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  1. #121
    Because Blizzard wasn't under fire from everyone and their mom about how steep the time investment is to participate in the main parts of the game. You never hear anyone say anymore that you have to have no life to play wow anymore. If anyone does say it anymore it's nothing more than trolling. There are guilds that raid once a week that have cleared heroic content. Now everything is basically a solo adventure with minimal effort on your part to have to put together a group for anything (that requires it) and you aren't tethered to an assigned schedule for the most part. By doing all of this and caving into the casuals, that I don't honestly think give a fuck about the genre, the game lost it's soul.

  2. #122
    The "community" pretty much all decided they had to be assholes/fail-trolls at all times. For many years now on my server you basically cannot use tradechat for what it's meant for unless you want 20 people jumping down your throat trying to tell you off for daring to use tradechat for anything but terrible attempts at trolling. Nobody can ask a question anymore, and god help you if you accidently spell something wrong. Everyone appears to think they have to be some kind of asshole-ish troll at all times to every person. The WoW community followed the natural progression of the internet...as in, everyone wants to be cool/funny/a dick, whether or not they have a talent for it. That is what ruined the WoW community to me, maybe if i was a 12 year old kid it wouldn't bother me as much...but the sad thing is most all of these fail trolls are usually adults.

  3. #123
    Convenience comes at a cost. LFD, cross-realm pvp, lower raid sizes, LFR, all mechanisms to make engaging with the game easier, quicker, and with less hassle. At the same time they also diminish the community aspect of the game. I am not saying any of those things were bad additions to the game, I am saying they came at a cost.

    Rose tinted or not, I can say for certain I played with more people and knew more people on my server in Vanilla than I do today. Whether you think 40 man raids was a bad experience or not, at the very least you were forced to engage for 40+ people if you wanted to raid. I know I enjoyed it, guilds were much larger and much more active. Cross-realm pvp also pretty much killed that aspect of the game for me. Entering games against complete strangers was not really fun. My favorite aspect of pvp was going up against people you knew. Having that guy that made you stop everything you were doing and go after that, because that guy sucks. Having people level rogues just to gank a certain Warlord in Orgrimmar all day.

    So yes, its easier to raid, its quicker to pvp and those are all good things. But I don't know the people I am pvp'ing against, and I don't really care about them. Suddenly my entire goal is to make it as quick as possible, win or lose. I raid with 25 people in LFR, but I don't know them. I don't care about them. And I won't see them again. I am in a 10 man guild, because thats all I need, there is no reason to engage with anyone else outside those 10 people.

  4. #124
    Herald of the Titans Xisa's Avatar
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    Wrath of the Lich King was not "when the game was brand new".

    The Degradation of the game community began with LFG, when you got the ability to queue into instances with people from other servers who you would never meet again, and therefore no socialization. The further the game has gone in that direction, the less social it has become.

    It's the equivalent from being in a small town or small city where you know everyone, to a huge city where despite there being a ton of people, everyone is a stranger.
    I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes
    Or should I?

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Xisa View Post
    Wrath of the Lich King was not "when the game was brand new".

    The Degradation of the game community began with LFG, when you got the ability to queue into instances with people from other servers who you would never meet again, and therefore no socialization. The further the game has gone in that direction, the less social it has become.
    LFD was added because, at that point in Wrath, almost no one was running heroic 5 mans. It just wasn't worth it, especially if they took any significant amount of time to assemble a group.

    Games that have tried to get away without an LFD since then have quickly added it. It's not optional, and really never was optional.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on." -- Ghostcrawler
    "Do you want a game with no casuals so about 500 players?"

  6. #126
    Deleted
    There were not 29.904.381 servers to choose from when making a new character...

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Sussex View Post
    I remember starting WoW in Nov 2004 with a bunch of people I played SWG (star wars galaxies) with back in 2003/early 2004.

    The world/game in general felt thriving and huge to me...even coming from another MMORPG..

    I'd say this feeling lasted from 2004-2007

    NOTE: I am not saying the game was BETTER OR WORSE, im just saying it felt more "alive", the game is far better now...to a gaming point of view...tons more things to do, tons more features....a lot more things fixed...many useless things now playable...i am not denying this fact

    Now when I log into the game I just feel like im walking around in a museum or something....the game just feels dead...even though theres MILLIONs of more subscribers...I wish I could explain it better but I guess you sort of have to be around MMORPGs a long time.


    I am not talking about inner guild communities...thats normal..im talking about the community as 1 entity...it seems dead. And please don't think your private raiding guild chatter/banter makes up for this....i am talking about server wide community here.
    More people on the ground the more interactions you'll have, feels more full. Even seeing people without communicating is stimulating in the sense you don't feel alone and it ain't so empty. It encourages social interaction regardless of a personal choice to not do so. Being on the ground in general requires more thinking and brain activity. Flying is incredibly mind numbing. Most of my memories come from earlier days of WoW when things were more robust and more ground activity. Since then it's changed into sitting in cities and flying, it's horrible. the way it's effected peoples decision making and interactions. So glad it's finally getting addressed.

  8. #128
    Herald of the Titans Xisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    LFD was added because, at that point in Wrath, almost no one was running heroic 5 mans. It just wasn't worth it, especially if they took any significant amount of time to assemble a group.

    Games that have tried to get away without an LFD since then have quickly added it. It's not optional, and really never was optional.
    It was certainly optional, it was just more convenient.

