When Does Fire start to out dps Frost gear wise?

[Array x]

At what % crit or ilvl roughly does fire pull ahead of frost in terms of dps, thanks in advance.

[Squinty]

On most single target fights fire will pull in front even at lower ilvl so your question is bit hard to answer.

[durrtygoodz]

What a new and interesting question.

inb4 infraction: it's not a clear cut answer and there's not a magic ilvl or crit % that says you should change spec

[mrgreenthump]

What a new and interesting question.

inb4 infraction: it's not a clear cut answer and there's not a magic ilvl or crit % that says you should change spec

I know it gets tiring, but 1 can't expect people to automaticly know everything..


That being said though, this question does pop up here a lot.. And for the most part there just is no clear answer. It all depends on the fight, your gear, your guild, your tactics.. Everything really. That again is the cause of the specs being so close to each other nowdays, you really don't pick them for pure dps anymore, you pick them for their strenghts and playstyle. If you like fire the most, you should just pick it and play it. Progression for the most part is done now, sure some guilds still are doing some, but for the most part DPS will not a problem.

So in short: The specs are so close, that as long as you got high enough secondaries.. Pick any spec your like the most.

[Hasted]

I'm not sure that Fire ever actually outperforms Frost. It has the potential to with the RNG swings but on average I feel Frost performs better.

You're going to do better in whatever spec you're more comfortable with. Don't expect to be able to switch specs and magically pull bigger numbers.

[Deleted]

Go with the spec u like more. Its more depended how u play the specs then how high is the theoretical dps.

[LocNess]

As many have said, you are going to pull better numbers with the spec you are most skilled at and enjoy most. If you are equally skilled at all, on average Fire will probably start outperforming Frost ~570 ilevel, however that can change depending on fights. This tier it really is just best to play the spec you enjoy the most.

[Deleted]

a) Fight by fight basis. An example is that on Thok you should get more dps off, but on Nazgrim frost is king.
b) Gear Itemization. For example my gear is mostly Haste - Hit, Haste - Mastery items. Reforging only get's a percentage of the desired stat into what you want. In my particular situation Fire is always going to be lower than frost, as I would struggle to even reach 45% Crit. If you have to gem/reforge into crit in many pieces of your gear, then it's not worth the swap.

[Deleted]

at 15k+ crit rating should be fire consistent enough to outperform frost in most situations

to Hasted: good joke... with more crit comes consitency and as i said with 15k+ crit rating fire outperform frost in most situations - 25m (ofc if your skill is +- same in both specializations - if you try fire on one raid than you have no chance to outperform spec you are playing for the last year!)

[Deleted]

at 15k+ crit rating should be fire consistent enough to outperform frost in most situations

to Hasted: good joke... with more crit comes consitency and as i said with 15k+ crit rating fire outperform frost in most situations - 25m (ofc if your skill is +- same in both specializations - if you try fire on one raid than you have no chance to outperform spec you are playing for the last year!)

In some fight Fire outperforms the other two specs, in other fights Frost outperforms the other two specs and in some fights Arcane outperforms the other two specs. It all depends on your itemization.

[Hasted]

at 15k+ crit rating should be fire consistent enough to outperform frost in most situations

to Hasted: good joke... with more crit comes consitency and as i said with 15k+ crit rating fire outperform frost in most situations - 25m (ofc if your skill is +- same in both specializations - if you try fire on one raid than you have no chance to outperform spec you are playing for the last year!)

To my experience high crit levels don't fix the problem well enough. Going 5-6 Fireballs without critting with +60% buffed crit rating is pretty terrible. And don't get me started on trinket procs, which are a bit more important for Fire as well.

[Deleted]

Short answer: Depends on the fight. You need 4pc, and at least 15k+ crit. Preferably 17k+ Having at least 10k haste helps a lot.

Slightly longer answer: It depends on what you're best at, what you're most comfortable with, and the fight. The opener is very important for fire, meaning, if you mess the opener up or RNG screws you over, you will be far behind others for at least the first 2 minutes or so of the fight. Not having PBOI proc or getting a fireball crit within the first couple of seconds of an encounter is devestating for your DPS, especially on short kill times. To counter this, you want at least like 15-17k+ crit, t16 4pc, and like 10k+ haste. Even then, especially on really long fights, frost is still very competitive to fire, assuming equal skill of both specs.

Choose what you're best at playing, the difference of DPS is extremely close barring certain fight mechanics. Until you reach like 580 ilvl, I wouldnt worry about your spec. After this, fire and arcane are both better than frost in most scenarios. Arcane slowly scaling ahead of fire the higher in the 580s you get.

[Deleted]

again

at 15k+ crit rating should be fire consistent enough to outperform frost in most situations

if somebody want to respec on every fight than it is their choice but we are looking for best overall spec - best for most situations (and that is arcane )

[Vakna]

Technically Frost is superior to Fire at all gear levels, in practical fights though, things tend to swing in Fire's favor mostly.

[Shangalar]

Unless you get very lucky with crit drops and suck at haste drops, fire outperforms frost around item level 612 in T16. Though it's kind of hsrd to reach that item level, what with 588 being max and all. Don't mind me, I'm just passing through after too many beers.

[Lobstarrr]

I wouldn't take any advice from a guy that can't stop dps on Nazgrim during defensive stance though.

[Nissinn]

I wouldn't take any advice from a guy that can't stop dps on Nazgrim during defensive stance though.

Maybe a healer paid him off to not be so bored and nothing to do

[fearist]

You know in some guild that are good they just dps through that phase right?

[durrtygoodz]

I wouldn't take any advice from a guy that can't stop dps on Nazgrim during defensive stance though.

This is a joke right?

[Akraen]

Unless you get very lucky with crit drops and suck at haste drops, fire outperforms frost around item level 612 in T16. Though it's kind of hsrd to reach that item level, what with 588 being max and all. Don't mind me, I'm just passing through after too many beers.

Mod post of the year right here. Hahaha <3