1. #1981
    Banned Kellhound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctd123 View Post
    Hence why no one would ever directly skirmish so fuck who has the better plane/boat. The argument going on is pretty much 'my dad will beat up your dad'

    Yup, Germany can ensure energy security by being buddies with Russia.
    That is a false premise, there are many ways the two could fight short, sharp conflicts without going nuclear.

  2. #1982
    Over 9000! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctd123 View Post
    Looks like there is alot of movement towards bypassing the Dollar. Looks like Russia and China are starting to take shots at U.S. financial hegemony, (but its minimal so far) but obviously they can't go wholescale since it would be to damaging and costly currently. The real test is if people outside of China and Russia start trading with the renminbi, thats when the US should worry.
    That direction is certainly being pursued.
    Putin Flushes the US Dollar: Russia’s Gold Ruble Payments System Delinked from Dollar?
    Dollar no longer primary oil currency as China begins to sell oil using Yuan
    Shanghai to host China International Payments System
    Putin vows to build Russian rival to Visa and MasterCard
    America's actions over Ukraine are only pushing events in that direction harder and faster.
    "In today’s America, conservatives who actually want to conserve are as rare as liberals who actually want to liberate. The once-significant language of an earlier era has had the meaning sucked right out of it, the better to serve as camouflage for a kleptocratic feeding frenzy in which both establishment parties participate with equal abandon" (Taking a break from the criminal, incompetent liars at the NSA, to bring you the above political observation, from The Archdruid Report.)

  3. #1983
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    That is a false premise, there are many ways the two could fight short, sharp conflicts without going nuclear.
    Yeah you can stay atomic or even molecular.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  4. #1984
    Banned Kellhound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Yeah and then Soviets invented a next generation tank that everyone else used as template later, starting with Germans themselves.
    Except that Germany did not have near the advantage over the USSR as NATO has against Russia. Apples to oranges.
    And it was far more than just a tank that caused Germany to lose, starting with General Winter.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Yeah, and when I said I had a PC - i didn't mean I had an American PC either - I had a proper Soviet PC. I also had spectrum (which was inferior). But then in 1990s Intel happened.
    Soviet PC... wasn't the abacus actually invented in about 2700BC?

  5. #1985
    Pandaren Monk Darkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    This is a great example of Skroesec's inherent bias. If something is American, but not working well, be it a new fighter, missile defense, or the space program (to draw from recent threads on this forum), it's "no problem, just teething problems, we'll have that perfected real soon". But if something from one of America's antagonists has a virtually identical set of problems, then, "it's crap, country X is useless, no one can ever match America at anything, etc". Much like American foreign policy, where the endless claims of "freedom & democracy" run into the equally endless support for dictators, overthrowing governments, and killing civilians; the sheer mass of the cognitive dissonance eventually gets to a point where nothing they say can be taken seriously.
    This, and few of other Skro's gems, lead me to believe that "he" is actually Jen Psaki.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Except that Germany did not have near the advantage over the USSR as NATO has against Russia. Apples to oranges.
    And it was far more than just a tank that caused Germany to lose, starting with General Winter.
    Because russians do not feel cold. I wish people would stop using this idiotic line.

  6. #1986
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkis View Post
    This, and few of other Skro's gems, lead me to believe that "he" is actually Jen Psaki.



    Because russians do not feel cold. I wish people would stop using this idiotic line.
    They would stop using it if it wasn't true....
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I'd never compare him to Hitler, Hitler was actually well educated, and by all accounts pretty intelligent.

  7. #1987
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkis View Post
    This, and few of other Skro's gems, lead me to believe that "he" is actually Jen Psaki.



    Because russians do not feel cold. I wish people would stop using this idiotic line.
    The Soviets were prepared for winter, the Germans were not. It played a significant part in their defeat.

  8. #1988
    Pandaren Monk Darkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tierbook View Post
    They would stop using it if it wasn't true....
    Another great mind at work...

    Yes, meet your average russian:

    THE SECRET IS OUT!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    The Soviets were prepared for winter, the Germans were not. It played a significant part in their defeat.
    Then i guess that most of those who died during the siege of Leningrad were casualties of friendly frost-fire.
    Last edited by Darkis; 2014-06-10 at 09:31 PM.

