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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Chickat View Post
    I used to think that, but looking back
    But looking back, you are affected by nostalgia. Cataclysm was a -terrible- expansion.

  2. #42
    Cataclysm ruined Azeroth.

  3. #43
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    Cata was really good aqt the start (they way they handled the levelling zones were a little off) but the difficulties of the 5 mans and the raids were great. That was until they caved and gave into the player whining it was too hard and toward the end of FL we got a constant stream of nerfs and DS was a bit lackluster.

    Also troll dungeons although really good in difficulty and entertainment had boring re used themes.

  4. #44
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    Cataclysm started very well and in fact T11 is my favorite Tier of all time.

    But Cataclysm was a disaster at the end.

    SoO > DS by a VERY VERY big margin.
    Last edited by mmoc3dde1cb131; 2014-06-06 at 09:32 AM.

  5. #45
    Merely a Setback breadisfunny's Avatar
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    your right it was even worse than we thought.
    r.i.p. alleria. 1997-2017. blizzard ruined alleria forever. blizz assassinated alleria's character and appearance.
    i will never forgive you for this blizzard.

  6. #46
    I am Murloc! Velshin's Avatar
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    Cataclysm is the worst WoW expansion in my personal opinion here is the main reasons why:

    1- Flying mount at the very start of the expansion which made the world seems very small and almost trivial questing overall.

    2- Overpowered guards that can almost one shot you which made world pvp almost none existed and made of the horde/alliance achievement harder to get.

    3- Using legendaries in arena and pvp made things even more unbalanced (Legendary daggers + Staff).

    4- after you hit max lvl you can almost have zero interaction with the world around you where you just simply que for dungeon or LFR or arena and that's it..some people even started to call it world of que craft instead of world of warcraft.

    5- Blizzard used like 70% of their resources and power to redo the old world which made the max lvl content very lacking. Like the patch 4.1 where we only got two 5 man dungeons and one of these dungeons is almost exactly the same as the old one (ZA).

    6- Dragonsoul raid is one of the worst raids ever even worse than ToC in my personal opinion.
    Last edited by Velshin; 2014-06-06 at 09:52 AM.

  7. #47
    No, it was a wonderful expansion for leveling. I don't agree with anyone who thinks it didn't increase or make the experience faster / better. That being said, I do miss a lot of the old zones and wish there was some way to still play them (Besides p.servers). At the same token though, it took A LOT of time and effort from end-game, so there wasn't as much as there should be. But I thought the difficulty (Bar a few cheap ass mechanics) were really well done in release.

    The troll dungeon patch was fine, but it was over-tuned like all hell and I'm sure anyone around that level who tries to attempt it will still have a hard ass time finishing it. But I guess that's part of the fun, trying to over-come the stat-buffed content. Regardless, I thought the expansion wasn't terrible and much better until 4.3. The addition of LFR, complete face roll status once more, and a half-baked raid left much to be desired. The dungeon were fantastic though, they were quite unique and fun; however easy it was compared to the rest of the expansion.

    I'm biased though, as is anyone else and their opinion; I stopped caring about WoW very seriously a few months after the final patch in Cataclysm. Mists of Pandaria did not interest me enough and that is partially to blame for the art choice this time around. None the less, I'm not sure which I'd rank higher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    ...some people even started to call it world of que craft instead of world of warcraft.
    This has been around since WotLK, hasn't left the game yet.
    Last edited by PenguinChan; 2014-06-06 at 09:39 AM.

  8. #48
    Banned Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chickat View Post
    Thoughts?
    BC > Cata > Wrath > MoP > Vani

    after you hit max lvl you can almost have zero interaction with the world around you where you just simply que for dungeon or LFR or arena and that's it..some people even started to call it world of que craft instead of world of warcraft.
    yeah, because this isn't a problem in mists of pandaria

  9. #49
    The problem with Cata is that while it had some good things about it, it also had some thing about it that still is causing problems for them.

    Harder Heroics was nice, but after coming out of Wrath its not what most people were expecting. They didn't do anything to prepare people for needing to CC again, having threat matter again, and having healers not be able to save bad play. They just threw players in it, and then were shocked when people weren't happy about it.

    10/25 man loot being shared just completely killed the more casual, just have some fun with friends raiding that had happened in WotLK. My guild who had been together since Vanilla, just completely died, and I don't mean slowly, it was just * poof* dead. We had to go back to telling really nice people who weren't great players that they weren't good enough. Basically many guilds just folded rather than tell their friends that, the ones that were good enough pretty much went on to other guilds ( like myself). This created a problem in that the number of people raiding dropped, so to justify the content creation they came up with LFR, and it is still creating problems.

