This Expansion tried to kill alts, simple as that.

[Deleted]

I like that! Hope they will add some similar long term quest in the upcoming expansion. But that would be a minority opinion, for sure.

[DeadmanWalking]

They did not try to kill alts, they tried to give you as much as possible to do to keep you engadged and in consequence alts took a back seat. It is getting harder and harder to take people seriously on this forum when they so easily leap to acts of hyperbole.

[Deleted]

Most people dont seem to understand the issue here. For the semihard core raider, a raider who raids heroics on his main and likes to do normal/easy heroics on his alt, alt raiding has definitely taking a blow. I will explain why.

Back in cataclysm as well as earlier expansions, it was way way easier to get your alts raid ready for normal mode raiding. One could simply farm the current tier dungeons, spent justice points and buy a valor item or two and within 3 weeks you could start raiding.

In MoP this is not the case at all. If I reached level 90 today on my alt, Id have a much tougher time getting ready for normal mode raiding. Lets say 522 would be the minimum ilvl for normal mode SoO. This means the timeless isle gear is essentially useless as its nearly 30 ilvls behind. So literally the only steady ilvl gain is a valor item every week or two. This means you have to resort to lfr/flex/hc scenario, which is like playing the lottery once a week. Add to this that each part of lfr and flex easily takes an hour of time, so it takes alot of dedication to participate in these when you know the changes of getting loot are slim.

Even if you do get lucky and gear relatively fast, you will still be incredibly behind on the legendary quest, which makes a huge different in class potential for nearly every role.

Suppose you have overcome all these hurdles, youve done flex/lfr week after week and you even have the legendary cloak and you went up all the way to 535 ilvl, more than enough for normal mode. At this stage you will find your motivation to even raid normal has been drained. Youve seen the raid a million times by now due to flex/lfr and you will notice most of your friends and guildmates didnt have the same dedication to put effort into their alt. At best you can kind of scrape together half a guild raid and you will have to pug a player or two. You will have some fun the first few weeks and then eventually hit a wall due to the inconsistent player setup and the lack of geared alts this expansion to replace players. At this stage you will most likely abandon your alt altogether.

[Sealbinder]

As someone with 10 90s and my druid at 87 (will have the full set of classes soon!) I have no no issues with alts. Sorry that you do. I had been gearing them up running, running normal raids on a few of them, LFRs on others and this was prior to the island of epic gear. I work a 60hr week, am newly wed and spend a lot of time with my wife and I don't bother people for help leveling or gearing so I do this all on my own. It is not difficult or even that time consuming. I think the OP and others who are complaining about this just lack patience.

Honestly I have found this x-pac the best alt leveling experience I have had. I am having more fun and motivation then I ever did in Cata and especially in LK.

[Deleted]

M

Back in cataclysm as well as earlier expansions, it was way way easier to get your alts raid ready for normal mode raiding. One could simply farm the current tier dungeons, spent justice points and buy a valor item or two and within 3 weeks you could start raiding.

In MoP this is not the case at all. If I reached level 90 today on my alt, Id have a much tougher time getting ready for normal mode raiding. Lets say 522 would be the minimum ilvl for normal mode SoO. This means the timeless isle gear is essentially useless as its nearly 30 ilvls behind. So literally the only steady ilvl gain is a valor item every week or two. This means you have to resort to lfr/flex/hc scenario, which is like playing the lottery once a week. Add to this that each part of lfr and flex easily takes an hour of time, so it takes alot of dedication to participate in these when you know the changes of getting loot are slim.

You can get gear way faster through LFR+Flex+World bosses than you could during previous expansions by spending valor points... looks to me that you people are completely ignoring the fact that you have almost 2-3 drops of upgradable gear granted each week through those means.
It's way better than the ICC and DS heroics + valor gear IMHO.

[Wildtree]

Holy cow.. the threads getting more and more hilariously obnoxious...
I claim the very opposite... Never in the games history was it any easier to level and progress alts, like it is this time in MoP.
Normally, in the past, the time for alts was the "after season", when the last tier of the expansion somewhat stalled for main toons. That's the traditional peak time, where alts are getting dragged out of their "winter sleep" and played more intensive. Not so this time. Most people I know play their alts almost as equal as they play their mains.
And now, with the Timeless Isle, it became super trivial for new 90s alts. I have 2 toons which have a full set of timeless pieces sitting in their bank already, for once they hit 90.. And that's because I only collected them for these 2 toons. Otherwise I could have more toons decked out.

- - - Updated - - -

Most people dont seem to understand the issue here. For the semihard core raider, a raider who raids heroics on his main and likes to do normal/easy heroics on his alt, alt raiding has definitely taking a blow. I will explain why.

