That's like saying people buying movies is declining if you don't take into account DVDs or blu-rays.
The MMO market has evolved to have a massive F2P section which naturally entices lots of people in. The number of players in the MMO genre is still very very high.
OP's entire post is based on utterly ludicrous points "most of us were bullied or have underlying issues", yeah nah, that's just projecting so he doesn't feel like he's alone.
I think me and the guy I'm quoting below might be the only two people who actually got what the OP was saying. This IS the internet. Everyone entitled to their opinion. You don't like, don't comment.
One of the reasons I've stopping being active on forums in general is something I've noticed in the last few years: Folks will look for some fault in your opinion just for the sake of having a counter-arguement. It's one thing if a poster says something factually incorrect but if it's clearly the poster's opinion on a particular subject, you can object without flaming them.
Ditto this.
As someone whose first MMO was WoW and made their second GW2 two months ago but has tried other MMOs (SWTOR, DCUO, Skyrim, Rift and LoL to name a few), major props to the OP for putting this together first and foremost.
I agree with it 100%.
The moment "Quality New MMOs" became the expectation was the moment the end appeared on the horizon. Mind you, EQ/EQII are proof some MMOs can withstand the test of time. I expect WoW to join that list one day, too. Do I think Blizzard is looking to continue Azaroth's story post-WoW in the near future? No.
Even so, one thing I have become acutely aware of is the bloated expectations of the MMO Community or rather, gamers in general.
...Ok, time to change the ol' Sig ^_^
This time I'll leave you the Links to 3 of my Wordpress Blogs: 1. Serene Adventure 2. Video Games 3. Anime Please subscribe if you like what you see. As a Bonus, I'll throw in my You Tube channel =D
People who don't see the problems with the MMO market surely baffle me. Has anything had an upward trend in subscribers in YEARS? There's more competition, which I guess could be taken as positivity or whatever in the market, but almost every MMO is having trouble holding onto subscribers, and has in the past few years, along with some real notable failures to boot, hell, even things that were praised to heck and back, like Guild Wars 2, has trouble attracting and holding on to people.
Basically, WoW is the only major success story in the genre right now, and it's on a downward trend, too.
The real problem, I think, is the genre itself carries a WHOLE lot of baggage (Grinding, repetition, monthly fees, slowness to get the "real game", being judged and controlled by strangers, and so on) that a lot of people don't want to deal with, BUT a lot of modern games have adapted some of the more appealing/addictive aspects of MMOs, without any of the baggage. (i.e. unlocks and levels in FPS's, and what not). Most people probably don't want to slog through a bunch of "trivial" content to get to the "real" part of a game, to be judged by a pile of strangers to be deemed worthy of playing it, when they can just turn on some other kind of game, shoot some people, gain a few levels, get an item, and call it a day.
My two cents, though! Take it for what you will.
(Also, I think the popularity of MMOs is, and has long been overblown in the Western markets.)
I highly doubt that the age of MMO's is over. I like wow alot still to this day, im playing it because of the pvp on it. But one day when I quit ill be picking up neverwinter, I almost did already but it had a few flaws on it.
There are problems with the genre but I don't consider it even close to dead.
I'd actually chalk the players up to it's "decline" (numbers are up - quality is done) for various factors.
There is less hook - less emotional impact - EVERYTHING needs to be changed to accommodate /somebody/ - The communities are turning toxic and people will just blame others for their lack of anything.
I'm still enjoying WoW to it's fullest as a game - The only times I've been disappointed is off it's piss-poor playerbase wanting this or that nerfed, insulting people who are "better" at the game than them even if it wasn't "shoved down their throat", wanting everything changed because of their own stupidity (waah i accidentally flagged being the biggest load of crap I've seen since I started.) and the fact people can get away with most everything.
(Took Blizzard over 6 months to finally deal with a harassment case that was ongoing for that long on and off.)
I wouldn't blame the games - I'd blame the fact they opened it to everybody and then tried changing the genre/games for everybody who couldn't take it as it's worth.
Eventually they're going to please nobody.
There has never been a more ample time to say,
tl;dr
Post constructively, please.
Last edited by Daetur; 2013-09-28 at 04:06 PM.
Rofl. FFXIV is a grindfest due to it being such a new game. The fuck do you think WoW was when it began? When SWTOR began? When Rift began? Have you even played FFXIV? It's been out for a month and idiots like you are complaining because of the grind that it takes to get to a higher item level.
And you're implying that WoW currently isn't a grindfest? LFR, LFR, LFR, LFR, did I trip on my LFR? Then you run Normal and Flex and if you're a "leet gaymer" you'll run Heroics rather than normals.
Get outta heya.
Aurabolt.
You sir, are exactly what I was hoping to find.
And yes, this is exactly what I was trying to say.
If I was to take this thread seriously
I'd have to conclude that the AGE OF VIDEOGAMES has ended
that is equal as saying the age of MMO's has ended
The lack of logic in OP is disturbing
I have heard alot of people say it, The EQ/WoW formula is out of date. All these past failed MMOs just try to copy them & think they would succeed without trying something new or build on to it.
