1. #11841
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    You're where I was at after the first Thor movie. Sonce then it's been hit or miss, mostly "miss" since they tend to throw away the very comic books that made the characters popular to begin with. (We won't ever get "Mutant Massacre" because that's far too heavy for Disney to do and still claim family fare. Sabretooth sniffing the air and hightailing it out of there because he catches the scent of an enraged Thor...Thor killing Blockbuster with one hammer blow to the head...
    No...we won't see Disney doing that.)
    Wont see a God Loves Man Kills either.. the best X-Men story... I don't see Disney touching that with a 10 foot pole lol
    Last edited by Orby; 2021-08-23 at 10:21 PM.
    Proof is boring. Proof is tiresome. Proof is irrelevance. People would rather be handed an easy lie than search for a difficult truth, especially when it suits their own purpose.
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    The Last Argument of Kings, The First Law Trilogy.

  2. #11842
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    Wont see a God Loves Man Kills either.. the best X-Men story... I don't see Disney touching that with a 10 foot pole lol
    The graphic novel...no. No they won't. (Magnus and Wolvie torturing one of Stryker's goons...is a bit much)

  3. #11843
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    The graphic novel...no. No they won't. (Magnus and Wolvie torturing one of Stryker's goons...is a bit much)
    Some stories they won’t, but they are giving us an r-rated Deadpool 3. Most recent word is they expect filming next year and have a tentative release date penciled into the schedule.

  4. #11844
    There's an idea...take their cues from Reynolds regarding the X-Men.

  5. #11845
    I'm not sure Marvel will go really brutally dark, but they could do R-rated stuff with Hulu/Star.

  6. #11846
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    Wont see a God Loves Man Kills either.. the best X-Men story... I don't see Disney touching that with a 10 foot pole lol
    I mean, they are doing Moon Knight. A character who canonically has their God take the form of their dead nemesis for a lot of their stories, a guy whose face Moon Knight literally cut off, and used to keep in a safe. And sometimes wear, himself.

    I have no idea how they're approaching the character, but Moon Knight generally screams R-rating way, way more than Deadpool.

    And before you say "they'd never put that on Disney+ with an R-rating", I can watch the entire set of Alien films, the male-stripper film The Full Monty, the fish-man sex story The Shape of Water, and if you want to talk just purely Marvel films, I can watch both Logan and Deadpool on there as well. Plus a lot more R-rated content.

    The only reason it's available basically everywhere but the USA is because Disney is still tied to Comcast in operating Hulu until at least 2024, and they can't easily put that content on Disney+ without violating terms with Comcast. Not because of any puritanical stance by Disney.

    Disney doesn't have any problem with R-rated content on Disney+. The only reason it doesn't have it there in the USA is the above licensing quibble.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by formerShandalay View Post
    I'm not sure Marvel will go really brutally dark, but they could do R-rated stuff with Hulu/Star.
    Seriously; there is absolutely zero reason they can't do R-rated stuff directly with Disney+. None. There is no company policy against it, nor are there any laws preventing it. It isn't even a question of needing to implement parental controls; they already have those in Disney+, they're just not activated currently for American customers because there's no need for them. There's options right in my profile where I can set it as a kids profile, or limit content by rating; right now my profile's set to allow everything, up to R-rated films and TV-MA television.
    Last edited by Endus; 2021-08-24 at 02:47 AM.


  7. #11847
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    I mean, they are doing Moon Knight. A character who canonically has their God take the form of their dead nemesis for a lot of their stories, a guy whose face Moon Knight literally cut off, and used to keep in a safe. And sometimes wear, himself.

    I have no idea how they're approaching the character, but Moon Knight generally screams R-rating way, way more than Deadpool.

    And before you say "they'd never put that on Disney+ with an R-rating", I can watch the entire set of Alien films, the male-stripper film The Full Monty, the fish-man sex story The Shape of Water, and if you want to talk just purely Marvel films, I can watch both Logan and Deadpool on there as well. Plus a lot more R-rated content.

    The only reason it's available basically everywhere but the USA is because Disney is still tied to Comcast in operating Hulu until at least 2024, and they can't easily put that content on Disney+ without violating terms with Comcast. Not because of any puritanical stance by Disney.