Back in cataclysm as well as earlier expansions, it was way way easier to get your alts raid ready for normal mode raiding. One could simply farm the current tier dungeons, spent justice points and buy a valor item or two and within 3 weeks you could start raiding.

In MoP this is not the case at all. If I reached level 90 today on my alt, Id have a much tougher time getting ready for normal mode raiding. Lets say 522 would be the minimum ilvl for normal mode SoO. This means the timeless isle gear is essentially useless as its nearly 30 ilvls behind. So literally the only steady ilvl gain is a valor item every week or two. This means you have to resort to lfr/flex/hc scenario, which is like playing the lottery once a week. Add to this that each part of lfr and flex easily takes an hour of time, so it takes alot of dedication to participate in these when you know the changes of getting loot are slim.

Even if you do get lucky and gear relatively fast, you will still be incredibly behind on the legendary quest, which makes a huge different in class potential for nearly every role.

Suppose you have overcome all these hurdles, youve done flex/lfr week after week and you even have the legendary cloak and you went up all the way to 535 ilvl, more than enough for normal mode. At this stage you will find your motivation to even raid normal has been drained. Youve seen the raid a million times by now due to flex/lfr and you will notice most of your friends and guildmates didnt have the same dedication to put effort into their alt. At best you can kind of scrape together half a guild raid and you will have to pug a player or two. You will have some fun the first few weeks and then eventually hit a wall due to the inconsistent player setup and the lack of geared alts this expansion to replace players. At this stage you will most likely abandon your alt altogether.

Back in the other expansions and at the start, this was not any different, but rather harder. And what was done back then, can still be done today..
Alt raids where undergeared toons getting a carry and gear passed their way to catch up for the top tier raid.

[Skillslam]

Holy cow.. the threads getting more and more hilariously obnoxious...
I claim the very opposite... Never in the games history was it any easier to level and progress alts, like it is this time in MoP.
Normally, in the past, the time for alts was the "after season", when the last tier of the expansion somewhat stalled for main toons. That's the traditional peak time, where alts are getting dragged out of their "winter sleep" and played more intensive. Not so this time. Most people I know play their alts almost as equal as they play their mains.
And now, with the Timeless Isle, it became super trivial for new 90s alts. I have 2 toons which have a full set of timeless pieces sitting in their bank already, for once they hit 90.. And that's because I only collected them for these 2 toons. Otherwise I could have more toons decked out.

- - - Updated - - -

Back in the other expansions and at the start, this was not any different, but rather harder. And what was done back then, can still be done today..
Alt raids where undergeared toons getting a carry and gear passed their way to catch up for the top tier raid.

Bullshit.

Difference between Cata catchup gear (378) and normal DS (397) = 19 ilevels.
Difference between Timeless Isleless (496) and normal SoO (553) = 57 ilevels.

Compound that with Cata didn't have a special cloak and meta gem that you were totally fucked by not having.

People need to stop being dense about confusing usefulness of gear with ease of obtaining it.

[ItachiZaku]

Holy cow.. the threads getting more and more hilariously obnoxious...
I claim the very opposite... Never in the games history was it any easier to level and progress alts, like it is this time in MoP.
Normally, in the past, the time for alts was the "after season", when the last tier of the expansion somewhat stalled for main toons. That's the traditional peak time, where alts are getting dragged out of their "winter sleep" and played more intensive. Not so this time. Most people I know play their alts almost as equal as they play their mains.
And now, with the Timeless Isle, it became super trivial for new 90s alts. I have 2 toons which have a full set of timeless pieces sitting in their bank already, for once they hit 90.. And that's because I only collected them for these 2 toons. Otherwise I could have more toons decked out.

- - - Updated - - -

Back in the other expansions and at the start, this was not any different, but rather harder. And what was done back then, can still be done today..
Alt raids where undergeared toons getting a carry and gear passed their way to catch up for the top tier raid.

I completely agree. The main issue, IMO, is that people are putting too much value on their legendary cloak that not many people have. In that regard, I agree. Aside from that, they are blowing hot air.

[Marema]

I've had a much easier time leveling alts in this expansion then any previous one. Don't blame the game if you aren't smart enough to figure out how to easily level alts in MoP.

[Deleted]

Bullshit.

Difference between Cata catchup gear (378) and normal DS (397) = 19 ilevels.
Difference between Timeless Isleless (496) and normal SoO (553) = 57 ilevels.

Compound that with Cata didn't have a special cloak and meta gem that you were totally fucked by not having.

People need to stop being dense about confusing usefulness of gear with ease of obtaining it.

You are doing it wrong...
First of all the real catchup ilvl available from timeless is 535... still crappy stats tho.
If you want to get in soo normal yo should go through LFR (528) and Flex (540) beforehand, and that's what the 496 ilvl is used for.

