If this is how LFR is going to be from now on, I don't see the reason in keeping it.

[frumper]

The one bad thing I will say is the number of tanks has gone down even further this patch.

The last 4 groups i've been in have failed at the first boss once or even before the boss has been attempted and a tank has left, then there's been a 10-15 min wait for another tank before the 2nd tank leaves.

The group then either waits 40 mins for 2 tanks or disbands and tries again.

Blizzard needs to look at ways to make more tanks stick with LFR or make them do-able with 1

Another problem is sub-geared tanks. DPS queues as tank with no real tank gear, they wipe then quit. If you got one of those tanks as your solo tank, you'd definitely fail. The biggest reason I don't queue as a tank is that people are brutal to tanks in how they treat them. I think pretty much every wipe I've been on Dark Shaman is because of "noob tanks" according to the players in LFR.

[Sithalos]

Yes, yes. We all know LOLFR sucks. We don't need yet another thread to remind us.

[Baracuda]

Expect changes pretty soon, I know it's not just me but I have quite a few friends who also have no interest in moving past lfr and loved the addition of it.
Quite a few of them gave up this week and some are close to quitting the game.
If my personal experience is any indication Blizz is going to bleed subs from this, acceptable changes better come fast.

No offence but, maybe if it's for the best if LFR dies and your friends move on People who only do LFR don't get practice to get better they get practice to have stuff handed to them, but that's the new generation so maybe there should only be LFR...

[Pann]

No offence but, maybe if it's for the best if LFR dies and your friends move on People who only do LFR don't get practice to get better they get practice to have stuff handed to them, but that's the new generation so maybe there should only be LFR...

If you are a raider it might not be the smartest move telling LFR players to move on as without them and their money there will be no raids and then raiders would have no reason to feel superior over other players.

[Otimus]

No offence but, maybe if it's for the best if LFR dies and your friends move on People who only do LFR don't get practice to get better they get practice to have stuff handed to them, but that's the new generation so maybe there should only be LFR...

That isn't the purpose of LFR.

[TheBigPapi]

No offence but, maybe if it's for the best if LFR dies and your friends move on People who only do LFR don't get practice to get better they get practice to have stuff handed to them, but that's the new generation so maybe there should only be LFR...

People who run LFR,for the most part, have no interest in getting better, learning fights, or moving on to flex/normals. They want the low stress, no effort slog that it is no because all that have to do to get gear is simply exist. Blizz sees LFR as a mistake and is slowly trying to rectify it. I see them getting rid of it all together next expac despite all the whiners you'll see threatening that they'll cancel their sub that they only have active for a month or 2 each year to see a patch and then stop playing. If you can sit in 1 LFR wing for 2 hours for loot, then you can easily do it in a guild and play the way designers intended rather then however you feel it should be.

[Scarletpiston]

If you are a raider it might not be the smartest move telling LFR players to move on as without them and their money there will be no raids and then raiders would have no reason to feel superior over other players.

Someone who really doesn't get how many subs will be lost if lfr doesn't remain successful, can't force casual players to become raiders but you can force them to quit, any wild guesses how much of the subscriber base is represented to be players who will never be raiders?

[Mirishka]

I want it removed from the game.

Yes because Blizzard is waiting on hands and knees to obey what *you* want removed from the game, right?

Its called you had a bad LFR... get over it. It happened long before Flex existed and it'll happen long after. Tanks leaving has been the death of LFR runs since Cataclysm, what rock do you reside beneath?

These forums would implode if everyone who had a bad go in LFR came here whining about it. Your incident is not unique or interesting and didn't warrant a topic - much less nonsense like "If this is how LFR is after Flex is introduced, I want it removed from the game. It's a waste of resources."

[TheBigPapi]

Someone who really doesn't get how many subs will be lost if lfr doesn't remain successful, can't force casual players to become raiders but you can force them to quit, any wild guesses how much of the subscriber base is represented to be players who will never be raiders?

You're right, cuz they've had many more subs with LFR than they had before it? This game was far more immersive and successful before this awful excuse for end game content ruined the game and further ruined the community.

[Pann]

Someone who really doesn't get how many subs will be lost if lfr doesn't remain successful, can't force casual players to become raiders but you can force them to quit, any wild guesses how much of the subscriber base is represented to be players who will never be raiders?

Looking at wowprogress figures the Lich King has been killed by around three quarters of million players over the course of four years out of a peak western population of around 5.5 million subs and Lei Shen normal has been killed by about 200k players. Raiders make up a tiny proportion of the population.

[Scarletpiston]

The decline in subs is natural, the addition of lfr and other things to make the game more accessible slowed the loss of subs, now some genius has decided that turning everyone into raiders will work when that will surely kill this game.

[Pann]

You're right, cuz they've had many more subs with LFR than they had before it? This game was far more immersive and successful before this awful excuse for end game content ruined the game and further ruined the community.

You do know that the vast majority of players never touched end game content? LFR is an attempt to justify the vast expense of developing raids for a tiny minority.

[Prag]

LFR has made Flex much more attractive.

[Scarletpiston]

Lets see if Blizzard can keep the lights on if only the very small percentage of raiders remained to pay the bills.

[whatthefudge]

Anyone that wants or thinks LFR will be removed needs to actually think. Why would Blizzard remove a feature of the game that provides a significant amount of content to a large portion of its player base that requires, since the infrastructure is already in place, almost no additional development time (no new art, no new mechanics, slight rebalancing that takes very little time because LFR balance isn't important.)

After my guild retired from the raiding scene at the end of Cataclsym, I only had LFR for raiding (my own personal choice not to find another guild). Did I like it as much as normal/heroic? No, but it was better than the alternative of nothing. Now that flex is an option I find myself running flex pugs via OpenRaid and I don't touch LFR. Moral of the story is if you don't like it or want to do it then don't do it!

- - - Updated - - -

Lets see if Blizzard can keep the lights on if only the very small percentage of raiders remained to pay the bills.

This will be a shocker to you, but raiders have never "paid the bills".

[Notos]

I'm interested in an explanation from people saying Blizz thinks "LFR is a mistake". Show me ONE blue post where they have admitted this or even hinted at it. LFR has been very successful for them from the get-go; it gets people into endgame content that would otherwise not have much to do...I don't see them getting rid of it.

[lockedout]

That isn't the purpose of LFR.

LFR serves no purpose.
40 min+ ques for DPS, the few times I have qued I see the wait and log out.

[Scarletpiston]

This will be a shocker to you, but raiders have never "paid the bills".

I know that but they believe they do, makes them feel even more important,

[Alvito]

I love these Flex raiding has ruined LFR so remove LFR threads. Funny since this was many of the things lower end norm raiders said when LFR came out.

[Deleted]

So unless the guy is literally a deadweight, (60k DPS isnt a deadweight, but anything lower should be negatively rewarded), it should be positive or at the very least only slightly harder to bring in more people who arent as skilled.

Sorry, couldn't pass to comment on that. In what world is 60k dps with 510+ ilvl even remotely acceptable? If someone can't spend 30 minutes to learn how to play his class he HAS NOT MOTIVATION to see the content. Why should other people have enough motivation to actually carry him?