    Lack of content towards the end was just bad for everyone, non-raiders included. Then you throw in the fact that leveling was even more of a joke than it was in WotLK, and there just wasn't anything to hold people. It got old quickly.

    Cata very much reminds me of Vanilla when people talk about " how good it was", it is heavily biased by the old tinted glasses to have that view. Thats not to say that neither of them didn't have good things about them, people just tend to try and latch on to those things and forget the bad.

    I've played every version of this game and for me it is WotLK > TBC > MoP> Vanilla > Cata. And TBH I think if MoP hadn't been saddled with the left over crap of Cata creating far too easy heroics and then LFR it could of easily been equal to TBC or Wrath. I would love to know where this game would be had they left heroics harder, left the raiding style we had in WotLK, and then added the good things they did add with Cata. Call me crazy but I think the sub slide would of been far far less than we have seen over the last few years.

  10. #50
    I am Murloc! Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PenguinChan View Post


    This has been around since WotLK, hasn't left the game yet.
    Yeah but in Cata it was even worse because with the addition of LFR and almost nothing to do at max lvl compare to Wotlk.

  11. #51
    Cataclysm is bad and not even nostalgia will help me look more positive towards it, it did so many things wrong. And Blizzard paid the price by losing 3-4 million subs.

    - Flying at the very start was an awful idea. I'm pro-flying but you don't need to enable it when you quest for the first time, it made the world look very small and you completed your quests way to fast.
    - Raids were boring and uninspired. How did we even know Nefarian got revived? How did we know of Blackwing Descent? What did Al'Akir ever do to us? Who was he anyway?
    - Linear questing, most notably in Hyjal were your just following a rails without leaving the track much. Again makes the world feel small
    - Dungeons were long and tedious, I did like the difficulty. But most 5-man bosses were also really annoying to fight, like Corla and Ozruk
    - Lore was at its complete worst, in all of the Warcraft franchise. Deathwing was a herp derp smash villain, Thrall was green Jesus saving the world... so dumb
    - Zones were scattered all over the place and barely had any connection. Makes this ''expansion'' feel more like a giant patch
    - Tol'Barad SUCKED
    - Abyssal Maw and War of the Ancients both scrapped for a recycled ZA/ZG
    - Dragon Soul is the worst raid ever, and we had that for 8 months without any new content

    I can go on forever but so far these are the main reasons.

  12. #52
    I forgot they actually scrapped two raids in Cata, one just gone and the other turned into heroics. Its no wonder Cata felt so content light at the end.

  13. #53
    I am Murloc! Velshin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    BC > Cata > Wrath > MoP > Vani



    yeah, because this isn't a problem in mists of pandaria
    Yes it still existed in MoP but let us be honest in MoP there are more stuff to do than in Cata (Talking about max lvl here) because there are a lot of stuff to do like exploration and farming crystals for the Alani mount for example.

  14. #54
    It was on the right track, but two stuffs plagued the expansion.

    - Not enough content (which was probably due to badly needed 1-60 revamp)
    - Difficulty (Many people were denied content)

    Hopefully Warlords seem to be that Cata should have been. They are fixing the weaknesses while doing what is necessary for improving the game.
    Last edited by PrairieChicken; 2014-06-06 at 09:56 AM.
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    I do not need to be constructive in this thread, nor provide an argument. There is nothing here to actually debate. Your reasoning is flawed and thusly you have no argument.
    ↑ Epitome of Internet Logic

  15. #55
    The Lightbringer Highlord Hanibuhl's Avatar
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    So much wasted potential. I cringe every time I have to level through cataclysm.

    - I loved the worgen, but their starting-zone was short and they were neglected after it. Also, the Horde got the bigger half of the worgen-quests.
    - I liked the goblins, but what was up with their accents?
    - Uldum looked and felt awesome, but the whole Indiana Jones-questchain (as much of an Indy-fan I am), was such a cheesy ripoff
    - Too much was copied instead of inspired. Think Egypt
    - The Ramkahen did not have voices or sounds... what the hell!
    - Waaaaaaaay too much Twilight spirals
    - Way too less influence of other races
    - Old zones were ruined because of the cataclysm-refurbish
    - The color-scheme of Hyjal was absurdly bad
    - Firelands has atmosphere and story, but it was super short
    - Too many stories were neglected and never continued...

  16. #56
    Banned Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    Yes it still existed in MoP but let us be honest in MoP there are more stuff to do than in Cata (Talking about max lvl here) because there are a lot of stuff to do like exploration and farming crystals for the Alani mount for example.
    really?

    because i haven't been back to the timless isle since i did the grind to get my cloak (which was the day of the patch)

    i haven't killed ordos once. i'm almost never far from a capital city. the only things that have pulled me from a capital city and and an endless amount of queue times are challenge modes, rare spawn hunting, raiding, and the world pvp you only experience at the start of an expansion.

