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  1. #21
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    PM me with your battle.tag, I'll organise a Garrosh nhc kill on Monday or Tuesday. This requires you playing on EU servers, and of course ilvl 550 (without cloak).

  2. #22
    Higher gear level = higher probability that the person behind the character can play his class.
    Unless you form a raid through openraid, you will find lots of players in 550 gear who fail utterly on Garrosh. Sad but true.
    Last edited by Mikael123; 2014-04-27 at 10:35 AM.

  3. #23
    Immortal TEHPALLYTANK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zxzas View Post
    I'm locked to Paragons, I just want to kill Garrosh. Why isn't 550 ilvl enough? I understand having the legendary cloak is a very healthy dps increase but c'mon. It is manageable without it. I can still do 200k dps without it, oh and I have to link my achievement too? Give me a break. I get you don't want to sit there and wipe x number of times, I just want my kill for the week.

    "LFM N GARROSH KILL 560+ ilvl"
    "LFM N GARROSH KILL PST ACHIEVE 550+ LEGENDARY CLOAK REQUIRED"

    Hey guys, don't quit playing WoW when you are in the middle of your legendary quest line. The end expansion pugs will be a pain in the ass to get into because you *NEED* it.

    *yes I have a guild, we only raid 2 nights a week, 4-5 hours max between the 2 days, killed siegecrafter and called it*

    I'M CRY IF I DON'T GET MY WOLF MOUNT.
    So...you're in a crap guild and people don't want to take you because they can see your guild still hasn't down N Garrosh this far in to the tier? And in addition you don't have your legendary cloak (which goes a hell of a long way towards showing dedication) and can't simply wait until you get the cloak? Excuse me while I start to ooze apathy in response to your complaints.
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  4. #24
    Pit Lord Denkou's Avatar
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    I saw someone posting in trade chat LFM for flex 1 and he wanted 550+. When I called him out on it he quite literally told me to QQ and get more gear. I told him I had already done my flex anyway and don't need his group and that I was just mocking his ridiculous ilvl requirement, then he continues to go on to call me a scrub, lol.

    The problem with the community at large is that people often associate ilvl with skill or competency, which is true to a certain extent. I've seen plenty of players with 550, 560+ ilvl who still don't know how to play their class properly or are outperformed by those with much lower ilvl.

  5. #25
    High Overlord Niight9's Avatar
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    Yesterday i saw someone asking for ppl ilvl 560+ in order to make ToT Hm ....
    C'était mieux demain !

  6. #26
    The Insane Revi's Avatar
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    550 is more than enough, but most pugs want to overgear it to make up for the disadvantage that comes with pugging.

    Two weeks ago I pugged 10-man Garrosh normal mode, I solo tanked while a paladin solo healed, she was only 552 but an amazing player.. Would take that healer over two 570 with avarage skill any day.

    Best bet is Openraid or creating your own pug, just know that if you create a pug you'll need to be able to raidlead. Explain which tactic you're using and know how to follow it. Once you get the Ahead of the Curve achiv finding pugs should get a lot easier, it's just a challenge getting that first kill.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Niight974 View Post
    Yesterday i saw someone asking for ppl ilvl 560+ in order to make ToT Hm ....
    They want a smooth and fast run, not progress. I personally wouldn't bring any 540ers to ToT hc rush either.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Zxzas View Post
    Who doesn't use OpenRaid? And I'm not making my own group because I'm a follower, not a leader.
    This is exactly why you are stuck until you obtain the leader's requirements. The problem is that there are many, many more followers than their are leaders. That means the leaders have their pick on who to bring. If the leaders out there weren't getting 560 or 550+Cloak, they would ask for lower - but there are players out there in line with you who have 560 or 550+cloak to pick from. So the real question boils down to, why should any leader pick you over someone 10 iLvls higher than you?

    Also, for anyone saying "link kill".... you can easily buy a N Garry kill, so that 'chieve doesn't necessarily mean you know what you are doing. Beside the fact that so many guilds have their own methods of killing him.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Denkou View Post
    I saw someone posting in trade chat LFM for flex 1 and he wanted 550+. When I called him out on it he quite literally told me to QQ and get more gear. I told him I had already done my flex anyway and don't need his group and that I was just mocking his ridiculous ilvl requirement, then he continues to go on to call me a scrub, lol.