  9. #1989
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    Back in the 1980s our country was making PCs. The industry was employing around 300 000 people and making 40% of all PCs sold in the Soviet economic space. Now we don't make anything...
    My mother was working as a computer programmer (what's that, you mean they knew computers in a "SOVIET" STATE???). We were able to buy Atari 800XE without any problems (to those claiming there was no western tech in our countries).

    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    This is a great example of Skroesec's inherent bias. If something is American, but not working well, be it a new fighter, missile defense, or the space program (to draw from recent threads on this forum), it's "no problem, just teething problems, we'll have that perfected real soon". But if something from one of America's antagonists has a virtually identical set of problems, then, "it's crap, country X is useless, no one can ever match America at anything, etc". Much like American foreign policy, where the endless claims of "freedom & democracy" run into the equally endless support for dictators, overthrowing governments, and killing civilians; the sheer mass of the cognitive dissonance eventually gets to a point where nothing they say can be taken seriously.

    Ukraine and Syria really drives that home. Ukraine: president of questionable legitimacy uses military against own citizens. Result: Elections praised, president supported, civilian deaths ignored, aid to rebels condemned. Syria: President of questionable legitimacy uses military against own citizens. Result: Elections condemned, president damned, civilian deaths lamented, rebels are given aid. It's not that I don't understand the realpolitick motivations of the U.S. government (although I greatly disagree with them and question their rationality), but that the radiant levels of hypocrisy takes them so far from any pretense of credibility and that they're entering the realm of black comedy.
    It's really funny. Not only Ukrainian/Syrian presidents, but:
    -Kosovo and South Sudan have a right of self-determination, but not Crimea or Donbass - everything is rigged
    -when civilians are being slaughtered in Libya and Syria, fuck national sovereignty, we need military interventions, but if it's in Ukraine, we need to protect national sovereignty and slaughter "terrorists"
    -if someone causes deaths of civilians, they're calling for International Criminal Court, but not if they do cause deaths of hundreds of thousands civilians
    -the US meddling in the internal affairs of another country is good, Russians doing it - bad

  10. #1990
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkis View Post
    This, and few of other Skro's gems, lead me to believe that "he" is actually Jen Psaki.

    Because russians do not feel cold. I wish people would stop using this idiotic line.
    On a side note, he has a wildcard with the mods here. Only if he threatens me with physical harm he gets an infraction, but his continuously nation bashing is being unpunished all the time. Same with a lot of the other (especially US) posters. Better I get out of here because moderation of this thread is a joke.

  11. #1991
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkis View Post
    Another great mind at work...

    Yes, meet your average russian:

    THE SECRET IS OUT!
    Wow, just wow....

  12. #1992
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Except that Germany did not have near the advantage over the USSR as NATO has against Russia.
    Yes it did, after conquering almost all of Europe.
    Also Russia today is not that weak as it was pre-WW2.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Apples to oranges.
    That's what she said
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    And it was far more than just a tank that caused Germany to lose, starting with General Winter.
    Haha, they were losing to Winter for 5 years? You do know that "Russian" winters (which are no different from European or North American winters) do not last 5 years, right?
    Blitzkrieg was stopped before winter, anyway. Do you even know why Germans HAD to deal with winter (the first at least)? Russians STOPPED THEIR ADVANCE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Soviet PC... wasn't the abacus actually invented in about 2700BC?
    Palms have evolved billions of years ago, mate.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  13. #1993
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Also Russia today is not that weak as it was pre-WW2.
    It wasnt actually _weak_, it was unpreparated.

  14. #1994
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elezor View Post
    It wasnt actually _weak_, it was unpreparated.
    No, it was weak and unprepared.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Yes it did, after conquering almost all of Europe.
    Also Russia today is not that weak as it was pre-WW2.

    That's what she said

    Haha, they were losing to Winter for 5 years? You do know that "Russian" winters (which are no different from European or North American winters) do not last 5 years, right?
    Blitzkrieg was stopped before winter, anyway. Do you even know why Germans HAD to deal with winter (the first at least)? Russians STOPPED THEIR ADVANCE.


