Heroic Thok...Where the mages at?

[Mirri]

I didn't really understand ashvael's post. Anyone else did ?

[Ashvael]

We played a very specific tactic in the beginning which required many people in a "not usual" set-up -> Vykina (only mage of ours) was out.
We changed tactic but didn't really change setup to an optimal one because we deemed the boss easy -> Vykina still out for no real reason.
People overreact and bench mages even though Vykina (mage) did more DPS than most of the classes in our kill.

I hope that makes it easier to understand.



Also, apparently Aprixius knows more than I do anyway so maybe he can clarify?

[Haywire5714]

We played a very specific tactic in the beginning which required many people in a "not usual" set-up -> Vykina (only mage of ours) was out.
We changed tactic but didn't really change setup to an optimal one because we deemed the boss easy -> Vykina still out for no real reason.
People overreact and bench mages even though Vykina (mage) did more DPS than most of the classes in our kill.

I hope that makes it easier to understand.



Also, apparently Aprixius knows more than I do anyway so maybe he can clarify?

I don't know why people feel the need to even comment about it; likely by the time their guild gets there they will have a high enough item level to make benching certain classes unnecessary.

Anyways good luck on Paragons of Benchallmelee?

[Zatetic]

We played a very specific tactic in the beginning which required many people in a "not usual" set-up -> Vykina (only mage of ours) was out.
We changed tactic but didn't really change setup to an optimal one because we deemed the boss easy -> Vykina still out for no real reason.
People overreact and bench mages even though Vykina (mage) did more DPS than most of the classes in our kill.

I hope that makes it easier to understand.



Also, apparently Aprixius knows more than I do anyway so maybe he can clarify?

I find this incredibly amusing.

"oh yeh, we just forgot to bring him back in and now every guild thinks mages suck on the fight"

please dont forget to bring vykina for siegecrafter, klaxxi or garrosh. I'd hate for it to be normal to sit mages on those fights. :P

[Mirri]

We played a very specific tactic in the beginning which required many people in a "not usual" set-up -> Vykina (only mage of ours) was out.
We changed tactic but didn't really change setup to an optimal one because we deemed the boss easy -> Vykina still out for no real reason.
People overreact and bench mages even though Vykina (mage) did more DPS than most of the classes in our kill.

I hope that makes it easier to understand.



Also, apparently Aprixius knows more than I do anyway so maybe he can clarify?

Heheh thanks ashvael, I get it now. Kinda funny, but hey everyone follows method's example.

[haxedagain]

I wasn't QQ that mages are weak, people miss the point.

Point is warlocks are better at everything. Why have mages?

[Last Starfighter]

I wasn't QQ that mages are weak, people miss the point.

Point is warlocks are better at everything. Why have mages?

So why didn't you just start a thread titled "Warlocks rule, mages suck QQ" instead of saying "WHy aren't there any mages on H Thok". Which is very specific. You're acting like mages are shit and they aren't. And all those times mages were better than locks, should they have got rid of locks? Thats a dumb argument.

[Akraen]

Mages do absurd amounts of damage, but we don't survive things well.

When trying to beat heavy mechanic-dense content it's better to bring the classes that can survive and do it all, especially while on the move. In other words, warlocks and hunters.

This is the new encounter design model and mages don't fit it.

[haxedagain]

MoP is much like TBC for mages. Good at beginning, ruled by warlock at end.

- - - Updated - - -

MoP is much like TBC for mages. Good at beginning, ruled by warlock at end.

See now this example of QQ warlocks rule mages suck.

Instead I choose to make argument using empirical data.

[Difuid]

Mages complaining about being too weak, oh boy.

Try being a hunter if your so worried about getting sat on progression.

Having the best of both worlds, melee mobility along with the caster range must be really tiring.

[Deleted]

I wasn't QQ that mages are weak, people miss the point.

Point is warlocks are better at everything. Why have mages?

There is always one class that is superior on a fight. You sound like you want that class to be mage (on every single encounter).
Even though mages are worse than warlocks on this one fight; they are still better than the rest of ranged casters.
Poor mages in such a bad spot. Only second best. Quit the over-exaggeration. Quit QQ'ing and start playing your mage properly and you won't be benched outside of top 50 guilds.

[ryuja]

mages are fine as dps on thok, only reason not to bring them is lack of raid CDs

[Zevoa]

mages are fine as dps on thok, only reason not to bring them is lack of raid CDs

Guess the other mages don't have sub 15 ms

[Valanna]

Guess the other mages don't have sub 15 ms

How does latency come into it? Sure, if you have huge input delay then you would be restricted to instants. I could comfortably fit schorches in between screeches with between 50 and 75 ms. Just make sure to evocate right before it gets too fast for it so you don't lose your 15% damage and you won't lose much more than other casters.

[EruptorNZ]

How does latency come into it? Sure, if you have huge input delay then you would be restricted to instants. I could comfortably fit schorches in between screeches with between 50 and 75 ms. Just make sure to evocate right before it gets too fast for it so you don't lose your 15% damage and you won't lose much more than other casters.

50-75ms lol.

[Deleted]

50-75ms lol.

If the latency doesn't change during the fight, I don't see how it should be a problem?!
People can beat disruptron and survive HC Vizir balls with higher latency too.

[Deleted]

All the heroic 25m kill vids I've seen, Hunters are near the bottom of the DPS meters that people have up on the video. Most I've seen in a Thok kill was 2 Hunters, doesn't really scream "Hunters are good for this fight" when people bring 4 Warlocks.

Watch my video, we're fine

[Mhyroth]

All I can see here is Mages complaining about not being Nr 1 for once ? I'm sorry but if I check kill videos in 90 to 95% of the cases I see a Mage on top; Lei Shen hc anyone ? Combust... Same for Council in ToT last tier. Of course Warlocks do insane damage on that too, but you're just over exaggerating on the capabilities of a good Mage. If you would have checked Twitch or farm kills of the top guilds, you'd see Mages end top 50-70% of the times. And if YOU don't end up first; you're either under-geared, have bad rng, need to L2play, or playing against/with some very good players and you should be proud to be in the raid then ! You'd be surprised how much you will improve by practicing a lot, maximize everything even if you're sat out.
Don't complain for 1 boss in a 14 boss tier. And maybe also think about GUILD progression. If a GUILD can get a hc boss down quick, farmmode can start faster. Which means faster swapping of members. Don't be tunnel-vision and think further as just your personal numbers.

[Deleted]

A good mage is always worth bringing. The moment one heroic 25 man video correctly summarises the state of classes is the moment the world ends.

[Deleted]

there is nothing wrong with mages at all, any1 that thinks so are deluding themselves.