    The problem with the community at large is that people often associate ilvl with skill or competency, which is true to a certain extent. I've seen plenty of players with 550, 560+ ilvl who still don't know how to play their class properly or are outperformed by those with much lower ilvl.
    So what?

    Where do you link skill or competency level? So are you suggesting raid leaders ask for lower iLvl and Gold Proving grounds?

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by TEHPALLYTANK View Post
    So...you're in a crap guild and people don't want to take you because they can see your guild still hasn't down N Garrosh this far in to the tier? And in addition you don't have your legendary cloak (which goes a hell of a long way towards showing dedication) and can't simply wait until you get the cloak? Excuse me while I start to ooze apathy in response to your complaints.

    Yeah, screw that casual, finding it stupid that people demand a higher ilvl than what is actually needed. Also, screw him for thinking it would be pretty horrible if a raid leader basically asks for a boost by asking for higher ilevels than his own (in case that is true). Screw him for thinking PuG leaders should be less scummy than to make him link achievements for a raid he wants to do and hasn't done yet.



    Nice post, giggles!

  10. #30
    Don't cry wolf bro.

    I cry everytiem. No copy pasterino.
    Stay salty my friends.

  11. #31
    Herald of the Titans Murderdoll's Avatar
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    Look, as much as it sucks, i have no sympathy.

    Back in ICC it was 5000+ Gear Score. Back in DragonSoul it was probably something as well (didnt play DS very long) and in SoO, its cloak and 550 ilvl. Pug leaders do this to idiot proof their raids as much as they can. This is not new, it will never end.

    If I had to pug a few raiders to finish off a N Garrosh kill for the week, id want it down quickly as possible so I can do other stuff. I dont want to help people progress, thats not my job nor is it my responsibility. My responsibility is to the rest of my guild/run and we dont want to be wasting time on potential fail pugs.

    You said youre not a leader youre a follower.

    Thats fine, but dont judge the people who lead. Because they know how to filter people out to make sure they have statistically the best chance of a trouble free run.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fincher View Post
    Well personally I think it is bad game design from Blizzard to require pugs having the ilvl which drops in the same instance that the end boss is.
    Its not Blizzards fault at all. Blizzard has put the tools in for people without guilds to play this game. LFR and Flex are there for this reason. This guy is in a guild who cannot down Garrosh, how is it Blizzards fault that PLAYERS want a specific ilvl before they will carry people to a kill?

    Seriously, the cloak at this point is so easy to obtain and you dont have it, you have no garrosh kill, you dont have the ilvl. Why on earth should people carry you?
    Last edited by Murderdoll; 2014-04-27 at 12:57 PM.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Murderdoll View Post
    Look, as much as it sucks, i have no sympathy.

    Back in ICC it was 5000+ Gear Score. Back in DragonSoul it was probably something as well (didnt play DS very long) and in SoO, its cloak and 550 ilvl. Pug leaders do this to idiot proof their raids as much as they can. This is not new, it will never end.

    If I had to pug a few raiders to finish off a N Garrosh kill for the week, id want it down quickly as possible so I can do other stuff. I dont want to help people progress, thats not my job nor is it my responsibility. My responsibility is to the rest of my guild/run and we dont want to be wasting time on potential fail pugs.

    You said youre not a leader youre a follower.

    Thats fine, but dont judge the people who lead. Because they know how to filter people out to make sure they have statistically the best chance of a trouble free run.
    Why can't he judge these people who lead? They willingly put up such stupid and unfair qualifications. Sure you can't stop it, and sure it is their own choice, as leaders, and their right to do so. But that doesn't mean we can't form opinions about them based on that? It's scummy, and it's fair for me or anyone else to think that a raid leader putting up such requirements is scummy. They're looking for a boost, not a fair run, and I will treat them as such. Fair game, just as it is fair game for them to make up the rules of their raid.

  13. #33
    Killed it via openraid on my(at that point) 545 disc. Me having 11 hc kills at that point did help though. People want players who can do the encounter, and if you don't have the experience for it you'll have to compensate with gear I suppose.

    Ps: 4-5 hours and not killed garrosh isnt an excuse. We raid 7.5(3x 2.5) and are on HC Paragons. There are plenty of guilds below 10 hours a week that raid heroic, The Horseman has a top 50(iirc) hc garrosh kill with 9 hours...
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  14. #34
    Herald of the Titans Nutri's Avatar
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    I can't get any groups because I don't have Curve either. My guild wipes at 5%, giving me headaches. I'm ilvl 556, but still Curse is a necessity it seems.