[-Superman-]

It certainly felt that way in the beginning. But, as others have pointed out, Timeless Isle is an epic loot pinata making up for the gated BiS gear from 5.05 - 5.3.

[DeadmanWalking]

Catacylsm - Not enough to do so you have to raise alts
Mop - Gave us too much to do so Alts got sidelined unless you did not want to push forward into the content. Then they made it easier and some people leveled an alt. Then you got Loot pinata timeless Isle and if you can't play your alts now you can't be helped. You get 1 LFR wing every 2-3 weeks and a lot of casuals already have all their Burdens of Eternity so the only content left for them on timeless isle is world bosses.

Personally I would rather have too much to do that I can only play 1 character than have so little to do that I have to play 4 alts and repeat what I did on my main on all 4 just to stay busy.

[Ciddy]

Doesn't make any difference to me, but I've never been a big altoholic. I rarely ever get more than maybe 2-3 characters to level cap in an expansion, and even then, you can easily tell the difference between my alts and my main just by looking at gear. I had more alts level capped in Wrath than any other expansion, I think. Want to say I had like 6 level 80s. Again though, you could easily tell the difference. My warrior was decked out, and my others were all collecting dust in level 78 quest greens.

I only have one level 90 in MoP. I think I kinda got started on my Warlock alt, but said "fuck it" at some point around level 87 and haven't done anything with him since.

[nightfalls]

If you want to get in soo normal yo should go through LFR (528) and Flex (540) beforehand, and that's what the 496 ilvl is used for.

Why should people have to suffer weeks of RNG loot and shitty runs (LFR) just for a normal raid?

[PrairieChicken]

Catacylsm - Not enough to do so you have to raise alts
Mop - Gave us too much to do so Alts got sidelined unless you did not want to push forward into the content. Then they made it easier and some people leveled an alt. Then you got Loot pinata timeless Isle and if you can't play your alts now you can't be helped. You get 1 LFR wing every 2-3 weeks and a lot of casuals already have all their Burdens of Eternity so the only content left for them on timeless isle is world bosses.

Personally I would rather have too much to do that I can only play 1 character than have so little to do that I have to play 4 alts and repeat what I did on my main on all 4 just to stay busy.

No MoP just made things take 10 times longer than before with not much more content, making people busy but essentially they are just grinding same stuff over and over cause they are locked out by rng/lockouts/no catchups/crappy loots/etc

- - - Updated - - -

You are doing it wrong...
First of all the real catchup ilvl available from timeless is 535... still crappy stats tho.
If you want to get in soo normal yo should go through LFR (528) and Flex (540) beforehand, and that's what the 496 ilvl is used for.

Burdens aren't catching up at all (you either need to be 24/7 no lifer or extremely lucky to obtain burdens at previous heroic dungeon level). Certainly better than nothing but still takes too long to be considered any catching up.

[Deleted]

Dafaq?! It's easier now than ever to have alts. EXP Flasks, raid quality BoA items, Flex raids, "redesigned" valor points, Conquest point catch-up system, arena without a team, account wide mounts/achievements/pets, increased chance on items in old LFR etc etc etc. It could not be easier to have alts than it is right now. The only way it could be easier is if they gave you an already leveled and geared character.

[shise]

Ewh more like the other way around?

The harder it ois to keep an alt up to date (it's not anyways), the best for alts lovers.

I honestly dislike it when I lvl cap in one day and gear cap in another to the point where I can only do progress raids to keep going. Now at least it takes some EFFORT. And with 5.4 it is lovely, you can get an alt straight into SoO flex and LFR, even normal for the sake of item upgrading...

So please, stop complaining and play the game sigh. It's quite obvious that most of players like the way it is, or else more would have quit and things would have been changed.

[Sicarius87]

Ive come to the conclusion no one on this forums is happy with WoW unless theyre bitching about it.

[PrairieChicken]

Ewh more like the other way around?

The harder it ois to keep an alt up to date (it's not anyways), the best for alts lovers.

I honestly dislike it when I lvl cap in one day and gear cap in another to the point where I can only do progress raids to keep going. Now at least it takes some EFFORT. And with 5.4 it is lovely, you can get an alt straight into SoO flex and LFR, even normal for the sake of item upgrading...

So please, stop complaining and play the game sigh. It's quite obvious that most of players like the way it is, or else more would have quit and things would have been changed.

Sub numbers aren't out for 5.4 Yet.

[Naggash]

Yeah blizzard is killing alts... Sure...
I got my rogue to 90 and in 1 week he is already 528 and can run Flex with pugs with no problems. My other alt which is guardian druid at 540ilvl. Can run everyhing i want. Both of this chars don't have meta gem and cloak.
So what the problem? Ppl want "free stuff" without investing time in the game. This game is not for you, please close your sub. I'll be happy.