1. #13381
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    to say they just can't do it is hilariously stupid.
    What's hilariously stupid is to assume that anyone ever said that. Because nobody here did.

    And often it's not about cost-efficiency so much as it is about cinematography. Practical effects require certain setups. Scenes have to be shot a certain way. Things have to be set up in ways that facilitate those effects. That puts a big burden on the creative expression of the film, and since we're no longer in the 1950s we don't have to shoot an entire film/series in a way that allows for practical effects.

    CGI is often even the more expensive alternative to some practical effects, but it allows for FAR greater creative freedom because you can do almost anything with it.

  2. #13382
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    You have forced perspective, stunt doubles, smaller props/clothing, film overlay or splicing?(not sure whats the term I'm not a filmmaker), and I'm sure a dozen other things they have successfully done over the years. I could see arguing that practical effects wouldn't be cost effective but to say they just can't do it is hilariously stupid. Hell they could have just pulled something from the original Hulk and have two actors play the different parts they could even have Maslany dub over the She Hulk actor if they wanted to keep the same voice.
    Either of those would definitely have been preferred over what we see in the trailers. I mean, random people on the Internet are putting together stuff that looks better. Example

    But again, I'm hoping it's just a marketing gimmick and we'll get a quality closer to what we've come to expect from Marvel in the finished product. Because, honestly, there's no way the people responsible for the show haven't actually seen the fucking trailer themselves; literally everyone I know, both online and off, who've seen it have been all "wtf?" They can't be that dense, can they?
    Last edited by Infinity Cubed; 2022-05-29 at 04:40 AM.

  3. #13383
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    What's hilariously stupid is to assume that anyone ever said that. Because nobody here did.

    And often it's not about cost-efficiency so much as it is about cinematography. Practical effects require certain setups. Scenes have to be shot a certain way. Things have to be set up in ways that facilitate those effects. That puts a big burden on the creative expression of the film, and since we're no longer in the 1950s we don't have to shoot an entire film/series in a way that allows for practical effects.

    CGI is often even the more expensive alternative to some practical effects, but it allows for FAR greater creative freedom because you can do almost anything with it.
    n"ot to the degree Maslany needs to (she can't just wear platforms or stand on a box in close shots), not without forced perspective, and forced perspective has a lot of really specific limitations on cinematography."

    "As people have pointed out, there ARE ways, but they can't be used in every situation. And you can't just redo every scene to accommodate for practical effects. At some point, CGI is just the best option. And you better get that right, or things will look REALLY shit.
    "

    Bad CGI is always worse looking than bad practical effects. Jennifer Walters is 5′ 10″ Tatiana Maslany is 5′ 4″ while She Hulk is 6′7″. She doesn't even grow a full foot in height you wouldn't even need to find a smoking hot 6′7″ actress as you would get same height difference using someone like Elizabeth Debicki.

  4. #13384
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    n"ot to the degree Maslany needs to (she can't just wear platforms or stand on a box in close shots), not without forced perspective, and forced perspective has a lot of really specific limitations on cinematography."

    "As people have pointed out, there ARE ways, but they can't be used in every situation. And you can't just redo every scene to accommodate for practical effects. At some point, CGI is just the best option. And you better get that right, or things will look REALLY shit.
    "

    Bad CGI is always worse looking than bad practical effects. Jennifer Walters is 5′ 10″ Tatiana Maslany is 5′ 4″ while She Hulk is 6′7″. She doesn't even grow a full foot in height you wouldn't even need to find a smoking hot 6′7″ actress as you would get same height difference using someone like Elizabeth Debicki.
    Yeah, that sounds worse.

  5. #13385
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    Bad CGI is always worse looking than bad practical effects. Jennifer Walters is 5′ 10″ Tatiana Maslany is 5′ 4″ while She Hulk is 6′7″. She doesn't even grow a full foot in height you wouldn't even need to find a smoking hot 6′7″ actress as you would get same height difference using someone like Elizabeth Debicki.
    In the MCU, Walters isn't 5'10". She's 5'4".

    People really need to stop pulling minutiae from the comics and pretending they're true of the MCU.

    You're citing this; https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Jenni...rs_(Earth-616)

    That only applies to Earth-616 Jennifer Walters. Not the MCU version, which is Earth-199999.

    And before you cite Mysterio in Spider-Man: Far From Home saying it's Earth-616, I'll remind you he was making that shit up and literally knew nothing about other universes; it's an amusing reference, not a contradiction.

