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  1. #521
    Quote Originally Posted by Babzu View Post
    All those years we made fun of the people saying. "If they sell server transfers whats stoping them from selling gear or max lvl characters? We thought such connection would never happen, since blizzard knows better.

    Then they removed the faction limit and sold faction changes.....ok not that big of a deal, a little bit of worry spread the forums, but most people learned to accept it.

    Now they are officially selling lvl 90 characters, even offering you a lvl 90 while the lvl 90 expansion is still out. This is officially, for me and my personal comfort level, too far. Wow has changes and so design physiology changes with it. It will continent you do so, iv spent much time in wow thinking that they made some mistakes and they will simply get back on track with the epic gameplay choices they made in the past.

    But I realize now, that im simply an outdated customer, and that few of these things are mistakes. They are simply shifts to a new style of game, one that does not catch my fancy. Im more of an oldschool RPG fan, wow back in TBC hit my personal favorite balance on the genre. Wow is still a good game to some, but its not the same game. Do I feel its fair? Not really. I wish they would open up oldschool servers to support the fans of wow past. But there are always other ways to do that.

    Blizzard seems under the impression that "less people are playing mmos in general" but I dont think that is a result of the consumer, as much as it is a result of the lack of a true mmo products. (This one could be opinion, but for me this is true, I still love mmos, I just dont know of any REAL mmos these days)
    I'd have to say the reason that fewer people are playing MMOs according to statistics because WoW was THE MMO for the longest time. The lower numbers are due to the fact that a new super-MMO hasn't introduced itself yet, although I'm kind of hoping that ESO will be it. WoW is far from dead, but no one can deny that it's dying (i.e. losing subscribers at a steady rate). I think most people, like myself, just want something new. Anything, no matter how awesome, can become old, especially when it starts pandering to demographics that it never did before. I'm still sticking around because I love MMOs so much, but there are no other ones that I want to play.

  2. #522
    Pit Lord Beet's Avatar
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    Yeah I couldn't read past the first page. I knew right away the OP would get made fun of and attacked hardcore because he dare criticizes the mighty Blizzard overlords. It's like someone said already, MMO-C don't take kindly to that kind of thinking. Not round these parts, tell ya whut.

    This doesn't surprise me. They did so many things they said they'd never do. When paid transfers came in they said they'd never let people transfer from PVE to PVP which didn't last long before they did. They always said they'd never us make both factions on the same server, just as they said they wouldn't ever give out faction changes. We got all these things. I also remember when they said the Blizzard Store would be for mounts only. Then we got pets, then we got transmog gear, then Asia got buyable potions to increase experience gained, and now we're getting to buy level 90s. So yeah get prepared for the day you can buy 'catch up' gear or something similar. Sadly the community just laps it all up and accepts it.

    Also take a look at the last few mounts they put on the Blizzard store and think of what they've put in game recently that didn't cost money. There's a pretty gigantic difference in quality. The bat addition was such an insult to many people too who had been begging Blizzard to put a bat mount in game for years. Then they do it and say it's for $$ only. Bleh
    Last edited by Beet; 2014-01-18 at 03:13 AM.

  3. #523
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylreick View Post
    They don't have to pay, that's the whole point. They have the OPTION to pay, if they desire it. It isn't needed, that's why it's considered optional. Optional things aren't meant to be free, because you can get by without it.
    Yet the fact that more and more people are bemoaning the current leveling experience suggests that it needs to be improved further, or other ideas/innovations need to be considered. Implementing this option provides little incentive to Blizzard to attempt to change or improve that.

    If it's so bad that people are telling Blizzard they would pay to skip it, ideally Blizzard should be improving the experience so people don't feel like paying to skip it, or that there are rewards related to leveling alts that comes from reaching max level (Marvel Heroes, for example, has an account wide synergy system where you can get up to 200% permanent bonus experience from leveling additional characters, so it's definitely a doable system in games with leveling). Instead, and with a lot of unfortunate encouragement, they are simply going with the easy way out and saying "Okay, pay to skip it."

    Then again, and I've not noticed anyone mentioning this, the consideration to sell level 90 boosts is really just a, in my opinion, knee-jerk response to people planning on using the 1 time boost in a round about way to gain multiple near-max level characters.

