SoO Nerfs, infuriating.

[Deleted]

I should start by saying that I've never liked nerfs. (Unless it fixes broken bosses).

However, when I complained in the past, nerfs never actually affected me because I didn't raid Heroic. Now, SoO is my first Heroic tier, and I personally see it as a real goal of mine to beat Garrosh, after having tried really hard to work my way from normals at the start of MoP, to being an officer in Heroic guild. I play this game for challenge.These bosses are not impossible. My guild has almost gotten Thok down, in fact I'm almost certain he'll be going down on sunday. If he doesn't, for whatever reason, I'd rather never kill him than kill him with the help of a nerf. (We're 10 man, and got him really low, with 3 melee so it's obviously possible). I've partly helped build a guild and a raid team and now when we kill Garrosh I must, through no choice of my own, say 'Yeah we killed Garrosh, but only after the nerfs.' Could we have done it without the nerfs? Yes. This is a slap in the face.

Edit: we're only got 5 core players. This has little to do with skill and more to do with it being a new guild. Yet we've made it to 10, and probably 11, but will be forced to kill 12 with nerfs.

Edit: How about no nerfs at all? Let people get better/let people get gear (the natural nerf). Nerfs are NOT needed. If you're not good enough to get to garrosh before WoD, then that's fine. But there's plenty of time till WoD. So why nerf?

[Dracodraco]

Don't worry. If you've yet to kill thok, you will still be finding an extreme challenge in Siege, Klaxxi, and Garrosh, nerfs or no nerfs. Sorry to say, but you do have the option to go in and kill them now, pre nerf, if you really want to. If you don't, well, that just means you either weren't serious enough about it, or aren't as good as you think.

[Deleted]

Don't worry. If you've yet to kill thok, you will still be finding an extreme challenge in Siege, Klaxxi, and Garrosh, nerfs or no nerfs. Sorry to say, but you do have the option to go in and kill them now, pre nerf, if you really want to. If you don't, well, that just means you either weren't serious enough about it, or aren't as good as you think.

Or we're trying to build a core as we raid. You miss the point of the post. Thok will be going down in the next raid we have, but Siege won't, and we're forced to fight siege with nerfs next week.

[twelvethirty]

Obviously Blizzard isnt happy with the back half completion percentage. Numbers dont lie, it was far too low after four months. The players who have already cleared it will undoubtedly throw a bitchfit, and players on the bosses getting nerfed get outraged, but at least youre getting a warning and sensible nerfs and not just a flat 15% across the board nerfbomb.

[Daara]

Or we're trying to build a core as we raid. You miss the point of the post.

You're right, you're just whining that someone else might beat you guys to a kill now.

[YeahNo]

You'll have had 18 weeks to complete heroic content before these nerfs. If you couldn't get it done in 18 weeks, you aren't a bleeding-edge progression guild, which is totally fine. There's always next tier/xpac to move up into that elite group of bleeding-edge progression guilds.

[Deleted]

You're right, you're just whining that someone else might beat you guys to a kill now.

This has almost nothing to do with the thread. And actually, it makes no sense.

[Deleted]

Some targeted nerfs are fine if a specific boss is just too difficult for its position in the raid. For instance I do think that Thok 10HC needed something to put it into place... but... not this. A nerf to his interrupt screech just reduces his difficulty far more than it should. The difficult part about him is the fact that you need to balance the amount of stacks with your dps and perfect your cooldown rotations. I would say that they reduce the damage done by the fire debuff by the end of the fight in stead.

And the Siegecrafter nerfs seem far too brutal overall.

[Deleted]

You'll have had 18 weeks to complete heroic content before these nerfs. If you couldn't get it done in 18 weeks, you aren't a bleeding-edge progression guild, which is totally fine. There's always next tier/xpac to move up into that elite group of bleeding-edge progression guilds.

We've almost got a stable group, and now that we have, nerfs.

[dusselldorf]

I should start by saying that I've never liked nerfs. (Unless it fixes broken bosses).

However, when I complained in the past, nerfs never actually affected me because I didn't raid Heroic. Now, SoO is my first Heroic tier, and I personally see it as a real goal of mine to beat Garrosh, after having tried really hard to work my way from normals at the start of MoP, to being an officer in Heroic guild. I play this game for challenge.These bosses are not impossible. My guild has almost gotten Thok down, in fact I'm almost certain he'll be going down on sunday. If he doesn't, for whatever reason, I'd rather never kill him than kill him with the help of a nerf. (We're 10 man, and got him really low, with 3 melee so it's obviously possible). I've partly helped build a guild and a raid team and now when we kill Garrosh I must, through no choice of my own, say 'Yeah we killed Garrosh, but only after the nerfs.' Could we have done it without the nerfs? Yes. This is a slap in the face.