    I loved pretty much everything about cataclysm sans dragon soul. I was always doing something at that time.

  17. #57
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    Cata was indeed bad. Where to start...
    - horrible tuning problems in 10man heroic modes that haven't been fixed for months
    - I didn't like Firelands. Ryolith is probably one of the shittiest bosses ever. I didn't really like the others either.
    - I had to stop raiding but looking at DS I don't mind at all. Horrible bosses, rehashed maps and models all along.
    - Heroic Deadmines. Before nerf. In a PUG. Need I say more?
    - redone and rebalanced old world, but you outlevel it and cannot play without skipping zones

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    really?

    because i haven't been back to the timless isle since i did the grind to get my cloak (which was the day of the patch)

    i haven't killed ordos once. i'm almost never far from a capital city. the only things that have pulled me from a capital city and and an endless amount of queue times are challenge modes, rare spawn hunting, raiding, and the world pvp you only experience at the start of an expansion.

    I loved pretty much everything about cataclysm sans dragon soul. I was always doing something at that time.
    I mean I understand not doing Timeless Isle, but not Ordos weekly? Heck the gear alone makes it worth the 5 minutes it takes to down him ( if that depending on group).

    What exactly were you doing at the end of Cata? Outside of raiding about the only thing worth doing was gearing up alts, everything else I had pretty much chewed through by that point. Heck I unsubbed during that time, and I had never done that before since I started back in Vanilla.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Chickat View Post
    Everyone calls it the worst expansion for the most part. I used to think that, but looking back, Cata only had 2 major issues. 1 was not enough raid bosses after tier 11, and number 2 is Dragonsoul being terrible. If tier 12 would have had 3 more bosses, and Dragonsoul hadn't been rushed it may have been one of the best. I used to think MoP was better by leaps and bounds, but now I think I can rank them about equall with MoP having a very slight lead.

    Imo, Wrath>MoP>Cata>TBC>Vanilla.

    Cata would have been better than MOP is dragonsoul hadn't sucked so much.

    Thoughts?
    That's probably from a raiding point of view, but overall Cata was simply not good enough in several branches.

    1. The new Cata leveling, while very well done in quests, had 2 serious problems: too much experience with professions and dungeons in EXP added and you simply leveled out of the zones before seeing the end of each created (great) questline. Furthermore players could no longer see quests more than 2 levels above theirs.

    This meant that players no longer could create their own quest challenges by going to lands where you could beat monsters 5 levels above your head.
    All 1-60 lvleling became too easy by this EXP change.
    Also the (end game) quest leveling in Cata from 80-85 was VERY liniair. If you skipped ONE quest you were sometimes stuck even.

    2. Cata lacked a new cohesive continent. Certainly in the end zones you jumped through portals everywhere which killed immersion of adventuring in Azeroth.

    3. There was also the nerving of healers at the start of Cata while GC thought he had to create more harder dungeons than WotlK. I remember every healer complained about his mana drain. While it was corrected after a few months, the damage was done. Not enough healers wanted to be the scape goat of every whipe.

    ---

    Anyway. Wotlk was simply EPIC. Best leveling, best Raid ever, great questlines to get some Legendary weapons. Awesome design and the ultimate story telling of THE Lich King. And I simply LOVED Wintergrasp: massive, thumbling walls, extreme hate between the 2 groups wanting to own the place... I think the sieges in Wintergrasp killed the RvR in Warhammer on line simply overnight when it came out.

    After the epic expansion of Wotlk both Cata and MoP were not in the same League. I think that MoP was too much from the original stories to catch on again.

    I think Vanilla and TBC were on par (first one everything was new and TBC had it all polished and right after a few months with Karazahn as THE starting Raid for most - even noobs), WotlK was simply the best and the last 2 expansions Blizzard was riding in automatic mode.

    Although TECHNICALLY MoP is far superior then ANY expansion like connected Realms/economies and phasing done right, etc...

    Let's hope WoD brings back the TBC feeling and Lore more close to Warcraft.

    ----

    Btw: Content was never the problem for retaining players. Ever since 2010 WoW suffered from new recruiting due to all these failed MMO's going free to play. It is very difficult to recruit new subscriptions when games are offered for free.
    Last edited by BenBos; 2014-06-06 at 10:30 AM.

  20. #60
    Anyone remember Tol barad when the defense only needed to zerg to win. I am unsure how that issue got past Holinka and his team.

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