Remove Elitists From Raids and Battlegrounds

[Giscoicus]

I'm okay with an auto kick for yelling at scrubs if there is also a limitless kick that removes fucking inept pieces of shit from dungeons and raids as well.

But then you wouldn't have those telling at scrubs to kick since there are non =o but that would mean we actually hold people accountable.

do you want a repeat of 4.0![/B]

[Radish Spirit]

Calling out 69k DPS when it should be 70k dps is elitist.

Yeah. Okay. Great. Literally nobody does that. So, once again I have to point out what a ridiculously useless 65-page circlejerk this entire thread has been.

[-Superman-]

Oh, who knew you had so much pull with blizz.

Never claimed I was the reason they did it. I merely stated I asked for such things. Myself and multitudes of other casuals who pay to play and don't just burn through content in 3 days and bitch for 3 months. We enjoy the game for what it is and ask for new items to make it even more fun. Way to misinterpret a plain statement though

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah. Okay. Great. Literally nobody does that. So, once again I have to point out what a ridiculously useless 65-page circlejerk this entire thread has been.

Well, your opinion has been noted once again and I thank you for adding to the post count, and for helping keep it in the top 3 titles.

[Lime]

Good luck doing nothing in Flex, people actually pay attention to peoples numbers and if they are doing what they are supposed to, nor can you ignore all the mechanics like you can in LFR........LFR is not even CLOSE to being a stepping stone to raiding anymore than Timeless Isle is (which btw gives you higher ilvl than LFR).

I'm merely saying that it's a possibility. And not even that unlikely if you have friends in the flex. He's dismissing LFR a stepping stone because a player wouldn't have to do anything, I'm pointing out that Flex can be the same way.

TI doesn't give you raid experience whatsoever. LFR, while easy, at least introduces you to the bosses. Yes, there are some people who don't do anything, but most people do. Just because 1-5 people afk, doesn't mean that the whole group is getting free gear. Those other 20 people are at least learning the fights, even if they are watered down.

[Deleted]

The very simple way to prevent discussions about things like these and in fact to at least help stop the community from being so bad to each other, would be to gate any random group content behind the player first having to unlock proving grounds endless mode. Per character.

"Casuals" get everything they want, as only time can prevent someone from unlocking proving grounds endless mode.
"Elitists" can be much more sure that the people they play with (if elites actually do random content at all) are in some small way competent at their role.
"Bads" have less to do, never get thrown into a system forcing them to mix with people they never normally would mix with. Or, they learn to play and re-learn their manners.

[Santoryu]

I am very serious. It is a video game. I should not have to waste hundreds of hours to improve my gear. I play for fun. I also asked them for player housing, toy boxes, account wide mounts and rep, as well as barbershops and xmog. Sorry to tell you I am EXACTLY who Blizz caters to

It never did take hundreds of hours.

So you play for fun? You have fun in LFR or anything else nowadays, which does not require any presence of mind or any serious time investment?? Mind boggling. It might be fun at first, but that fun is very transitory, it lasts about a week, or maybe a month. Then you get bored and unsub. And as long as this is the model blizzards intends to stick with, subs will continue to decline as will the game quality and when push comes to shove, you'll wipe that grin off your face.

Player housing is stupid and shouldn't take time from the development of useful stuff, like dungeons. Barbershops are just aesthetics and xmog was necessary because the design of gear is getting worse and worse.

[threads]

Why are people still feeding this idiot troll's thread?

[Automatic]

I've already answered those things in this thread and many others. Taking a small side argument and assuming that's been my only contribution to the thread was your loss in finding those answers, not mine by not supplying them.

I've always made my thoughts on those questions clear on the dozens of threads we have on the same topic.

OK. I just went back through your post history and I see you have given your opinion on the things I listed. I must have just missed them whilst at work, or asleep. Anyway, I apologise for assuming that was your only contribution.

We actually seem to agree on most things. Other than the whole being rude to address the rudeness of someone trying to address rudeness thing.

[Lime]

Guilds selling heroic carries prove that you can do nothing in Normal and Heroics too and get loot, therefore those aren't raiding either by the original logic.

Can they? I hadn't dismissed Normals but I figured Heroics would be too difficult to do so. That's interesting.

