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  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by fangless View Post
    Except it was extremely boring, and it's was no more or less engaging than frost.
    Because opinion isn't completely subjective or anything.

    I played Blood DPS from start of WotLK til the end since the other 2 specs I found boring. Even to the point now where I still only play Blood. Even though it is only for tanking.

    I would very much be for it.
    Bow down before our new furry overlords!

  2. #282
    Quote Originally Posted by Instructor Soki View Post
    It doesn't matter whether you think it was "engaging" or not - Blood was played as DPS before. Protection has never been played as DPS.
    Blood should get the ability to pick a talent and be DPS over Protection.
    This.

    Like I said, I have no issue with Gladiator Stance. I think it's a cool talent. Blood Dk's should simply have priority when it comes to being a viable dps. Not giving them something similar is wrong in my opinion.

  3. #283
    Quote Originally Posted by nyc81991 View Post
    What I don't understand is why Warriors are getting Gladiator Stance but Dk's aren't getting anything to make Blood a viable dps. I mean Blood DK's literally were a dps spec in Wotlk. They deserve to get that back over giving a totally different class that ability.
    Because Monks, DKs and Bears can all easily swap to DPS with their tanking gear on in WoD. Prot would have to pick up a 2h to do so. This allows them to use the gear they wear to DPS, which every other tank (save Paladin) can do. A better argument would be this: why are Paladins now the only tank that can't DPS with their tank gear in WoD?

  4. #284
    Pit Lord Ferg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Instructor Soki View Post
    It doesn't matter whether you think it was "engaging" or not - Blood was played as DPS before. Protection has never been played as DPS.
    Blood should get the ability to pick a talent and be DPS over Protection.
    Nooooo.

    2h STR dps already exists. There is no 1h / shield STR dps in the game. This is new territory. There are ppl (myself included) who have wanted that style of gameplay for years
    ill probably be infracted for this post

  5. #285
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Frankly, i don't think this has anything to do with warriors so much as somebody being jealous of somebody else getting something she or he perceives as having lost. That the somebody getting it is a warrior is incidental.
    Don't forget Bears and Cats both lost half of their abilities and gained nothing in return, effectively both now being half-specs.

    Are Warriors willing to give up half of their abilities to gain Gladiator stance?

  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by YeahNo View Post
    Because Monks, DKs and Bears can all easily swap to DPS with their tanking gear on in WoD. Prot would have to pick up a 2h to do so. This allows them to use the gear they wear to DPS, which every other tank (save Paladin) can do. A better argument would be this: why are Paladins now the only tank that can't DPS with their tank gear in WoD?
    Retribution and Prot Paladins share a lot of the same stats. Blood Dk's actually use to be a dps spec unlike any other tank spec. They have a right to have the option of dpsing. Removing it entirely was a mistake by Blizzard.

  7. #287
    Quote Originally Posted by Bearshield View Post
    Good Druid tanks had been switching to cat to dps when not tanking since vanilla, and up until MoP, that was how we were expected to play. Suddenly at the end of Cata this practice went from being considered normal to considered OP and our versatility was gutted for MoP. So please tell me why now it is completely acceptable for Warriors to gain what we lost for WoD? For those who don't know what I'm talking about, this is Gladiator Stance:

    Gladiator's Resolve (Protection) - Increases the damage reduction provided by Defensive Stance by 5%.
    Also allows you to forgo your defensive role, and instead focus only on offensive capabilities, by replacing Battle Stance with Gladiator Stance. Gladiator Stance - A dauntless combat stance. Increases physical damage dealt by 20%, and replaces your Shield Block with Shield Charge. You cannot change into or out of this stance during combat.
    Passive
    Shield Charge
    20 Rage, 10 yd range, Instant, 15sec recharge, Requires Shields
    Raise your shield and charge a short distance to your target, increasing the damage of Shield Slam, Revenge, and Heroic Strike by 30% for 6 sec. Maximum 2 charges.

    It is essentially quite similar to Bear-Cat, especially when you take into account that ALL tanks will be using dps gear in WoD. Yes, they can not change in or out of the stance during combat, but they also do not need to worry about changing specs, glyphs, or gear to utilize this either. I know most people don't care, I know for years I detested being a Bearcat and often forced into the OT role because of it but 'the grass isn't always greener', and I miss Feral being one spec. We gained absolutely nothing in the split, but lost our versatility and our identity imo.