    Disney doesn't have any problem with R-rated content on Disney+. The only reason it doesn't have it there in the USA is the above licensing quibble.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Seriously; there is absolutely zero reason they can't do R-rated stuff directly with Disney+. None. There is no company policy against it, nor are there any laws preventing it. It isn't even a question of needing to implement parental controls; they already have those in Disney+, they're just not activated currently for American customers because there's no need for them. There's options right in my profile where I can set it as a kids profile, or limit content by rating; right now my profile's set to allow everything, up to R-rated films and TV-MA television.
    Oh yea, I guess so, it's just that all of the former Fox stuff is on Star and there's some darker movies that are not very Disney-like on there. But they might just change that up and roll it into one at some point. To me it just seems if they have a whole 'dark zone' already built in, why not just push stuff on there. On the other hand, the Marvel sub-section of Disney+ can be used just as well for darker Marvel stuff. I don't know how it would play out with Hulu, don't have that here.

  8. #11848
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    You can tell the cgi quality from a 240p recording of a phone? Weird. I’m not judging any of that until later today when it actually gets released at cinemacon.
    Sooooo can we agree that my ability to judge the quality of CGI is AMAZING?

  9. #11849
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    There's an idea...take their cues from Reynolds regarding the X-Men.
    Disney is fine witht keeping Deadpool in the R category. They may even branch off into other solo R-Rated films for other characters...but I would not count on them putting the X-Men Franchise as a whole into the R-Rated zone. And they don't really have to. There won't be much blood and Wolverine won't be dropping the F-Bomb...but he can still murder any soldiers than come to the X-Mansion looking for trouble.

  10. #11850
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    I mean, they are doing Moon Knight. A character who canonically has their God take the form of their dead nemesis for a lot of their stories, a guy whose face Moon Knight literally cut off, and used to keep in a safe. And sometimes wear, himself.

    I have no idea how they're approaching the character, but Moon Knight generally screams R-rating way, way more than Deadpool.

    And before you say "they'd never put that on Disney+ with an R-rating", I can watch the entire set of Alien films, the male-stripper film The Full Monty, the fish-man sex story The Shape of Water, and if you want to talk just purely Marvel films, I can watch both Logan and Deadpool on there as well. Plus a lot more R-rated content.

    The only reason it's available basically everywhere but the USA is because Disney is still tied to Comcast in operating Hulu until at least 2024, and they can't easily put that content on Disney+ without violating terms with Comcast. Not because of any puritanical stance by Disney.

    Disney doesn't have any problem with R-rated content on Disney+. The only reason it doesn't have it there in the USA is the above licensing quibble.

    .
    Let's be honest those were acquired properties.

    Can you name a Disney movie (or show) that handled anythign from LGBTQI+, or racial issues and done well(this is a genuine question for a knock). The best X-Men stories are those involved around prejudice and injustice and I feel that's something Disney are going to try and gloss over and just get to 'super heroes go pow pow'. also XMen never classed themselves as super heroes so I also hope Marvel doesnt ignore that also and start treating them like the mutant version fo the Avengers...

    I hear rumours they wanna try and set X-Men in modern day and may change Magneto and Xavier's backstory to be more modern seeing as World War 2 was so long ago now, you cant really make them WW2 survivors at this point, and I am fine with that. But its the handling of it I have issue with. YEs I can see them doing an R-rating, but its the handling of the subject matter... anyone can make an and R-Rated movie even Disney, but to make one competently is another thing.
    Last edited by Orby; 2021-08-24 at 07:14 AM.
    Proof is boring. Proof is tiresome. Proof is irrelevance. People would rather be handed an easy lie than search for a difficult truth, especially when it suits their own purpose.
    - Glokta
    The Last Argument of Kings, The First Law Trilogy.

  11. #11851
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    Let's be honest those were acquired properties.

    Can you name a Disney movie (or show) that handled anythign from LGBTQI+, or racial issues and done well(this is a genuine question for a knock). The best X-Men stories are those involved around prejudice and injustice and I feel that's something Disney are going to try and gloss over and just get to 'super heroes go pow pow'. also XMen never classed themselves as super heroes so I also hope Marvel doesnt ignore that also and start treating them like the mutant version fo the Avengers...

    I hear rumours they wanna try and set X-Men in modern day and may change Magneto and Xavier's backstory to be more modern seeing as World War 2 was so long ago now, you cant really make them WW2 survivors at this point, and I am fine with that. But its the handling of it I have issue with. YEs I can see them doing an R-rating, but its the handling of the subject matter... anyone can make an and R-Rated movie even Disney, but to make one competently is another thing.
    Remember The Titans did quite well and dealt with a ton of racial issues.