How many months have you had to kill him now?

[britishbubba]

Or we're trying to build a core as we raid. You miss the point of the post. Thok will be going down in the next raid we have, but Siege won't, and we're forced to fight siege with nerfs next week.

As someone that is currently working on siege 10 heroic. The nerfs that they have listed aren't really that important. None of them are things that wipe you on the fight after like 20 pulls anyway (except super heated damage I guess).

The fights will still be hard. Just a little less punishing healing wise from the look of it.

[Deleted]

How many months have you had to kill him now?

I'll be ignoring future posts like this at is misses the point.

[Deleted]

I agree on the nerfing front, it's not really called for and does take a sense of achievement away to know you've killed it after a nerf.
It's a shame they don't do what they did in ICC where you could disable it through speaking to an NPC or something..

In saying that, even if you did for just the sense of personal achievement, it would fuck your world rank a bit (if that's something you are bothered with), not every guild holds that same sense of value when it comes to that sorta thing.
I've not done 10man Heroic, we've only done the tier on 25Hc but I'd really be disappointed if they nerfed Garrosh more than the rest although from what I hear he is more difficult on 10man, a good bit.
The Thok Nerf I can understand for the reason they stated in the post.. Although that doesn't mean I agree it's needed.

GL anyway with the rest

[Daara]

You'll have had 18 weeks to complete heroic content before these nerfs. If you couldn't get it done in 18 weeks, you aren't a bleeding-edge progression guild, which is totally fine. There's always next tier/xpac to move up into that elite group of bleeding-edge progression guilds.

Exactly what he said.

I see a bunch of guilds that raid 2 days a week that are just as progressed as guilds that raid 5 days a week. The difference is the skill level of players. You obviously need better players. Don't blame Blizzard, blame your players.

[Krazzorx]

Some targeted nerfs are fine if a specific boss is just too difficult for its position in the raid. For instance I do think that Thok 10HC needed something to put it into place... but... not this. A nerf to his interrupt screech just reduces his difficulty far more than it should. The difficult part about him is the fact that you need to balance the amount of stacks with your dps and perfect your cooldown rotations. I would say that they reduce the damage done by the fire debuff by the end of the fight in stead.

And the Siegecrafter nerfs seem far too brutal overall.

Do we have the numbers they are reducing them by?

[Yuni]

I'll have to agree with the others here. There's been a timeframe to get where you wanted to go. If you couldn't make it there in that amount of time before nerfs for whatever reason, it happens. If you're going to stress yourself out because "it's not as much of a challenge", be my guest. It's not like it's suddenly going from surviving out in the wild with a pointy stick and a compass to being spoon fed in a royal palace.

[Deleted]

Exactly what he said.

I see a bunch of guilds that raid 2 days a week that are just as progressed as guilds that raid 5 days a week. The difference is the skill level of players. You obviously need better players. Don't blame Blizzard, blame your players.

Or, for the second time, we're only got 5 core players. This has little to do with skill and more to do with it being a new guild. Yet we've made it to 10, and probably 11, but will be forced to kill 12 with nerfs.

[UnderworldSoup]

The difficult part about him is the fact that you need to balance the amount of stacks with your dps and perfect your cooldown rotations.

In all fairness, the Thok nerfs were targeted more towards groups which do not have the cooldowns available to soak the abilities. It's an AoE physical damage nuke - not every raid composition in a 10 man has cooldowns readily available for that (especially if your tanking comp involves a Paladin, DK or Druid; or your healing comp doesn't have a Shaman or Disc Priest).

[Deleted]

And the Siegecrafter nerfs seem far too brutal overall.

The other nerfs were ok but looks like they totally gutted siegecrafter. Lower damage on Magnetic crush, overload and superheated plus turret hp and hp reduction on mines lol. Not like tanks already solo'd the last two... Guessing the kills will rain in from next week one
Wonder by how much they reduced overload, 5-6 stacks possible now ? Tank dps irrelevant ?
Can dps soak a couple stacks of superheated now ?

Lots of questions, wish they posted numbers.

[Mesec]

We've almost got a stable group, and now that we have, nerfs.

Not blizzards problem, actually.

Game is not over, you will have the next try at first WoD raids if you think you have a solid raid now. That's how raiding races work. Or maybe not, since there will be 20 man end game xDDD oh snap life sucks!