    Because Warriors are a pure DPS class treated like a hybrid because of having a TANK spec. It's about time they got this. I hope it works. I'd prefer a 4th spec instead of 1 talent changing the course of a spec.

  8. #288
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    The most important difference is that you can not swap in and out of gladiator stance during combat. You can shapeshift as a Druid during combat.

    The way it is implemented now makes it both a 1 button switch outside of combat, although one in the form of a talent/stance and the other as a specialisation.

  9. #289
    Pit Lord Ferg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddabear View Post
    Don't forget Bears and Cats both lost half of their abilities and gained nothing in return, effectively both now being half-specs.

    Are Warriors willing to give up half of their abilities to gain Gladiator stance?
    Half spec? You realize that after the new item upgrade changes go through, Feral is going to be the #1 dps in the entire game when using their advanced rotation, right?

    Sounds like a "half spec" to me....not.

    Quit being mad that they finally are going to allow 1h / shield DPS. It's been needed for quite some time, and Warrior is the class that it makes the most sense for this to happen to first.
    ill probably be infracted for this post

  10. #290
    Quote Originally Posted by nyc81991 View Post
    Retribution and Prot Paladins share a lot of the same stats. Blood Dk's actually use to be a dps spec unlike any other tank spec. They have a right to have the option of dpsing. Removing it entirely was a mistake by Blizzard.
    Fact is, if Glad Stance makes it to live Prot Paladins will be the only tanks that can't swap to DPS with the gear they wear to tank; they'll have to pick up a 2h. Not a huge deal, but it'd be nice if they didn't have to have two weapons.

    Glad stance is a good solution, imo. Just one that I'd like to see given to Paladins as well. Once that's been taken care of then maybe Blood DPS can be a thing, but given they can go 2h Frost or UH, it's just not as important as giving Warriors and Paladins a way to DPS without taking a weapon away from another raid member.

  11. #291
    Deleted
    As for allowing another spec to Dks. It would make a lot more sense to have a prot stance that allows frost to tank with two 1h weapons.
    That would be something new (also useless IMO but still). I'd certainly roll a Blood elf Dk just for that #yolotankspec.
    Last edited by mmocf4af30eb25; 2014-05-19 at 12:56 PM.

  12. #292
    I am not sure what is confusing the OP.

    Blizzard does not want tanks to be able to outperform the DPS on most fights (some fights will be an exception).
    Hence the vengeance changes coming in WoD (it being removed since it causes tank dps to be too high).

    Paladin tanks were not able to "slap on a 2h" and go nutz during a boss fight.
    Warrior tanks were not able to "slap on a 2h" and go nutz during a boss fight.
    Death Knight tanks could not increase their damage output regardless of weapon/stance swaps.

    Only druid tanks were capable of shifting mid combat to a "almost-full" DPS mode.

    If you do not see that as a balance issue then i really don't know what more you want us to say...

  13. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyc81991 View Post
    What I don't understand is why Warriors are getting Gladiator Stance but Dk's aren't getting anything to make Blood a viable dps. I mean Blood DK's literally were a dps spec in Wotlk. They deserve to get that back over giving a totally different class that ability.
    Just to be clear, because Blood would play very similarly with a DPS presence when compared to its tanking presence (and suffers the same hybrid issues that warriors do), I'd totally support this. I can think of no reasonable reason why it can't happen.

  14. #294
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Zellviren View Post
    Just to be clear, because Blood would play very similarly with a DPS presence when compared to its tanking presence (and suffers the same hybrid issues that warriors do), I'd totally support this. I can think of no reasonable reason why it can't happen.
    Umm... why do this in the first place? Blood's blood. Go F/U if you want to deeps. Sure, Glad Stance will bring more shine to that class itself, but why can't it have something that other classes do not? In PvE it prolly will not matter at all, and no serious raider would go "tank deeps" for a fight, just because it is easier than to switch specs and gear. That just will not happen.

    However, in PvP (rated) battlegrounds there will be an interesting impact, IMHO.

  15. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by critsom View Post
    Umm... why do this in the first place? Blood's blood. Go F/U if you want to deeps. Sure, Glad Stance will bring more shine to that class itself, but why can't it have something that other classes do not? In PvE it prolly will not matter at all, and no serious raider would go "tank deeps" for a fight, just because it is easier than to switch specs and gear. That just will not happen.