  12. #11852
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Remember The Titans did quite well and dealt with a ton of racial issues.
    This is true, but that was also 21 years ago. I know I shouldn't be too fussy.

    I wanna get more into it, but when we talk social issues on this forum it opens a lot of worms I do not wanna open cos people have very strong opinions.

    I will put it this way, I don't want Disney doing 'woke' without understanding the concept of what they are trying to preach. Remember when Disney tried to make Maleficent (in the movie of the same name) sympathetic, by having her being more than 'one note' and having her wings be cut off as an allegory for rape. I mean yes that's dark, but it was handled poorly. I feel this sort of cheapness is what will happen to X-Men under Disney.

    The X-Men cartoon in the 90's actually did a pretty good job in attempting to paint a dark tone on the injustice of being a mutant. And as far as adaptations go its the only one to really get it close to right.

    I actually have more faith in the new Blade movie because it falls into that same camp as Deadpool, except Deadpool is more purposely goofy and silly. the old blade movies were camp and lovable for how goofy they had aged (and I love them for it). So I hope the new blade movies capture the campness of the old Blade movies

    But when it comes to X-Men, yes I understand the X-Men have had goofy moments and have been silly in the comics, but if they wanna take some of their bigger stories to try and convert into movies, its not going to be the silly ones. And I think God Loves Man Kills can be adapted to fit a first movie because its nails down what the X-Men is. They are not super heroes, they are a race trying to survive in a world that fears and hates them.

    I other fear is I feel that like they will go the Spider-Man/Uncle Ben stuff and Disney will gloss over it because 'mutant hatred has been done to death, let's ignore it make make it a light hearted romp' because we're Disney... Especially in a time right now within the last 4 years when the X-Men is needed as a franchise more than ever. Especially with its themes. Also if anyone replies with 'durr don't make X-Men political, keep the SJW's out of X-Men' I will blow a blood vessel, because you clearly didn't not understand what X-Men was about.
    Last edited by Orby; 2021-08-24 at 08:03 AM.
    Proof is boring. Proof is tiresome. Proof is irrelevance. People would rather be handed an easy lie than search for a difficult truth, especially when it suits their own purpose.
    - Glokta
    The Last Argument of Kings, The First Law Trilogy.

  13. #11853
    I mean, the D+ series Falcon and the Winter Soldier delved pretty hard into those issues. They also lightly touched on PTSD in vets in both Bucky and John Walker, including a very "hands up, don't shoot" kind of scene at one point.

    They had a saccharine-sweet "do better" solution as an ending, but they definitely looked those issues straight in the face.

    I was more disappointed with the potential for morally grey villains who turned into actual 1 dimensional villains, which then made Sam sticking up for the one who dies at the end a bit underwhelming.

  14. #11854
    I've accepted that the MCU is essentially one of many takes on the characters. I'm not expecting a 1:1 recreation or adaptation of the comics.

    It's a totally different thing. The films are designed to reach the widest audience possible, and given that, they've done a heck of a job.

    So I'm personally happy. I can see people not digging it, but this is one of those rare circumstances where that's a very outside opinion.

    The films have appealed to critics and audiences alike, whilst also making a TON of money. So if it ain't broken, just evolve it.

  15. #11855
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    This is true, but that was also 21 years ago. I know I shouldn't be too fussy.

    I wanna get more into it, but when we talk social issues on this forum it opens a lot of worms I do not wanna open cos people have very strong opinions.

    I will put it this way, I don't want Disney doing 'woke' without understanding the concept of what they are trying to preach. Remember when Disney tried to make Maleficent (in the movie of the same name) sympathetic, by having her being more than 'one note' and having her wings be cut off as an allegory for rape. I mean yes that's dark, but it was handled poorly. I feel this sort of cheapness is what will happen to X-Men under Disney.

    The X-Men cartoon in the 90's actually did a pretty good job in attempting to paint a dark tone on the injustice of being a mutant. And as far as adaptations go its the only one to really get it close to right.

