread summary: people that have no clue what they're talking about saying the game didnt used to be harder.

[Dormie]

<< Killed KJ during TBC.
That guy is NOTHING compared to hard-modes.

Whatever you say. The only thing harder now is you have to dance more. Each class has 5x more get out of death free abilities, on a fraction of the CD they used to be.

[Dormie]

That's because, unlike the average classic/tbc-raid, things nowadays actually hurt players and you can't afford to lose people.
That was different when you had 40 people of whom you could easily let twenty die and still clear the raid.

Aaaand back to people not knowing what they're talking about.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Which do you think was harder?
Or which required more skill?



- - - Updated - - -

Aaaand back to people not knowing what they're talking about.

If you want to start a argument you should do better and actually stick with your argument, not act childish.

[Dormie]

If you want to start a argument you should do better and actually stick with your argument, not act childish.

Not gonna waste time arguing against gross exaggerations that are false to begin with.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Not gonna waste time arguing against gross exaggerations that are false to begin with.

Then state why you think they're false. Give ground for discussions.
Please, I really would like to know your reasoning's for why you think it was harder back then. (no sarcasm).

[Kakera]

itt: nostalgic fucks that think the game was actually harder in classic because it is classic and therefore 40 mans are harder and yadda yadda yadda
itt: people that didnt play in classic think that it was way too easy and that classic was irrelevant and yadda yadda yadda

The reality is the game was way too different back then to fairly compare. Technology, the community, and the entire outlook on the game was ridiculously different. Anyone that claims one is better, harder, or more valuable has absolutely, and I mean ABSOLUTELY (shut the fuck up seriously retards) ABSOLUTELY no idea what they are talking about.

WoW player since 2004 launch. Cleared half of Naxx 40 when it was relevant. Kill mostly all content when it was relevant pre-nerf. Stop talking about shit you don't know about. Nostalgia fags will forever haunt this game. Don't be one of the ignorant fucks (BRANDON LOL)