[Coombs]

But then you wouldn't have those telling at scrubs to kick since there are non =o but that would mean we actually hold people accountable.

do you want a repeat of 4.0![/B]

Lol it was annoying the first week of 4.0 before they opened arenas and we had to farm Heroics and getting an absolute shit tank back to back. It would only let us kick one and then we had to suffer.

[Giscoicus]

Exactly. Calling out 15k dps is not elitist. Calling out 69k DPS when it should be 70k dps is elitist.

you shouldn't be even that low

The issue is that when you say "oh 69k is close enough" what's wrong with 68.5? Or 68? You have to draw a solid line. 70k is incredibly generous in the first place, moving the goal posts over and over is not an option.

-kick anybody under 70k:bob, falnica, deathprokilla and shamwow
-hey shamwow was 68k that's close enough
-fine. Kick the others.
-Falnica was only 3k behind Shamwow that isn't that much.

And so on. Where do you draw the line?

[Louis CK]

You side skirted their comment. You've made it obvious in "other" threads. Not this one.

Interesting, because I just found at least a couple in this thread =/

You guys are probably right though, the side argument a few pages ago to show that you were doing the exact thing you're making threads against was the first time I stepped foot in this thread.

Maybe they should. For me, I'm used to the game, I've learned how to type between GCD's. Not everyone is like that.

And I'm not going to expect a mother who hears her child start screaming to have her first thought as "I should let these random strangers who are calling each other noobs know that I'm going to attend to my child." And yeah, when she gets to her kid and he was just scared because he saw a spider, all is well and she's back. But at that moment when her kid screams out of nowhere, yeah, that's an emergency to her whether you agree with it or not.

Communication in general is good, and it should happen. I'm not arguing against that. But when the first reaction of almost everyone you see in LFR is "OMFG BOOT THEM THEY HAVEN'T MOVED IN 3 SECONDS" then there's a problem. Refusing to communicate and go AFK "just because you can" is an asshole move, sure.

All I'm suggesting, is that instead of complaining about and contributing to the problem, at least try to give the benefit of the doubt once in a while. If you don't try make things better, you can't expect anyone else to.

This is something that is missed in many of these discussions. There ARE, believe it or not, people who are brand new to the game, never raided in their life or touched an mmo before who are still stumbling through the outrageous amount of knowledge necessary to play correctly that those of us who have played for years take for granted.

And when those new people level up hearing nothing but "stupid noob kick him" how do you expect them to react to ANY advice or negative comments?

Case in point, my girlfriend just started playing about two months ago. She doesn't have max level character yet (nor has she ever touched an MMO) but after leveling Mage halfway and a hunter over halfway, she decided she wanted to heal. So we rerolled and now she has a holy pally (on RAF). We were in dire maul, and as soon as we zone in, the tank makes an enormous pull while my girlfriend is still loading into the instance. He pulls so many that he does quickly and starts cussing at her for not healing him, when the fact is, she wasn't even zoned in until after he had pulled way too many mobs to begin with. After extensive cussing he went AFK and we finished the instance without a tank. But, before he went AFK, he had cussed at her so much that she actually used chat for one of the first times to tell him to go fuck himself.

Now, when those are the type of people newbies have to "learn" with, how can they be expected to listen to anyone's feedback? Especially since we finished the instance without a tank and a brand new healer without a hitch.

Point is: stop being pseudo elitist douchebags. You're not good at the game, and pretending to be by doing stupid shit and talking down to others only makes you look stupid. I'm a great player, and I've played with many, many great players in my time, and I can spot the wannabes from a mile away. Be good, do your job, and shut your fuckhole.

[Deleted]

I am very serious. It is a video game. I should not have to waste hundreds of hours to improve my gear. I play for fun. I also asked them for player housing, toy boxes, account wide mounts and rep, as well as barbershops and xmog. Sorry to tell you I am EXACTLY who Blizz caters to

It is not about the destination, but the journey itself.

What makes you so special that you feel you ought not have to spend time improving your character like everyone else?

In fact, if you play for fun, then accept that your fun ought to be found without advances in your gear, there is plenty else besides for people without "time" to do things in WoW.

[Dominus89]

As I've said before, many people can tell stories of how they got better to shut those "elitists" up.

And many people can tell stories of how people got worse or stayed at the same dps due to the elitists.

If you dont have something constructive to say, stfu.
If you give them advice on how to improve the chance that they will actually improve is higher than if you tell them that they are shit.