WoW toke aspects from EQ / D&D and it built off that, An it grew from that. Recent MMOs just tried to recreate Vanilla WoW & failed.
Games like GW2 / FF14 / Wildstar & Secret World have had fresh new kind of ideas to there MMOs. The companies who made those games didn't just copy WoW & release there game saying we are better than WoW or have a budget so high that you wonder where all that money went too after you seen the final product.
Lovestar said it the best: MMOs are not "over" now, any more than they were over when EverQuest replaced Ultima Online, or WoW replaced EverQuest.
For all we know Wildstar could replace WoW & continue the cycle or be a flop like the rest. We don't even know if another MMO could ever top WoW, but one thing we know MMOs are far from over. They just they can't use the old WoW / EQ Formula they need to create new exciting things to keep you playing. Most of us have played WoW for 5+ & some of us are still playing since Day 1. For some of us WoW will be are last MMO & we are very hesitant to leave after all the years of playing the game to start fresh in a new mmo if that game doesn't give us the spark we got when playing WoW or are first MMO.
one more thing F2P is fad & will simmer out eventually, people are already seeing how bad they can get over time, thats the only thing from MMOs I see dieing out,
Last edited by Arbs; 2013-09-28 at 04:38 PM.
I can see how wow has stifled the development of mmos a bit...like the jump from 2d games to 3d games was huge however since wow progress hasn't been nearly as great, it's more about refining what currently works rather than expanding into new areas.
Facepalmed HARD.
Feel sorry for you, but because you were bullied and at the same time were playing wow doesn't mean that every people playing wow were like you...
I always played with people who were socially integrated, from vanilla until now (I even remember raiding in Wolk with some lawyer(who even played from his office)/architect/physician/doctor in our raid. Far from some nerdy nolife)
Mmmh, no, not at all. If one game may have this title it's counter strike (adn that's a big may). But even if wow was/is a great PC success. PC gaming don't really owe much to wow.The thing is... WoW is a great MMO, it was so great, that these things became an obvious marketing campaign, in many ways we owe WoW a lot including and not limited to:
- Making the PC a globally known console to consider cool to use.
Don't really understand why some people feel the urge to write an essay about wow cosmic failure on this forum every week in total contradiction of reality... WoW was a great success, still is a great success. If you don't like it, move over. We don't care about your feeling on how wow destroyed your world.
Nope. Mmos are as popular as ever. Or do you think all these companies releasing mmos are clueless? As long as there is a market for mmos we will continue to have them.
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Ever think to consider this is a result of playing the same game for 9 years and has nothing to do with the actual game itself? New players are having just as much fun if not more so than we ever did. Wow is fine.
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Didn't you know? Blizzard has people holding guns to everyones head forcing them to use queues instead of forming their own groups manually. I said it before and I will say it again, if community is dead it is because players are lazy and expect Blizzard to make their community for them. While everyone is bitching about the "death" of community, everyone else is enjoying newfound communities that are rising out of cross realm tech such as oqueue and openraid.
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What on earth are you even talking about? I have never seen someone bend over backwards so much just to find new and interesting ways to bash Wow. My god just move on already.
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A key element of mmos is the grind and you aren't going to find many that don't have some form of it. Just because you personally don't enjoy it doesn't make it bad.
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Where are people getting this notion that gamers don't want to spend time gaming? No. Just no.
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This sounds to be more of a personal problem to me. I rarely have silent groups in LFD or LFR and many people I meet have been quite friendly and talkative. Community exists but only if you are a part of it. Blizzard never has and never will build community for you.
Ok .
Responding to a thread to only say "ok" or "cool story," et cetera contributes nothing and is considered spam. Please post constructively in the future.
Last edited by Daetur; 2013-09-28 at 06:53 PM.
I wonder if the mods are ever going to get it through their thick skulls that when threads generate repeated posts like this that maybe just maybe they have merit to what they are saying in response to the OP. Maybe instead of infracting people for "non constructive" posts they should start infracting the people who make these non constructive threads instead. Unfortunately that will never happen because clearly the mods want to keep these forums as unproductive and hostile as possible rather than actually doing their job to promote constructive discussion.
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While he may not have elaborated on why he would close the thread, I think more than a few others have done a decent job of it. The thread is based on false premises and filled with stating opinion as fact and is incredibly arrogant and condescending. There honestly is nothing to discuss here.
Infracted. Please, do avoid discussing subjects like moderation on open thread. You are welcome to contact the moderation team if you feel that it's wrongly handled, but it doesn't serve well to continue to pick up a subject that has been warned about before.
Last edited by Lochton; 2013-09-29 at 12:48 AM.
When are you people going to get it? Mmos are a niche market. Wow is the exception to the rule as far as numbers go. When comparing console mmos to PC mmos that aren't Wow, yes they actually are wildly popular.
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Pretty much everything about Timeless Isle has been a result of player feedback. I love how people spent this entire expansion bitching and whining about dailies and other nonsense only to bitch even louder when they got what they asked for.