    Palms have evolved billions of years ago, mate.


    Not sure how that is before Winter. Since it's a little small the light Green is gains made up to December 5th....
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I'd never compare him to Hitler, Hitler was actually well educated, and by all accounts pretty intelligent.

  16. #1996
    Banned Kellhound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Yes it did, after conquering almost all of Europe.
    Also Russia today is not that weak as it was pre-WW2.

    That's what she said

    Haha, they were losing to Winter for 5 years? You do know that "Russian" winters (which are no different from European or North American winters) do not last 5 years, right?
    Blitzkrieg was stopped before winter, anyway. Do you even know why Germans HAD to deal with winter (the first at least)? Russians STOPPED THEIR ADVANCE.


    Palms have evolved billions of years ago, mate.
    Not really. Russia is much weaker today than in 1939 compared to what they are "potentially" facing.

    Winter around Moscow is worse than winter in most populated regions of Western Europe or North America. And I can tell you that people not used to -20 have issues, and that weapons and gear not designed for that temp have issues.
    Blitzkrieg bogged down, and then the issues with the German Army became well shown. By time winter was over the dynamics had changed. More about the issues with German High Command than Russian fighting ability.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    No, it was weak and unprepared.
    Unprepared, and suffering from Stalin's stupidity, but not weak really.

    In June 1939 Germany had a total troop strength of ~3.8 million, Russia ~5.5 million. Germany= ~4300 tanks, USSR= ~15,000, Germany= ~4300 planes, USSR ~11000 combat ready planes.
    Last edited by Kellhound; 2014-06-10 at 10:09 PM.

  17. #1997
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tierbook View Post
    Not sure how that is before Winter. Since it's a little small the light Green is gains made up to December 5th....
    That's because it's practically half a year from the beginning of the invasion. Do you know why it took so long? Longer (way longer) than PLANNED by Germans?
    Germans began having troubles in September, by which they planned to capture Moscow. Winter came when they were at Moscow. And winter in Moscow that early is not that cold - it's basically the same as in Berlin.

    The point is - they planned to do it sooner, but failed. Operation Barbarossa was a failure. And no not because of winter. But because of overconfidence. Read diaries of German officers.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  18. #1998
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    That's because it's practically half a year from the beginning of the invasion. Do you know why it took so long? Longer (way longer) than PLANNED by Germans?
    Germans began having troubles in September, by which they planned to capture Moscow. Winter came when they were at Moscow. And winter in Moscow that early is not that cold - it's basically the same as in Berlin.

    The point is - they planned to do it sooner, but failed. Operation Barbarossa was a failure. And no not because of winter. But because of overconfidence. Read diaries of German officers.
    The reason is because Barbarossa started later than planned, thanks to the Italians.
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I'd never compare him to Hitler, Hitler was actually well educated, and by all accounts pretty intelligent.

  19. #1999
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Not really. Russia is much weaker today than in 1939 compared to what they are "potentially" facing.
    That's some unfounded bullshit.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Winter around Moscow is worse than winter in most populated regions of Western Europe or North America.
    Wha?? Where did you get that nonsense?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    And I can tell you that people not used to -20 have issues
    in early December? Gettoutahere. -10 maximum. MAXIMUM, i,e, MINIMUM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kellhound View Post
    Unprepared, and suffering from Stalin's stupidity, but not weak really.
    Stain was anything but stupid.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tierbook View Post
    The reason is because Barbarossa started later than planned, thanks to the Italians.
    Nope. That doesn't explain why they advanced so slow.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  20. #2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post

    Nope. That doesn't explain why they advanced so slow.
    Well the invasion started in June, a little over a month after the planned start date, and by October the tanks were slowed down due to mud. Mud would still be an issue for any invasion of Russia today attacking the far eastern parts of Russia. Just look at the Kolyma highway at certain times of the year its almost impossible to traverse.
    Quote Originally Posted by Connal View Post
    I'd never compare him to Hitler, Hitler was actually well educated, and by all accounts pretty intelligent.

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