    However, in PvP (rated) battlegrounds there will be an interesting impact, IMHO.
    The "why" is pretty simple.

    Because I suspect a lot of DK players would enjoy it.

    That's the best reason there is to do something, assuming it can be balanced around, and I've no doubt it can.

  16. #296
    You know why they're doing it for Warriors? Because it's easy. They're only changing a single ability aside from the stance itself, and that one is something they've done before already.

  17. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Yeah, you're clueless.

    You cannot change into or out of this stance during combat.

    That's the difference.

    /thread, get lost.
    Dude, you're really mean.

  18. #298
    Gladiator stance is basically a 4th spec for Warriors. It's a pure Dps spec, based around 1h+Shield (where Arms is 2h and Fury is DW).

    Has nothing to do with Prot Tanking, and it has about as much in common with the old Bear/Cat spec, as a Mage...


    From reading what the OP is posting, his biggest complaint is that they have to change a stance instead of changing a spec. Wow, such jealousy towards the Warriors who can change their spec 2 seconds faster than the rest of us, rofl. And no, they can't Dps in the same gear and glyphs. You WILL want to use Dps trinkets for Gladiator, not Prot. Glad Dps will also very likely not be stacking the same stats as Prot Tanks. Glyphs will be changed to suite a different role aswell.



    With how similar it is to what feral lost, it has a lot of old school ferals watching it closely and many feel like they are getting what was taken from us in a new flavor.
    You guys REALLY need to actually read what the fuck Gladiator stance actually does. It's not the same as Bear/Cat Druids, it's not similair or in any way compareable. As already said (read above); Gladiator stance has about as much in common with your old Druid spec as a Mage.

    Blood was played as DPS before. Protection has never been played as DPS.
    Blood Dps is still in the game. It's called 2h Frost. If it's the "feeling" you want, and not the gameplay, I'm sure there are addons out there that can change the names of your spells to what they were in WotLK!
    Last edited by ThrashMetalFtw; 2014-05-21 at 04:00 AM.
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  19. #299
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Raugnaut View Post
    I was a bearkitty from WotLK->Cata, bearkitty with resto spec. Loved it, was sad to see it go.

    Gladiator stance though is NOT the same as Bearkitty. You either are 100% tank, or you are 100% dps with it. The main problem with bearkitty was that you were like 90% tank AND 90% dps at the same time, allowing you to do 90% of a dps's dps when offtanking (back when tanks did like 40% of a dps's dps when offtanking), and 90% of a tank's tanking when main tanking (which was more then enough for practically all fights).

    In DS especially, a bear-kat was very good for heroic spine (where you would tank the amalgamation and then kat-burst the tendon, extra burst could help with getting a tendon down in one go), heroic madness (you only had to tank big tentacles, hemo, and horrors), and a good number of previous fights in the tier. So you basically had an extra dps AND tank, or 2 tanks/7 dps/2 heals essentially.

    Glad Stance is either dps OR tank. It IS kinda cheating though, as warriors essentially get 3 specs with dual spec (Prot tank, Prot dps, and Arms or Fury)
    This.

    Btw, you can still switch to cat form in combat, even if you're Guardian :3
    Last edited by mmoc3976077be9; 2014-05-21 at 06:49 AM.

  20. #300
    Quote Originally Posted by critsom View Post
    Umm... why do this in the first place? Blood's blood. Go F/U if you want to deeps. Sure, Glad Stance will bring more shine to that class itself, but why can't it have something that other classes do not? In PvE it prolly will not matter at all, and no serious raider would go "tank deeps" for a fight, just because it is easier than to switch specs and gear. That just will not happen.

    However, in PvP (rated) battlegrounds there will be an interesting impact, IMHO.
    At 14/14H I find myself to be a fairly serious raider and i fully intend to main spec glad as long as it is made competitive as they have said it would be. To me it just makes good sense. I would use bonus armor off pieces giving a 3rd person to use those items full time and tank shields so that 2 people in my raid would have a use for that (from what i have read weps n offhands dont change stats with spec) It gives more purpose to a niche gear set I don't see why every guild wouldn't want a dps to be Glad once again assuming they meet the goal of having it do the same dps as the other specs

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