    It's weird as hell to pretend Maslany's Walters is supposed to be 5'10". They clearly don't make any effort to make her seem taller than her actual 5'4" in the trailer we've all seen now.


  6. #13386
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    And before you cite Mysterio in Spider-Man: Far From Home saying it's Earth-616, I'll remind you he was making that shit up and literally knew nothing about other universes; it's an amusing reference, not a contradiction.
    spoiler from dr strange 2:
    iirc christie also said the mcu earth is 616

  7. #13387
    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    spoiler from dr strange 2:
    iirc christie also said the mcu earth is 616
    Indeed. It was confusing as hell.

  8. #13388
    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    spoiler from dr strange 2:
    iirc christie also said the mcu earth is 616
    Which is another universe that has cataloged alternate universes, hence that is true only in their frame of reference. I’ll collect my no-prize.

  9. #13389
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Yeah, that sounds worse.
    Using another actress sounds worse than bad cgi? Why is that? Hopefully they spend more time on it and improve it so she could eventually be in the films without standing out so much compared to Hulk.


    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    In the MCU, Walters isn't 5'10". She's 5'4".

    People really need to stop pulling minutiae from the comics and pretending they're true of the MCU.

    You're citing this; https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Jenni...rs_(Earth-616)

    That only applies to Earth-616 Jennifer Walters. Not the MCU version, which is Earth-199999.

    And before you cite Mysterio in Spider-Man: Far From Home saying it's Earth-616, I'll remind you he was making that shit up and literally knew nothing about other universes; it's an amusing reference, not a contradiction.

    It's weird as hell to pretend Maslany's Walters is supposed to be 5'10". They clearly don't make any effort to make her seem taller than her actual 5'4" in the trailer we've all seen now.
    When are you ever told the height of a character in a film/tv? They don't give Robert Downey jr highheels to make him an official height they do so so he looks the height they want with the other characters he's interacting with. And I didn't say she needed to be 5' 10" I said the height difference is less than a foot and could easily be done with another actress playing the She Hulk version.


    Also MCU established that the MCU is also the 616 earth.

  10. #13390
    Yes, I saw how it looks when they do what you’re talking about. It’s just bad.

  11. #13391
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    Using another actress sounds worse than bad cgi? Why is that? Hopefully they spend more time on it and improve it so she could eventually be in the films without standing out so much compared to Hulk.
    Because your only reason to want a different actress is that she's taller, not that she can better portray the character.

    When are you ever told the height of a character in a film/tv? They don't give Robert Downey jr highheels to make him an official height they do so so he looks the height they want with the other characters he's interacting with.
    Tom Cruise does that, like, a lot.

    But regardless, we can see the height of the character. Maybe we're off by an inch or two without a tape to go by. But it's not that complicated.

    And I didn't say she needed to be 5' 10" I said the height difference is less than a foot and could easily be done with another actress playing the She Hulk version.
    Except the height difference is not "less than a foot". As we can see, on-screen. This is where you start making stuff up that has no basis in the MCU, and holding it to your personal made-up non-standard.

    Also MCU established that the MCU is also the 616 earth.
    It literally can't be. To the point that any such indication in an MCU film, like the one in Far From Home, has to be presumed to be an error or an issue of perspective.

    The characters in the MCU have wildly divergent origin stories and what story elements are borrowed are changed heavily. It's clearly not the same universe. Or Peter would've known some version of the villains that showed up in No Way Home, and he clearly didn't. Just as one super obvious example. Hell, for another; where's Uncle Ben? He's always been there in Peter's story from the start, in the Earth-616 continuity. And he's not here, in the MCU; not only just not present, but literally has never existed.

    You can't seriously claim the MCU is actually Earth-616 in the Marvel continuity.
    Last edited by Endus; 2022-05-29 at 10:08 PM.


  12. #13392
    can we just agree there is just a comic universe with all it's different earth versions and a cinemtaic universe?
    like both are seperate spheres that can't interact with each other
    or like 2 capsules: in one is the comic variant and in the other the cinematic
    basically capsule A earth-616 and caspule B earth-616

    the cinematic is just using the comic(s) as a baseline and twist it for their needs
    atleast that's how I see until marvel says anything different
    Last edited by rarhyx; 2022-05-30 at 09:44 AM. Reason: some typos

  13. #13393
    Pandaren Monk Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    In the MCU, Walters isn't 5'10". She's 5'4".

    People really need to stop pulling minutiae from the comics and pretending they're true of the MCU.

    You're citing this; https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Jenni...rs_(Earth-616)

    That only applies to Earth-616 Jennifer Walters. Not the MCU version, which is Earth-199999.