    What's so retarded about it, is that if I bought a kill while doing nothing but /afk and eat popcorn I'd have Curve, and with that it means jack sh*t if I 'know' the encounter or not.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Necrot View Post
    I can't get any groups because I don't have Curve either. My guild wipes at 5%, giving me headaches. I'm ilvl 556, but still Curse is a necessity it seems.

    What's so retarded about it, is that if I bought a kill while doing nothing but /afk and eat popcorn I'd have Curve, and with that it means jack sh*t if I 'know' the encounter or not.
    well then maybe u should consider it as investment - if the kills go for liek 10-15k u can eaisly make it over few night playing and farming - hell if u collected sky shards and sold alani u coudl probably make much mroe gold over 2-3 farm night (from both dragon and stuff u could get from potions for luck) then is needed for this AoTC fos //shrug

  16. #36
    The Insane Revi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarathir View Post
    Why can't he judge these people who lead? They willingly put up such stupid and unfair qualifications. Sure you can't stop it, and sure it is their own choice, as leaders, and their right to do so. But that doesn't mean we can't form opinions about them based on that? It's scummy, and it's fair for me or anyone else to think that a raid leader putting up such requirements is scummy. They're looking for a boost, not a fair run, and I will treat them as such. Fair game, just as it is fair game for them to make up the rules of their raid.
    You might not think it's fair, but it's certainly not stupid. You might be able to play well and follow tactics on your flex geared char, but the majority of puggers cant.

    It's as stupid as businesses hiring people with a Harvard degree over someone with community college. They have NO way to know how you'll actually perform, the only thing they can judge you from is your past performances ad credentials, and that's exactly what they do.
    The raids are being filled just fine, so why would they exclude someone who's proven they can do it on normal/heroic in favor of someone who's only ever done flex/LFR? That would be stupid.

    And not fair? They choose the players that have worked the hardest (believe it or not, normal/heroics take more work than flex). Rewarding those that put in the most effort is EXACTLY what fairness is about

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Revi View Post
    You might not think it's fair, but it's certainly not stupid. You might be able to play well and follow tactics on your flex geared char, but the majority of puggers cant.

    It's as stupid as businesses hiring people with a Harvard degree over someone with community college. They have NO way to know how you'll actually perform, the only thing they can judge you from is your past performances ad credentials, and that's exactly what they do.
    The raids are being filled just fine, so why would they exclude someone who's proven they can do it on normal/heroic in favor of someone who's only ever done flex/LFR? That would be stupid.

    And not fair? They choose the players that have worked the hardest (believe it or not, normal/heroics take more work than flex). Rewarding those that put in the most effort is EXACTLY what fairness is about

    It's a game. Choosing to get yourself boosted by making higher requirements than those actually existing gives me all the right to judge you and your behavior. It's not as if you were forced into making stupid requirements. And choosing the players that worked the hardest? You mean those that can more effectively boost them?


    Nope, I can find it just as silly and lazy as I want, and I will. =)

  18. #38
    Still have 6 months+ of SOO left, don't worry about it.
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  19. #39
    the problem is not ilevel, its bad players. Alot of players are getting to the 550 ilevel now that are very bad players, I meet players that are 560 and can barley pull 140k... my 510 Mage can pull 145k

  20. #40
    The Insane Revi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarathir View Post
    It's a game. Choosing to get yourself boosted by making higher requirements than those actually existing gives me all the right to judge you and your behavior. It's not as if you were forced into making stupid requirements. And choosing the players that worked the hardest? You mean those that can more effectively boost them?


    Nope, I can find it just as silly and lazy as I want, and I will. =)
    No, I mean those that worked the hardest. I'm not saying no one tries to be boosted, but in the vast majority of pugs I've done, the raid leader is among the best, which is why they feel confident raidleading. It's not about being boosted, it's about not wanting to boost others.

    When I make pugs with guildies, we overgear the content and have it on farm, but we still invite the best players we can get because why wouldn't we? I want to go in, spend 30 seconds on tactics, and get a kill. I don't want to turn good players away in favor of bad ones, just so tactics takes ages to explain and the boss dies 5 minutes slower.

    I honestly don't get how you can rationally justify calling others lazy and silly for not declining the best players in favor of worse ones.

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