    It's like flying: It was a mistake, but it seemed like a good idea at the time. They have both caused irreparable damage to the game, and neither can be taken away because the lowest common denominator likes it too much.

    They are experimenting with removing flying from "progression" areas, and I'd like to see how it works. The sense of community that existed prior to patch 3.3 was pretty awesome.
    I thought what I'd do was, I'd pretend I was one of those deaf-mutes
    Or should I?

  9. #129
    This may have already been pointed out, but *maybe* because there were far fewer servers and there was only Kalimdor & Eastern Kingdoms... probably about 1/3rd of the size the world is now. And all of these people crammed into a much smaller area were walking around rather than flying and crashing my computer because Ironforge was way too crowded :P

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by Wowalixi View Post
    Right, let's bring back enchanters who charged outrageous prices for their services, that you had to portal to in order to get your enchant done, and god forbid you need a rare enchant and the only three people on the server who can do it aren't responding in trade.

    Buying enchants on the AH is worlds better than it used to be.
    someone can't read. He just said buying them from the AH is amazing compared to running around. His point about it effecting the 'feeling of community' is still valid.

  11. #131
    Now:
    - You don't ever have to make friends with anyone (in an MMO) and can see all of the content), you never even have to be invited to a group (besides arenas)
    - Rewards from questing and 5 mans are worthless, since the stuff in LFR is much easier to obtain and requires little effort
    - You can afk almost any content outside of flex or higher modes of raiding
    - If someone ganks you, you go on the forums to complain about it
    - You can see everything in less than a week


    Back then:

    - You had to socialize, you likely needed help with at least *some* quests, and you likely made friends along the way and could help them with their quests
    - Rewards were much more rare, and you had a reason to grind out in some areas for a particular item you liked, even from stuff like questing
    - There was a level of accountabiity, you couldn't just afk content and get rewarded
    - If someone ganks you, you gank them back or ask a buddy for help
    - You never really ran out of content

  12. #132
    because the game was different and the world was smaller and everyone was typically around the same level with new players coming in all the time and lots of kind of obvious reasons idk why you didnt think of them yourself.

  13. #133
    New, fresh and lack of the toxic community present today.

  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Morhaime, Chilton, and others at Blizzard said otherwise. They would know, so stop it with the well-debunked bullshit, mkay?
    Oh, they said it was hard, you could also say that pushups are hard.

    It wasn't hard. Mkay, if it was "Hard" you had no friends to play with. I'm guessing you dont

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by Pandapuncher View Post
    Oh, they said it was hard, you could also say that pushups are hard.

    It wasn't hard. Mkay, if it was "Hard" you had no friends to play with. I'm guessing you dont
    What is your definition of "hard", if I may ask? My definition is "too difficult for the audience it has". And Cataclysm's initial end game was definitely that. Chilton came out and said in the NY Times that attempting to make the game more hardcore failed (not just the way they attempted it, but the very idea of making it more hardcore.)

    It's etched in stone now at Blizzard that early Cataclysm was too hard. Example, recent tweet from Watcher:

    https://twitter.com/WatcherDev/statu...17718469001216

    "Honestly, by not overtuning our dungeons and entry-level raid content. That was a clear mistake in Cata."
    Last edited by Osmeric; 2014-05-13 at 12:41 AM.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on." -- Ghostcrawler
    "Do you want a game with no casuals so about 500 players?"

  16. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Souflikar View Post
    New, fresh and lack of the toxic community present today.
    this and everyone literaly sucked at game at that time (and those who claim that they didnt suck just lie) - after few years of playing some players developed some really good skills and since nobody give fuck about those they decided that if they will treat eveyrone else like shit maybe someone will finally pay atention to them - nobody still does but they are not stopin, that' why all those "scrubs/retards" are flying in eveyr direction in lfr/flex

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Impossible? No, of course not.
    Good thing nobody was saying that.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on." -- Ghostcrawler
    "Do you want a game with no casuals so about 500 players?"

  18. #138
    I had more fun in Vanilla as well. I quit after Cata, since Cata was... CataSTROPHIC! teehee ^_^

    Ok seriously though I liked Vanilla better only because it was new, all my friends were playing, it was the first mmo I had ever played, it was an amazing experience exploring that huge open world with all these beautiful colors and magic and shit.

    I know the game has changed a TON, but if I were to find myself coming back it would be for a couple reasons.
    If:
    1) They got rid of flying mounts, and made it so ground mounts were faster. (150-200%) To encourage world PvP.
    2) World bosses. Do they have them in MOP? IDK all I know is world bosses were the shit in classic. So much world pvp because of those. And they were quite fun. Any excuse to get out in the real world with some friends and slay a dragon.
    "Grammar is important. Capitalization is the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse & helping your uncle jack off a horse."

  19. #139
    Deleted
    I played WoW from 2005 to the end of WOTLK in 2010. That was a good solid 5 years of my life.

    Vanilla WoW - despite all its fault - was an amazing game when it came out. Leveling the 1st time to 60 was nostalgia in its own.

    Burning Crusade was where WoW was at its highest peek and I changed servers and raided in a top 20 guild from the very start all the through all the hard content (BWL, Sunwell) at the end.

    WOTLK was a good expansion as well, but its really when they started dumbing down on everything. By the end of WOTLK I just got tired of the same old formula of raiding every night.

  20. #140
    Dreadlord Captainn's Avatar
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    I'd say because people queue for EVERYTHING now. There's no real movement. Even the damn raid is 30 feet from either shrine.

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