  4. #524
    i suppose those boosted characters will have full set of gear once you start playing it, otherwise if the boosted characters are equipped with lvl 1 starting gear, the wow forums will be swarmed with complaints. so then it begins, let's say the player XXX gets a lvl 90 boost with included gear, then he/she levels to lvl 100 and then again demand Blizzard that they should have an item set to buy once they reach lvl 100 to get into the current content without having to run through old raids or dungeons, for example the current patch is 6.4 and the player XXX does not want to go through 6.1,6.2 and 6.3 , therefore they will most likely ask for an item set to buy once they reach lvl 100 to get into 6.4 content.

    so my conclusion is: if they can skip leveling, why not purchasable gear to get instant access to 6.4? leveling is content and so are the patches/gear.
    and i can assure that they will start selling gear sets in future.
    Last edited by Elian; 2014-01-18 at 03:56 AM.

  5. #525
    Quote Originally Posted by Berethos08 View Post
    Yet the fact that more and more people are bemoaning the current leveling experience suggests that it needs to be improved further, or other ideas/innovations need to be considered. Implementing this option provides little incentive to Blizzard to attempt to change or improve that.

    If it's so bad that people are telling Blizzard they would pay to skip it, ideally Blizzard should be improving the experience so people don't feel like paying to skip it, or that there are rewards related to leveling alts that comes from reaching max level (Marvel Heroes, for example, has an account wide synergy system where you can get up to 200% permanent bonus experience from leveling additional characters, so it's definitely a doable system in games with leveling). Instead, and with a lot of unfortunate encouragement, they are simply going with the easy way out and saying "Okay, pay to skip it."

    Then again, and I've not noticed anyone mentioning this, the consideration to sell level 90 boosts is really just a, in my opinion, knee-jerk response to people planning on using the 1 time boost in a round about way to gain multiple near-max level characters.
    Leveling through old content isn't fun for most people. It's a hassle and a chore. I've personally had numerous friends never make it to max level to play with me, because they got bored halfway through leveling. They WANTED to keep playing, but what they wanted to do is play endgame with me, but grind through a boring chore first.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Elian View Post
    i suppose those boosted characters will have full set of gear once you start playing it, otherwise if the boosted characters are equipped with lvl 1 starting gear, the wow forums will be swarmed with complaints. so then it begins, let's say the player XXX gets a lvl 90 boost with included gear, then he/she levels to lvl 100 and then again demand Blizzard that they should have an item set to buy once they reach lvl 100 to get into the current content without having to run through old raids or dungeons, for example the current patch is 6.4 and the player XXX does not want to go through 6.1,6.2 and 6.3 , therefore they will most likely ask for item set to buy once they reach lvl 100 to get into 6.4 content.

    so my conclusion is: if they can skip leveling, why not purchasable gear to get instant access to 6.4? leveling is content and so are the patches/gear.
    and i can assure you that they will start selling gear sets in future.
    I don't know if you just haven't been paying attention, but Blizzard pretty consistently adds a way to get caught up to the current patch in often a matter of hours with pretty much every new patch.

  6. #526
    Quote Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl View Post
    oh good, a BenBos post to disect. This should be fun.

    If people can PAY to bypass levelling content, where is the encouragement for Blizzard to improve the levelling content? After all, the more people that bypass it, the more money they make. So that makes the game worse for everyone that doesn't want to give Blizzard even more money in a subscription based game.

    Don't believe the reasoning? Have a look at the low/imbalanced server situation. It has taken them years to take ANY steps to improve things, because they knew that doing so would cost them the income they get from the wildly overpriced transfers they offer.

    Oh, and using the "people that disagree with me are 13" card as well. Sad.
    They tried to improve the leveling content with the old world revamp. People still quit. Numerous others never even bothered going through it. Honestly, it was nice that Blizzard did it, but it was a colossal waste of resources. And it took the 3rd expansion for that to even happen. Prior to that, there had been absolutely no change in the leveling process. In fact, I've heard people do nothing but complain about how leveling is so easy and they wish Blizzard would change it back to the way it was (nostalgia glasses being worn, of course). The reasoning that Blizzard is going to stop paying attention to old content is fallacious. Blizzard has only ever paid attention to it once. The leveling content they'll look to improve is the leveling content that matters at that moment. Meaning the current expansion's leveling content. Every other piece of leveling content is trivial.