[Giscoicus]

Can they? I hadn't dismissed Normals but I figured Heroics would be too difficult to do so. That's interesting.

More in 10M than 25M. What I've seen is guilds selling carries make the guy gettin carried kill themself so the raiders don't run the risk of him messing up a major mechanic.

[Santoryu]

And so on. Where do you draw the line?

The stat squish will fix this.

[cabyio]

Yeah, damn those casuals for wanting to play a game stress free rather then have some supernerd giving them shit in the raid.

Nobody here has a problem with elitists who say nothing.
Nobody here has a problem with elitists who offer helpful advice.
People here have a problem with vocal elitists putting everyone down.

Personally, I've seen more LFRs fail due to people leaving because of an elitist attitude rather than wipes itself.

If you tell the raid, "Hey, that fire is killing you guys, Try not to stand in it." you'll generally get a lot more players willing to listen to that than, "You fucking noobs suck, get out of the damn fire.". People will purposely do the latter just to spite you.

Just showing that people are thin skinned wastes of space. I was in a flex the other day on Thok and a bunch of people died due to being under his feet. After we wiped the RL was a bit abusive and basically said if you can't keep out from underneath him then just leave cuz ill kick you if you die to that again. A bunch of people were like, "Omg what an asshole, boo fucking who, im a giant baby" and left. We picked up people to replace them and killed the boss.

What does being a sensitive pansy ass get you? Nothing, so just toughen up and get some shit done.

[Giscoicus]

And many people can tell stories of how people got worse or stayed at the same dps due to the elitists.

If you dont have something constructive to say, stfu.
If you give them advice on how to improve the chance that they will actually improve is higher than if you tell them that they are shit.

I'm not in a random group to be a teacher. I'm doing my job and preforming my role right. You are not preparing your role right. If a player whispered me asking how I do such great damage I would tell them. However if somebody isn't trying to do wellin the first place, like not reading the dungeon journal or actually having full participation, then they can screw off. If uou walk in ungemmed, unenchanter (or doing so wrong because you can't bother to learn your class) and expect somebody to teach you then you are being a leecher and an ass

[Louis CK]

OK. I just went back through your post history and I see you have given your opinion on the things I listed. I must have just missed them whilst at work, or asleep. Anyway, I apologise for assuming that was your only contribution.

We actually seem to agree on most things. Other than the whole being rude to address the rudeness of someone trying to address rudeness thing.

I'm not a fan of hypocrisy. If OP is going to suggest others do something, he should do it himself (and not simply by some half cracked made up definition of his own).

I don't yell at people in LFR, because I know what to expect when I get there. I rarely ever initiate a kick, and unless there is a damn good reason, I don't blindly vote yes for kicks. Punishment in a video game is not going to improve performance. These people aren't pack mules. And when you beat them senseless with your bad attitude and words (regardless of how much OP thinks HIS version of rudeness is acceptable) then even those who desire to improve are just gonna say "fuck it."

Fact is: If you're going into LFR, you're going to experience bad and/or inexperienced players. No question about it. If you get upset once you get in there because that's the case, when you KNEW beforehand that it was going to be the case, then you need to question your own sensibility. LFR is what it is. Accept it or don't go.

And as far as the recent side argument, I made my point and the OP supported my point perfectly in his own back tracking way. He made an entire thread to complain about rude people, and in the same thread was rude to half the posters that took the time to post on his thread. That, my friend, is not okay.

[Lime]

Just showing that people are thin skinned wastes of space. I was in a flex the other day on Thok and a bunch of people died due to being under his feet. After we wiped the RL was a bit abusive and basically said if you can't keep out from underneath him then just leave cuz ill kick you if you die to that again. A bunch of people were like, "Omg what an asshole, boo fucking who, im a giant baby" and left. We picked up people to replace them and killed the boss.

What does being a sensitive pansy ass get you? Nothing, so just toughen up and get some shit done.

Not the same thing, they left due to the fact that they were going to get kicked if they died or (presumably) if they started to talk back. Thats not the case with LFR. There is no leader so fights are way more likely to happen. The only thing that would make your run worse is when the other people are just looking for ways to spite you.

What does being a sensitive pansy ass get you? Nothing, so just toughen up and get some shit done.

What does being an asshole in LFR get you? Nothing, so just chill out and get some shit done.