    And before you cite Mysterio in Spider-Man: Far From Home saying it's Earth-616, I'll remind you he was making that shit up and literally knew nothing about other universes; it's an amusing reference, not a contradiction.

    It's weird as hell to pretend Maslany's Walters is supposed to be 5'10". They clearly don't make any effort to make her seem taller than her actual 5'4" in the trailer we've all seen now.
    Wrong. MCU is officially called 616 now, and to go with this not connected to the same multiverse as the comics, it seems.

  14. #13394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Indeed. It was confusing as hell.
    not really. the book that stated that the MCU was Earth-19999 was written when, back in 2009? so back then they probably didn't have the plans to do multiverse, they were firmly focused on phases 1 2 and 3. so yeah basically the book is not right, what they said in the movie is right.

  15. #13395
    Quote Originally Posted by MrLachyG View Post
    not really. the book that stated that the MCU was Earth-19999 was written when, back in 2009? so back then they probably didn't have the plans to do multiverse, they were firmly focused on phases 1 2 and 3. so yeah basically the book is not right, what they said in the movie is right.
    I never disputed that the movie is right. It’s confusing to use the same designation for two different Earths. Even if one is MCU and the other is comics.

  16. #13396
    Everything it's way simpler that you are making it : the MCU exist inside the comics universe ( E-199999) but the comic universe does NOT exist inside the MCU ( or at least there's no indication or hint of it).

    Comics perspective

    Earth Prime --> E616
    MCU ---> E199999

    Films perspective

    Earth Prime --> E616
    Comics universe --> N/A

    If we are setting events the beggining of the heroic age ( at least the public part) is the FF getting hit by cosmic rays and fighting mole man in the comics and Tony Stark being kidnapped in the MCU.

    If you are in the comics universe you can travel to E-199999 at 2008 and finding Stark f¡ghting Stane but if you are in the films universe you can not travel to any point in time/space where the FF sets the beggining of the heroic age.

    And it's easy to see why the did this. For fans E616 is synonymous of main universe so if the MCU would have gone the E199999 path as main universe we could have asked: Wait...is this the Main universe then? Are we gonna find in "DrStrange 5 : Wrath of Wong" that the E616 exist and the FF started the heroic age there?

    The answer is no: they have chosen E616 as MCU main universe to set marked in fire that this is the main universe and that there's never ever be a E616 comic universe inside it.

    E616 es the Earth Prime of the MCU and will always be.
    Last edited by PrimiOne; 2022-05-30 at 10:47 AM.

  17. #13397
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    I never disputed that the movie is right. It’s confusing to use the same designation for two different Earths. Even if one is MCU and the other is comics.
    Why? We also have Earth-1 for the DC comics and Earth-1 for the DC movies, etc. Nothing confusing about it.

  18. #13398
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    Why? We also have Earth-1 for the DC comics and Earth-1 for the DC movies, etc. Nothing confusing about it.
    The DC movies haven’t discussed the multiverse yet. The CW shows did, but the literal reason behind it was “I like how Earth Prime sounds, so we’re just using that.” And they didn’t release official materials stating a different number before deciding to make Mysterio the multiverse’s greatest guesser.

    I’m not saying it was impenetrable, just a confusing choice to retcon it to 616 canonically.

  19. #13399
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    The DC movies haven’t discussed the multiverse yet. The CW shows did, but the literal reason behind it was “I like how Earth Prime sounds, so we’re just using that.” And they didn’t release official materials stating a different number before deciding to make Mysterio the multiverse’s greatest guesser.

    I’m not saying it was impenetrable, just a confusing choice to retcon it to 616 canonically.
    It's not really a retcon, 616 was already used in one of the Thor movies a while before FFH. Mysterio can just have gotten that info from Selvig's theories.

    616 was always the prime earth of marvel comics, so it makes sense that the MCU prime earth is also 616. Now we only need the mutants and F4 movie because right now, 838 looks more comic accurate to comics 616 than our current one. I'm guessing the F4 are somewhere trapped in the quantum realm while the mutants are currently hiding on Krakoa to go with Hickman's House of X arcs.

  20. #13400
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    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    spoiler from dr strange 2:
    iirc christie also said the mcu earth is 616
    I thought the MCU was Earth-199999. How is that even possible that it is 616... unless the MCU start speaking in comic panels, which would be hilarious. lol.

    To even cross the MCU with the 616 universe would be impossible as they are two different mediums
    Last edited by Orby; 2022-05-30 at 02:00 PM.
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