    What amazes me most is that everybody is complaining about Blizzard "neglecting pre-max level content" and yet nobody ever complains that Blizzard wasted resources creating a new max level raid, but has never bothered coming out with a raid for level 70 or level 80. Stupid arguments are stupid.

    As for your second argument, you use nothing to back up your statement. The reason Blizzard didn't do server merges (or whatever they want to call them) is because of the negative perception behind them. Also, they didn't want force people to randomly give up their names or guild names. This is probably the most effective way I've seen of merging servers. Since nobody else seems to have been able to do this, how do you know that Blizzard just didn't have the capability of doing it previously? You don't. So, while getting money for server transfers may be a reason, it may not be the only reason, and it also may not have been a reason at all. What other evidence tells you that Blizzard making more money is detrimental to the game itself? By all means, explain.

  7. #527
    Not a huge fan of the choice, but frankly if you don't have toons at 90 this late in the expansion than you aren't really playing the game anyway.
    For whatever reason that is, this change was aimed at you.
    Its to help players who want 90s but don't have time / are too incompetent to level.

    Unfortunately, the biggest contribution to the decline in subs isn't that people are leaving - its that people aren't joining as fast as they once were.
    This change will hopefully remedy this, while proving extra income for the game as a whole.
    More money seems fine to me, especially after coming off an expansion that has produced more content in each patch than the entirety of previous expansions. Not to mention the speed at which the content came out.

    I see MoP and the changes within as the next step for WoW, and despite the notion that eventually everything might have a price tag, I can't argue as long as the raids and content with patches stay as quality as they have been these last 3 tiers.

  8. #528
    Quote Originally Posted by Elian View Post
    i suppose those boosted characters will have full set of gear once you start playing it, otherwise if the boosted characters are equipped with lvl 1 starting gear, the wow forums will be swarmed with complaints. so then it begins, let's say the player XXX gets a lvl 90 boost with included gear, then he/she levels to lvl 100 and then again demand Blizzard that they should have an item set to buy once they reach lvl 100 to get into the current content without having to run through old raids or dungeons, for example the current patch is 6.4 and the player XXX does not want to go through 6.1,6.2 and 6.3 , therefore they will most likely ask for an item set to buy once they reach lvl 100 to get into 6.4 content.

    so my conclusion is: if they can skip leveling, why not purchasable gear to get instant access to 6.4? leveling is content and so are the patches/gear.
    and i can assure that they will start selling gear sets in future.
    One does not facilitate the other. Leveling is content. The current expansion's leveling antiquates all previous leveling content. One does not equal the other. It takes a far reaching individual to even get to that level of hyperbole.

  9. #529
    Quote Originally Posted by Glasse View Post
    Someone please explain me why the hell it matters?

    Why do you care about someone not having to level a character?

    It's like people who complain that gear is to easy to get.

    Also, using a fallacy to support your arguments is quite idiotic... and no, blizzard will not start selling gear.
    It matters because it's Blizzard taking another step in the wrong direction. Complaining is how we turn this around. Doing and saying nothing, and letting them swindle us with their stupid cash shop while still having a subscription based game that is losing quality and integrity every day, is going to kill this game.

    With that said, please no more "Either be for it or be indifferent" comments.

  10. #530
    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinator View Post
    It matters because it's Blizzard taking another step in the wrong direction. Complaining is how we turn this around. Doing and saying nothing, and letting them swindle us with their stupid cash shop while still having a subscription based game that is losing quality and integrity every day, is going to kill this game.

    With that said, please no more "Either be for it or be indifferent" comments.
    How are you being swindled by a service that doesn't require your participation?

  11. #531
    Ebay characters, Ebay characters as far as the eye can see.
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  12. #532
    Quote Originally Posted by Trubo View Post
    How are you being swindled by a service that doesn't require your participation?
    You buying a game, and paying a subscription fee, while blizzard sits back and makes content and features exclusive to a cash shop = you getting swindled.

    Content should all be in game only. That's why we pay money monthly.

