Would this make Rune of Power more tolerable for you?

[Hasted]

So the complaint is it causes them to have to have a thought out plan where to put 1 of 2 runes.

Gotcha.

This is rarely a viable option. For this to be effective we would need to move between 2 specific points within a set interval (1min on live.) Unfortunately there are few fights where we can both accurately predict within 8 yards where we need to move and justify spending 2 casts on RoP. There is a point where casting RoP (and even Invocation for that matter) is not worthwhile because extra spells cast at the boss outweigh the 15% damage increase.

Taking a fight like Heroic Seigecrafter for example there are events which can cause you to move that occur more than once every 30 seconds, which puts you at an extreme disadvantage if you are using RoP. This wouldn't be an issue if other talents were viable, but for Arcane on live this is not the case. The issue is that if RoP ends up being that much stronger than the other talents in the tier we will be essentially forced into that situation.

That being said I doubt that RoP will be optimal in most cases. If I had to guess it will be tuned to yield slightly more damage with 100% uptime in scenarios with low or micro movement.

[Pyromelter]

Celestalon has already said IF was "too good" in comparison. They didn't do a number's pass on this, yet.

This is exactly what happened with incanter's ward and it got nerfed into uselessness.

So the complaint is it causes them to have to have a thought out plan where to put 1 of 2 runes.

Gotcha.

The complaint is that it is a maintenance buff that is far more restrictive, annoying, and frankly unfun than any other class ability or talent in the game. I'm guessing the sarcasm in the response probably won't win anyone over who revile this talent.

[Shangalar]

Siegecrafter is the only fight on which RoP placement annoys me, but on heroic difficulty the Empowered Electromagnet pulls you back and forth within the scope of one Rune, you don't even need two. You just position yourself away from the sawblades. My guild is currently working on Siegecrafter heroic and after some wipes the Rune stopped being a problem.

Ever since they increased its effect radius it's become a non-issue. As I said before, I voted that I'd like it more if it were instant cast because that would for me be the greatest quality improvement for it. Other than that, I have no issues.

That being said, I don't like the fact that I had to use the Rune all of this expansion as the only choice, primarily because of mana management. Putting all math and numbers aside, would you guys really find it so difficult to use the current Rune of Power on a few fights per tier that are mostly stationary and one of the other talents on fights that are not mostly stationary?

[gallamann]

Shang, if I am reading your question right, in that world RoP would be like MI in raids, in that there would be 1-2 fights per tier where it was optimal.

On the flip side, fights that have no "RNG make you move" are boring as shit, there is a reason you don't see Patchwerk anymore... its a damn snooze fest.

Overall I'd take a pass on that.

I think the real reason RoP exists and works for Arcane, is the mana component. Blizzard successfully tied the *turret* play style to a small area (rune) and rewarded said restrictions via the damage gains from Arcane Mastery by ensuring they always have >80% mana if within the rune. Without that gain, RoP just has no viability. How many skilled mages are going to put those restrictions on themselves, when instead they can use IF which removes the restrictions and currently will exceed damage that RoP provides.

RoP in MoP is forced gameplay for Arcane. Take away that mana, just how is Blizzard going to get people to use RoP?

What we who want RoP gone are saying is, the only option they have is to force play with it. This time it will be via the damage gain as there is no other means to force it. Once that happens, we have no choice, just like Arcane currently has no choice, it will be play with RoP or play another class.

[Pyromelter]

Ever since they increased its effect radius it's become a non-issue. As I said before, I voted that I'd like it more if it were instant cast because that would for me be the greatest quality improvement for it. Other than that, I have no issues.

That being said, I don't like the fact that I had to use the Rune all of this expansion as the only choice, primarily because of mana management. Putting all math and numbers aside, would you guys really find it so difficult to use the current Rune of Power on a few fights per tier that are mostly stationary and one of the other talents on fights that are not mostly stationary?

It's become a non-issue - to you. This is still the most reviled talent in the entire game for a wide swath of players. DK's whine about their level 90s, because they are jealous of the warlocks, rogues, shaman, warriors, and priests who all have really awesome level 90s. But no one points to any one level 90 talent and claims it to be as game-breakingly terrible as RoP.

In regards to not minding using RoP, there are only two fights I can think of that I could accept it on since 3.03 came out, that would be Patchwerk and Ultraxion, because on those two fights there is literally no movement. I can't even imagine some earlier fights with high movement with RoP, like Stone Guard Heroic, Tsulong, Lei Shi, Garalon.

In regards to forcing people into RoP, they had to do that, because virtually no one ever took RoP unless they were forced into it. Don't forget the whole Invo/haste thing, that only came about because people were trying to figure out how to play arcane without RoP. The fact they had to force people into it should be reason enough to get rid of it, and I am very fearful we are going to see a repeat of this, where everyone is willing to accept 1-5% less dps with IF or MI, and blizzard will nerf them into uselessness and force mages to stand on that damn rune. Very fearful of that happening. In fact, I pretty much expect that to happen. It's much more likely they will force mages to stand on RoP at this point than it is they will get rid of it.

[Norvak]

RoP is a horrible design. Change it to Mental Focus. While standing still for X seconds you focus your thoughts gaining x spell power

[Empath]

RoP is a horrible design. Change it to Mental Focus. While standing still for X seconds you focus your thoughts gaining x spell power

eh that's even worse in some regards. at least staying in the rune is easy when it comes to micro movement. this would punish ANY sort of movement, even a side step if i'm understanding you correctly.