    I actually have more faith in the new Blade movie because it falls into that same camp as Deadpool, except Deadpool is more purposely goofy and silly. the old blade movies were camp and lovable for how goofy they had aged (and I love them for it). So I hope the new blade movies capture the campness of the old Blade movies

    But when it comes to X-Men, yes I understand the X-Men have had goofy moments and have been silly in the comics, but if they wanna take some of their bigger stories to try and convert into movies, its not going to be the silly ones. And I think God Loves Man Kills can be adapted to fit a first movie because its nails down what the X-Men is. They are not super heroes, they are a race trying to survive in a world that fears and hates them.

    I other fear is I feel that like they will go the Spider-Man/Uncle Ben stuff and Disney will gloss over it because 'mutant hatred has been done to death, let's ignore it make make it a light hearted romp' because we're Disney... Especially in a time right now within the last 4 years when the X-Men is needed as a franchise more than ever. Especially with its themes. Also if anyone replies with 'durr don't make X-Men political, keep the SJW's out of X-Men' I will blow a blood vessel, because you clearly didn't not understand what X-Men was about.
    I think when it comes to the X-men from the mcu's perspective you have to ask how they fit into the larger mcu universe. That's the first thing that I think had to come to their minds. So the stories aren't probably going to be lifted straight from the comics. They aren't going to be that self contained either. Their inclusion within the mcu will come out of other movies and then they are going to have to adapt them to the state of the mcu at that time. So how political or racial they get with them is up in the air I think. I don't think the political/racial implications of mutants existing has to be the major theme used in their movies. Just as it wasn't always the major theme of stories in the comics. I would say the bigger thing is just developing the characters and using some characters and storylines we haven't seen yet. Let's not rehash the same stuff over and over again.

  16. #11856
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berndorf View Post
    I think when it comes to the X-men from the mcu's perspective you have to ask how they fit into the larger mcu universe. That's the first thing that I think had to come to their minds. So the stories aren't probably going to be lifted straight from the comics. They aren't going to be that self contained either. Their inclusion within the mcu will come out of other movies and then they are going to have to adapt them to the state of the mcu at that time. So how political or racial they get with them is up in the air I think. I don't think the political/racial implications of mutants existing has to be the major theme used in their movies. Just as it wasn't always the major theme of stories in the comics. I would say the bigger thing is just developing the characters and using some characters and storylines we haven't seen yet. Let's not rehash the same stuff over and over again.
    Yes, this is another things thats been on my mind too :P
    Proof is boring. Proof is tiresome. Proof is irrelevance. People would rather be handed an easy lie than search for a difficult truth, especially when it suits their own purpose.
    - Glokta
    The Last Argument of Kings, The First Law Trilogy.

  17. #11857
    They may want to avoid the quasi-racial issue since they went down this road on AoS. And no, it doesn't matter whether AoS is canon or not, it is so closely related that the audience that has seen it (VERY widely syndicated) would already be aware of the issues in a MCU context. With not much in the way of surprises on the horizon they may well decide to go another way.

  18. #11858
    Quote Originally Posted by JDL49 View Post
    They may want to avoid the quasi-racial issue since they went down this road on AoS. And no, it doesn't matter whether AoS is canon or not, it is so closely related that the audience that has seen it (VERY widely syndicated) would already be aware of the issues in a MCU context. With not much in the way of surprises on the horizon they may well decide to go another way.
    Falcon and the Winter Soldier says hello. Let’s see what Ms. Marvel does too! Hell, Black Panther. Do people pay attention to the actual plots ever?
    Last edited by Vegas82; 2021-08-25 at 01:37 AM.

  19. #11859
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Do people pay attention to the actual plots ever?
    I am fully aware of MCU plots, thank you very much:

    1. Skybeam.
    2. Big CGI army.

  20. #11860
    Quote Originally Posted by JDL49 View Post
    They may want to avoid the quasi-racial issue since they went down this road on AoS. And no, it doesn't matter whether AoS is canon or not, it is so closely related that the audience that has seen it (VERY widely syndicated) would already be aware of the issues in a MCU context. With not much in the way of surprises on the horizon they may well decide to go another way.
    Will they? Both Falcon & Winter Soldier and Black Panther dealt with it. Not in a ham-fisted way but it was weaved into the narrative, much like issues of racism are weaved into the X-men's stories.

    Now if people are worried that they'll turn the X-men into half comedy shows like 80% of what the MCU is now, then that's a legitimate concern IMO. They should be more serious than most MCU films. But I strongly doubt Disney automatically says no to racial topics or anything along those lines.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

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