  13. #533
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    That's not the same thing and the OP pointed out the difference. He said that they're officially selling them AND giving you one in the expansion. They have not said they are; they've only done a little bit of research into the possibility which doesn't mean it'll happen.
    from bliz "We’ve also heard feedback from players that they’d be interested in boosting multiple characters to 90, including alts they play with friends on other factions and realms. We’ve been evaluating ways to make that possible without having players go through roundabout methods (such as purchasing multiple boxes and performing multiple character transfers), and in the near future we’ll be testing out a feature that gives you the option to purchase a character upgrade directly. We’ll have more information to share later—including details on our character-upgrade plans for Asian regions where players don’t buy expansion boxes—but you’ll start seeing pieces of the process soon on the PTR, so keep an eye out."

    they have done more than research --they are program it into the ptr

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinator View Post
    You buying a game, and paying a subscription fee, while blizzard sits back and makes content and features exclusive to a cash shop = you getting swindled.

    Content should all be in game only. That's why we pay money monthly.
    No it isn't - look at the T & Cs you agree to --your monthly sub gives you nothing more than access to the server

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadite View Post
    My inability to read properly aside they have already added double the mounts in the cash shop. That was my initial point.
    and that's a problem because ???

    does the mounts on the store get you from point A to point B any faster than the ones obtained in game ?
    do they help you kill bosses or the other faction quicker ???
    do they help you do anything in game better than the mounts obtainable in game ???

    the answer is no to all the above

  14. #534
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    Why don't they just put it down already, game is old and they are getting really desperate for money and it is making the game and the developers look bad.

    In hindsight, WoW should have ended in wrath, when the game was the most hyped and played and we had all the celebrity advertisements and killed the biggest lore bad guy in all of warcraft.

  15. #535
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    Quote Originally Posted by docterfreeze View Post
    Why don't they just put it down already, game is old and they are getting really desperate for money and it is making the game and the developers look bad.

    In hindsight, WoW should have ended in wrath, when the game was the most hyped and played and we had all the celebrity advertisements and killed the biggest lore bad guy in all of warcraft.
    Yep, because the best time for a business to shut down its subscription based service is when it is at its most popular. Smart.

  16. #536
    Quote Originally Posted by Sul View Post
    No it isn't - look at the T & Cs you agree to --your monthly sub gives you nothing more than access to the server
    I'm coming from more of a moral stand point. Just because they put in the T&C that they have the ability to be a money hungry company that no longer provides content outside of a cash shop doesn't mean they should

    Quote Originally Posted by Sul View Post
    and that's a problem because ???

    does the mounts on the store get you from point A to point B any faster than the ones obtained in game ?
    do they help you kill bosses or the other faction quicker ???
    do they help you do anything in game better than the mounts obtainable in game ???

    the answer is no to all the above
    My mount collection is very personal to me. I'm working at getting to the 200 mount achievement. Why should i have to spend money to get there? Why can't my 15 dollars a month be used to creatively add cool mounts into the game i'm paying for instead of all my money going to a mount that i have to pay more money for?

  17. #537
    Banned docterfreeze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skizzit View Post
    Yep, because the best time for a business to shut down its subscription based service is when it is at its most popular. Smart.
    That's why I said in hindsight. As in if they knew what would happen in Cata and MoP back then, they would have shut it down.

  18. #538
    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinator View Post
    I'm coming from more of a moral stand point. Just because they put in the T&C that they have the ability to be a money hungry company that no longer provides content outside of a cash shop doesn't mean they should

    yes it does I am afraid --morally every public company ( ie those with shareholders ) has a moral and legal obligation to make as much money for their shareholders as possible .

    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinator View Post
    My mount collection is very personal to me. I'm working at getting to the 200 mount achievement. Why should i have to spend money to get there? Why can't my 15 dollars a month be used to creatively add cool mounts into the game i'm paying for instead of all my money going to a mount that i have to pay more money for?
    you don't need to buy any of the store mounts or pets to get the achievements - there are more than enough in game to get them --buy them is a choice -not essential to get them . Its totally up to you which path you take. You can only ride one mount at a time , they all do the same thing , looks don't effect usuability in any way
    Last edited by Sul; 2014-01-18 at 05:52 AM.

  19. #539
    Quote Originally Posted by Sul View Post
    yes it does I am afraid --morally every public company ( ie those with shareholders ) has a moral and legal obligation to make as much money for their shareholders as possible .



    you don't need to buy any of the store mounts or pets to get the achievements - there are more than enough in game to get them --buy them is a choice -not essential to get them . Its totally up to you which path you take
    Nice dodge there in the second answer.

  20. #540
    Is it just me or are people getting all paranoid about something that, yet again, is only related to Asia?

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