[Norvak]

True it would, but I thought that is the whole point of RoP, to keep us as a stationary turret. Just thinking of a way to embrace the original purpose while keeping you from recasting constantly. IDK just take the whole thing out

[Mastamage]

True it would, but I thought that is the whole point of RoP, to keep us as a stationary turret. Just thinking of a way to embrace the original purpose while keeping you from recasting constantly. IDK just take the whole thing out

3 minute duration isn't very constant.

[Komil]

Make it instant cast, and add 5 sec duration each spell you cast Then its fine

[Elegiac]

No, get rid of it entirely.

- - - Updated - - -

eh that's even worse in some regards. at least staying in the rune is easy when it comes to micro movement. this would punish ANY sort of movement, even a side step if i'm understanding you correctly.

It would more than likely be like Sniper Training; standing still for X seconds gives you a Y second spellpower buff.

[Mastamage]

No, get rid of it entirely.

A little late for that.

[Elegiac]

A little late for that.

It's still alpha.

[Pyromelter]

It's still alpha.

I think he means that blizzard's design decision has been made, not that they can't change the talent. Unfortunately, I have to agree on mastamage on this one, there is absolutely no sign RoP is going anywhere except squarely to the collective private areas of the mage collective.

[MatadorMedia]

All the level 90 talents for Mages are awful. They're the reason I dislike playing on a Mage at all.

[Florena]

Considering all the talent rework already done for us, essentially redoing two tiers worth except for RoP staying plus a few other changes, I'm not expecting them to remove RoP at this stage, especially with WoD already delayed. But maybe some tweaks could still be made.

[Nerfgun]

Considering all the talent rework already done for us, essentially redoing two tiers worth except for RoP staying plus a few other changes, I'm not expecting them to remove RoP at this stage, especially with WoD already delayed. But maybe some tweaks could still be made.

As a level 90 mage that raided with arcane in the beginning of SoO, I can see where a lot of the frustration lies. I also agree with Malzra here, but anything can happen in the future.

I would like to point out one thing that many of you seem to forget about arcane and RoP. You're force to choose RoP because of the Arcane Mastery. It's as simple as that. Arcane definitely hits like a truck if played correctly just as the other 2 specs, but it pulls ahead in the end. Fire is extremely mobile. Frost can be just as mobile if played correctly. You're planted in place for arcane because of the mastery. Incanter's Ward cant give you enough mana and damage increase and Invocation is useless because you would have to use it ever 4-5 casts. If you could have full mana and be 100% mobile I think arcane would be the best spec by miles unless they changed it to where you do have 100% mana full time but they just nerf your damage overall which is what Blizzard is doing anyways.

Now for WoD, the only other thing I can think of is the longer you stand still the greater the effect up to the proposed 30% and for every four steps (in any direction regardless if you go left and then right after) it reduce the effect by 5% so you can move around, but just not far. After you move you would have to stand still for 10-15 seconds before it would "reset" your position.
- OR -
it reduce the damage % based on long you have been moving so 1 step would be 4% reduction and then the more you move the more it reduce the damage increase It holds the same principle of restriction that RoP without having to cast anything.

The only issue I can find with my ideas are if blizzard can determine a "step" and then the affects of being gripped, blink, increase speed kick in. . . Just remember here if you want to do movements from where you were previous standing it would be difficult to program and would tax the game heavily. Such is the reason why I say steps regardless of direction, but even then that may still be just as taxing. . . /shrug

However, if RoP would remain as is, I would like to see it become an instant cast. Don't mind wasting a global at least, but then again it could be too strong? You use RoP on a location because you're going to stand there for 20-30 seconds (will be 3 minutes) and do increase damage. Don't expect to use RoP if you cant fathom the fact that you have to pre-plan where you're going to stand. Pray to RNGesus that you don't get hit by random selected stuff to avoid and hope people nearby don't either.

I'm not here to bash on anyone, but you chose arcane now for your reasons. Those reasons may be it's your favorite spec to play, or you don't like fire and frost. . . but don't blame it because it's the bleeding edge DPS that you have to be. That's your choice. No one forced you to play arcane. Every spec has some sort of flaws. Don't expect that arcane is flawless. Arcane just happens to be the planted siege tank right now. It'll change in WoD to something else because RoP wont even give mana and neither will the other 2 talents in the 90 tier.

Side Note: The way I see the level 90 WoD talents now is RoP will be consistent damage, Mirror's Image will be huge burst, and Incanter's flow is small bursts every 10 seconds. I'm inclined to think that Mirror's Image will be the go to talent for most situations at least if you were to look at SoO.

- - - Updated - - -

... That's the whole point of my post, is that we COULD pre-cast it as we're getting there, if, y'know, the ability wasn't designed so terribly.

Um. . . . I dont mean to be a dick here or anything. . . but that's what Ice Floes can do. . . Just a thought I'd want to add after writing my huge essay. PoM is gone so you can do it with Fire. The only other reason to not use Ice Floes is Evanesce for multiple damage avoiding mechanics.

[Deleted]

I would prefer it to be gone, but in the worst case senario where we have to keep it I would like it to be instant with or without a global cooldown, thanks.